February 2012 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] [Pharo-users] Who is using Fuel?

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Wed, Feb 29, 2012 at 4:24 AM, Yanni Chiu <yanni(a)rogers.com> wrote: > On 28/02/12 4:30 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > >> >> If I understand you correctly, then what you are talking about is not >> caching objects but rather lazy loading. You mean when Glorp lets some >> proxies of the loaded graph so that they can load the rest of the graph >> later on? >> > > Okay, the concept I meant is lazy loading using proxies. > heheheh ok, then we agree :) Indeed, it would be nice to have that. What I am not sure is how to decide when and where to cut the graph and let some proxies. > > So what is "object cache" - i.e. what concept did you have in mind, when I > used the term "object cache" earlier? > > some internal optimization commonly done by ORMs (like Glorp) where they have a cache in primary memory of objects which were recently asked/queriered. The idea is to avoid going to the disk to fetch the object. -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Feb. 29, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] [Pharo-users] Who is using Fuel?

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Norbert, On 28 Feb 2012, at 21:30, Norbert Hartl wrote: > The only limit that I tested is a maximum of threads of 1100 or 1400, can't remember right now. The image is stuck then. I know we are way off topic, but are you sure you were not running into some OS limit (max open files/sockets which is often 1024 at the user level) ? You can inspect the limits by doing: $ ulimit -Hn $ ulimit -Sn for the hard and soft limits Sven

Feb. 29, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Nautilus version 4.0.4

by laurent laffont

Hi Benjamin, I've worked with Nautilus and I like it. Several nice ideas to work faster. Good work ! Bugs: - Go in groups, select a class. Click Hierarchy, then Groups. The Hierarchy/Flat button state is wrong. - jump to test class not working (MNU) Suggestions: - we don't know if a test is running or finished. I would like some visual feedback. - history: I would like to go backward faster without tens of click. Something like a drop down history like in web browsers - I hardly see if I browse instance or class side. Maybe change class color/font would help. - In Amber commented classes have not the same font color. Easy to see which class to look at for documentation. - Right click on a class, Analyzing menu. Create inst var / Create initializer / Generate / Force generation... entries should better be in refactoring ? Cheers Laurent On Sun, Feb 26, 2012 at 6:28 PM, Benjamin < benjamin.vanryseghem.pharo(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi guys, > > I really want to thank you all for your feedbacks which give me the will > to always add cool features to Nautilus. > > Thanks to that, let me introduce the new stable version with some new > features: > > - better groups (now the granularity is method and no longer class) > - better algorithm for coloring protocols and methods > - more menu entries and shortcuts > - Monticello integration > - OCompletion integration > - a lot of new icons :) > > (and some cleans in the code but ^^) > > > Thanks every one for your good energy :) > > > Ben >

Feb. 29, 2012

[Pharo-project] 1.4 image

by Schwab,Wilhelm K

Sig, I might have succeeded in building an image. I had to proceed past a fair number of Seaside 2-3 related errors, but the bulk of my code appears to be loaded. Alien certainly seems to have been the problem. The version of Migrate I used is attached. What do you think? Bill

Feb. 29, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] [Pharo-users] Who is using Fuel?

by Yanni Chiu

On 28/02/12 4:30 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > If I understand you correctly, then what you are talking about is not > caching objects but rather lazy loading. You mean when Glorp lets some > proxies of the loaded graph so that they can load the rest of the graph > later on? Okay, the concept I meant is lazy loading using proxies. So what is "object cache" - i.e. what concept did you have in mind, when I used the term "object cache" earlier?

Feb. 29, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] [Pharo-users] Who is using Fuel?

by Yanni Chiu

On 28/02/12 6:20 PM, Norbert Hartl wrote: > > Uh, sorry for getting _slightly_ verbose and off-topic :) Thanks for the informative answer. It's good to learn how others tackle problems, and why they chose their solution.

Feb. 29, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Proposal: coverage tests

by Alexandre Bergel

> That is just AMAZINGLY COOL. I cannot believe we can do that in 5 lines of code. WOW. > Why nobody wrote a better test coverage report wich such backend? Alex, does you stuff do something with that? Hapao does not support statement coverage yet. We are currently working on it. We will announce it soon. Cheers, Alexandre -- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

Feb. 29, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] can this be done via modification to the Squeak/Pharo IDE?

by S Krish

We do need the spit n polish videos to project and go viral. Marketing Pharo..!.. I believe this is true marketing... Should appear as simple as these projects too, simple one pane view of code that does magic on the other.. Pharo can do more than this.. Eg: Pick morpho - physics , render the most beautiful morphs one can, then from one pane show the list of code, that modifies the state of morphs its animation from the other, map code lines to some of the interaction on the view when intervention is done there. May it not just be a update: / changed: pair to chain the two...? Code on left generates a singleton view on right and as you change code it reifies the objects on the right and vice-versa with this dependency hook I would release my experimental modules, that I will continue to work towards code perfection, but will highlight the fun, ease and blur this programming is hard for layperson aspect. This is more to do with the pattern of learning most people have. I would say a lot of marketing has already happened with Pharo video/ screencasts, its time some of the easy but its cool, with complete aesthetics factored in, is put out for the viral effect. I will work towards this.. ! On Wed, Feb 29, 2012 at 1:18 AM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > You mean to innovate on principle? I thought this is what Pharo is all > about :) > > Doru > > > On 28 Feb 2012, at 00:46, Lawson English wrote: > > > http://vimeo.com/36579366 > > > > Lawson > > > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > > "Some battles are better lost than fought." > > > > >

Feb. 29, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] [Pharo-users] Who is using Fuel?

by Norbert Hartl

Am 28.02.2012 um 22:09 schrieb Yanni Chiu: > On 28/02/12 3:30 PM, Norbert Hartl wrote: >> >> I'm sorry that's all. I just started to do deployments with pharo >> lately. I was doing everything in gemstone until 2 month ago. > > That's interesting. Have you moved everything to Pharo, or is some part still in GemStone? Can you outline why GemStone was not the better solution for your use case? (I suspect that your dataset was naturally partitioned on user boundaries). Sorry for the confusion. The part about pharo and gemstone was not referring to this project. Most of my projects run in GemStone and I'm quite satisified with it. I started this project in pharo because the main assets are http messaging and multiple long running processes. Basically the zinc components are available in GemStone, too. But they are neither well integrated nor up to date. Could be better but that isn't a show stopper. It's more the long running processes. In GemStone I would need to start a separate vm in the system that cares about the running processes. Then you need to work out a communication scheme between your seaside UI model and the service vm. I would do this just to store a lot of request/response (dumb) data inside GemStone. I was thinking about it and felt that it just does not fit GemStone that well. Last but not least I liked the idea to be forced to play with some of these modern storage systems. To me GemStone and a combination of pharo with mongo db are not competitors. I find them pretty orthogonal in use cases possible. On the one hand there is GemStone where you can have a huge object graph with all the flexibility we like so much. I use this for more complex and highly interlinked models. Externalization of objects always restrict you in this respect. GemStone is a centralized database but one that can be distributed. On the other hand pharo is more flexible and has the more modern tools. The pharo use case here is to start a couple of tens, hundreds,... of images that either collaborate directly or via a distributed storage. And pharo can scale vertical in machine size being used. I would like to use pharo on tiny machines and let them participate in all of this. In between those two there is magma and on another far end there is amber. I think I want all of them so I always have the right tool whatever use case there might appear on the next day. If we are talking about scale than as a conclusion I can say that: I love smalltalk because it scales in "things possible" Uh, sorry for getting _slightly_ verbose and off-topic :) Norbert

Feb. 28, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Do we have the new primitive?? [WAS] Re: IdentitySet but using #hash rather than #identityHash ?

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Levente Uzonyi <leves(a)elte.hu> wrote: > On Sat, 25 Feb 2012, Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > >> All I can say is that I am impressed by the numbers it is >> really much >> faster. >> I still don't understand why I send this email with a subject >> say >> IdentitySet because what I really need is a fast/large >> IdentityDictionary >> :( Anyway, there's a place where we can use this >> LargeIdentitySet in Fuel >> I think). >> >> So Levente, you say this is not possible to adapt this for >> dictionary? can >> we contact Eliot to provide such a primitive? >> >> >> As promised, I uploaded my LargeIdentityDictionary implementation to >> http://leves.web.elte.hu/**squeak/**LargeIdentityDictionary.st<http://leves.web.elte.hu/squeak/LargeIdentityDictionary.st>. >> The numbers will be a bit worse compared to LargeIdentitySet, because of >> the lack of the primitive, but it's still 2-3x faster than other solutions >> (IdentityDictionary, PluggableIdentityDictionary, subclassing, etc). I'm >> about to propose this primitive with other improvements on the vm-dev >> list. >> > > My proposals are still on the way. :) > > > >> >> Hi Eliot/Levente. What is the status of this? Do we have already the new >> primitive? If true, how can we adapt LargeIdentitySet to use such new >> primitive? >> > > AFAIK the new primitive is not implemented yet. Adding the primitive to > the interpreter VM is very easy, but it seems to be a lot more complicated > (to me) to add it to Cog, because the receiver can be a MethodContext which > needs special handling. > I'll rewrite both LargeIdentitySet and LargeIdentityDictionary when the > primitive is ready. > Thanks Levente. So we should wait Eliot. I will ping again in a couple of weeks/months ;) > > > Levente > > > >> Thanks! >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Levente >> >> >> thanks >> >> On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 3:28 PM, Levente Uzonyi <leves(a)elte.hu> >> wrote: >> >> On Fri, 16 Dec 2011, Henrik Sperre Johansen wrote: >> >> On 16.12.2011 03:26, Levente Uzonyi wrote: >> >> >> How about my numbers? :) >> >> "Preallocate objects, so we won't count gc time." >> n := 1000000. >> objects := Array new: n streamContents: [ :stream | >> n timesRepeat: [ stream nextPut: Object new ] ]. >> >> set := IdentitySet new: n. >> Smalltalk garbageCollect. >> [1 to: n do: [ :i | set add: (objects at: i) ] ] timeToRun. >> "4949" >> >> set := LargeIdentitySet new. >> Smalltalk garbageCollect. >> [1 to: n do: [ :i | set add: (objects at: i) ] ] timeToRun. >> "331" >> >> set := (PluggableSet new: n) >> hashBlock: [ :object | object identityHash * 4096 + object >> class >> identityHash * 64 ]; "Change this to #basicIdentityHash in >> Pharo" >> equalBlock: [ :a :b | a == b ]; >> yourself. >> Smalltalk garbageCollect. >> [1 to: n do: [ :i | set add: (objects at: i) ] ] timeToRun. >> "5511" >> >> >> I also have a LargeIdentityDictionary, which is relatively >> fast, but not >> as fast as LargeIdentitySet, because (for some unknown reason) >> we don't >> have a primitive that could support it. If we had a primitive >> like >> primitive 132 which would return the index of the element if >> found or 0 if >> not, then we could have a really fast LargeIdentityDictionary. >> >> >> Levente >> >> Hehe yes, if writing a version fully exploiting the limited range, >> that's >> probably the approach I would go for as well. >> (IAssuming it's the version at http://leves.web.elte.hu/** >> squeak/LargeIdentitySet.st<htt**p://leves.web.elte.hu/squeak/** >> LargeIdentitySet.st <http://leves.web.elte.hu/squeak/LargeIdentitySet.st> >> > >> ) >> >> Mariano commented in the version at http://www.squeaksource.com/** >> FuelExperiments <http://www.squeaksource.com/**FuelExperiments<http://www.squeaksource.com/FuelExperiments>> >> that it's >> slow for them, which I guess is due to not adopting #identityHash calls to >> #basicIdentityHash calls for Pharo: >> ((0 to: 4095) collect: [:each | each << 22 \\ 4096 ]) asSet size -> 1 >> So it basically uses 1 bucket instead of 4096... Whoops. :) >> >> Uploaded a new version to the MC repository which is adapted for Pharo, >> on the same machine my numbers were taken from, it does the same test as I >> used above in 871 ms. (181 with preallocation). >> >> >> Cool. One more thing: in Squeak the method using primitive 132 directly >> was renamed to #instVarsInclude:, so now #pointsTo: works as expected. If >> this was also added to Pharo, then the #pointsTo: sends should be changed >> to #instVarsInclude:, otherwise Array can be reported as included even if >> it wasn't added. >> I'll upload my LargeIdentityDictionary implementation to the same place >> this evening, since it's still 2-3 factor faster than other solutionts and >> there seem to be demand for it. >> >> >> Levente >> >> >> Cheers, >> Henry >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Mariano >> http://marianopeck.wordpress.**com <http://marianopeck.wordpress.com> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Mariano >> http://marianopeck.wordpress.**com <http://marianopeck.wordpress.com> >> >> >> -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Feb. 28, 2012