December 2012 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Helping the noobs help out - i.e. fixing the debugger

by Eliot Miranda

On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 8:58 AM, adrians <nmanole(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > Of course not all of what needs to be done in Pharo should be of at same > priority. It makes sense to first fix the tools one uses for fixing > everything else, so that one can speed up one's own work and at the same > time open up the possibility for others (less skilled) to help out. > > In any case I'm sorry if it seems that I'm demanding you or anyone else > should make this a higher priority. The thinking was that maybe there is > someone (Stephane D?) who, to some degree, can prioritize certain things > over others and if so, wouldn't it make sense to fix the most basic tool > that is used to help fix everything else? > > Who knows though, maybe the debugger is not often used by the experts. > On the contrary. Many experts program in the debugger (one defines a method when one gets a doesNotUnderstand:). Many experts use the debugger to explore code (running code is a powerful aid to understanding). Some experts use the simulation machinery that underlies the debugger to do things like partial evaluation for type analysis etc. > -- Adrian > > > > -- > View this message in context: > http://forum.world.st/Helping-the-noobs-help-out-i-e-fixing-the-debugger-tp… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > -- best, Eliot

Dec. 12, 2012

[Pharo-project] Zinc-REST

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

There were some people asking about Zinc-REST. I took some time to improve the package (by moving some private code into it) and documented it by adding a couple of examples and unit tests. Load the group 'REST' using the latest ConfigurationOfZincHTTPComponents (NeoJSON will be loaded as a dependency). There are two examples: (1) ZnExampleSumRestCall handles REST requests for /sum For a GET request, it accepts numbers as path elements or as a query parameter. GET /sum/1/2/3 GET /sum?numbers=1,2,3 For a POST requests, it accepts a text/plain entity containing numbers. POST /sum '1,2,3' (2) ZnExampleStorageRestServerDelegate offers a REST interface on /storage/objects with CRUD operations on JSON maps. GET /storage/objects list all stored maps as a list of object-uris GET /storage/objects?key1=value1&key2=value2 as above with conjunctive condition specified POST /storage/objects <MAP> store a new map, returns the created object-uri GET /storage/object/<id> return the map stored under id DELETE /storage/object/<id> delete the map stored under id PUT /storage/object/<id> <MAP> overwrite the map stored under id with MAP Both examples are tested by matching unit tests. There is no further independent textual documentation, you'll need to know what REST style interfaces are and know about Zinc HTTP Components. Compared to Seaside-REST this solution is simpler (no Seaside dependency), a bit less declarative (no pragmas), closer to the mechanics of HTTP, not linked to automagic conversions (Magritte). But this is code that I use in production. Sven -- Sven Van Caekenberghe http://stfx.eu Smalltalk is the Red Pill

Dec. 12, 2012

[Pharo-project] Zinc-Resource-Meta-[Core|Tests]

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Just a quick note: the first version of Zinc-Resource-Meta-[Core|Tests] containing ZnUrl and ZnMimeType independent of / separate from / as a dependency for Zinc-HTTP is now available. ConfigurationOfZincHTTPComponents version 2.0 reflects this change (#stable for Pharo 2.x). -- Sven Van Caekenberghe http://stfx.eu Smalltalk is the Red Pill

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: Lua scripting with nativeboost?

by Marten Feldtmann

On 12.12.2012 17:18, Esteban Lorenzano wrote: > IMO, that's non-sense. Well, that is a matter of view. I've done this also with Lua and VASmalltalk and I did this not because of other Smalltalkers in mind using my software, but perhaps of potential end users willing to enhance the application in a more known language. Because of this I also tried to use Rexx as an extension language, which is in my view even more suitable to be used as an embedded language - but the market decided to use Lua and not Rexx. Marten

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] About (backwards) Compatibility

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Come on, chris. Are you getting nervous, tired, bored? Because we are cool and positive thinking :). We are not reinventing the past, believe me - I never saw a objectecentric debugger, a bootstrapped kernel and a lot moreâ¦.:) May be you did not read my FAST Pharo presentation or the ESUG one but we want to get more business around Pharo and we are doing it. In addition we are creating a real company (and probably another in the future) and we are really aware about what is to really getting work done. You know Moose is probably one of the most complex Pharo application around. Now we do not want to live in a place where each time we open a browser on something we cry. Why because at the end it will kill us. If we cannot innovate and go fast with Smalltalk then better code in Java or Javascript. This is why we removed FileDirectory (note that camillo nicely proposed a compat package), systemEventNotifierâ¦. Esteban could port Pier and Seaside to Pharo 1.4 in a couple of hours. We have pier running in 2.0. Now just out of curiosity do you use Pharo ;D Stef > If my goal is to make my computer work for ME, then I want my > development system to maximize my leverage and minimize my effort. > Breaking compatibility for cleaner code subverts this, as Hannes said, > >>> Constant input in maintenance effort is needed. > > I want to use my time applying Smalltalk to real-world problems, not > API changes. > > A blue-plane innovation is worth breaking backward compatibility, > reinventing the past isn't. > > >>> maintaining libraries and maybe compatibility layers are very welcome. >>> >> Yes, and how did we ever thought we could invent the future with Squeak >> when in reality, we could not even change a typo in a comment? >> >> Marcus >> >> >> >> >

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Browsing hierarchy in 2.0

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

The best one is the groups :) > 2012/12/9 Nicolas Cellier <nicolas.cellier.aka.nice(a)gmail.com>: >> How do I browse hierarchy: for example that of Array? >> I know I can type Array browseHierarchy, select it and doIt, but I >> mean efficiently... >> >> Nicolas >

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Helping the noobs help out - i.e. fixing the debugger

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Hi adrian this is not that we do not want to fix issues. This is that some are killing us while others are letting us to breath. Now we can argue for hours about priority. The best things to do is to try. And I can tell you that the debugger is important for us - this is our best friend. But it gets a bit old. To me having the UI defined in another class was strange for years. We fixed it. And as marcus said we are working :) and quite busy. Stef > Hi, > > I'm a Smalltalk newbie and I would like to help fix some simpler issues. For > example, I've recently logged some issues surrounding smart character use. I > set a breakpoint in NECController>>#smartCharacterWithEvent: and proceeded > to debug. > > Now, I understand that for the old-timers stepping through a selector is > straightforward, no matter what help the debugger gives you. For myself, and > likely many other Smalltalk noobs who'd like to help, I need all the help I > can get. One such support is an accurate indication of where the PC is as > you step through a body of code. Currently, in the 2.0 one-click image > (build 20431), things seem quite broken wrt getting accurate visual feedback > of where you are. > > First, as you step over message sends, the highlighted selection is shown in > a totally incorrect spot. Sometimes, just a bit off from where you expect to > be, but sometimes quite a bit off, for example in a block that should not > even be entered. In the selector I mentioned above, the highlighted location > enters the "editor hasSelection ifTrue: []" block when "editor hasSelection" > returns false. > > Second, the PC location highlight is removed when you click somewhere inside > the code. This should never turn off - it's as if you switch the lights off, > for people not familiar with some particular code. I know you can use the > "Where" button to re-establish the highlight, but other than the fact that > you shouldn't have to do this, the highlighted selection is sometimes shown > in the wrong place. > > Third, as you step through code, you would expect that the values of > variables as shown in the bottom right panel of the debugger are accurately > updated as state changes. I've seen cases, relatively frequent, where this > is not so. Current values are shown only after some further advancement > through code. > > There is an old issue tracking debugger selection, > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=709 > <http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=709> , but fixing the > problem seems to have stalled. Additionally, I'm not sure that this > particular issue addresses the third point I made about stale variable > values being shown. > > Could I ask that making the debugger work be made a priority? Of course one > can muddle through some code even with visually broken indicators, but it > should not be so, IMO. The old timers can make the case that there are other > more pressing issues to be addressed, but IMO it makes sense to make the > actual tool used to fix problems as helpful as possible for everyone so that > even non-experts can be productive and lend a helping hand. > > > Cheers, > Adrian > > > > -- > View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Helping-the-noobs-help-out-i-e-fixing-the-debugger-tp… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] NativeBoost and Pharo Kernel

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Igor metacello can handle this situation and there is a doc. We can give a try together. but this is not like we do not have the tool at hand. Stef On Dec 11, 2012, at 3:30 PM, Igor Stasenko wrote: > On 11 December 2012 09:51, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> Hi, >> >> I would like to ask: should NativeBoost be part of the Pharo Kernel? >> Currently there are some minor issues like that AsmJit-Extension package >> takes ownership of Integer>>#&, False>>#asBit and so on. > > This is because 1.4 don't have those methods, while 2.0. has (added by > Camillo).. > and so, currently , NB can either work on both, by making 2.0 image dirty > or work only in 2.0, and fail to work in 1.4 because of "missing" methods. > > I am not very good in metacello-fu to write a confing, which will > select various set of stuff to load > depending on image version. > So, if someone can help, i would appreciate that. > I can move those methods into NB-pharo-1.4 package.. > > >> Will NativeBoost be >> more closely integrated with the kernel in the near future? >> > depends on what you putting into "kernel". > if it is "a basic functionality, which is absolutely required to do > anything else", > then no, it will be never part of a kernel. > > if it is " a set of functionality, ready to use for most common/daily > tasks" , then yes > it should be part of such kernel.. > > >> BTW, we need to integrate >> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7062 before any update that >> will move methods between packages. >> >> Cheers, >> -- Pavel > > > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. >

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] another kid born: NBExternalEnumerationType

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Ciprian this is really cool to see how pushing and enhancing NativeBoost. Really a cool nd warm feeling. Tx for your energy and time. Stef On Dec 11, 2012, at 8:33 PM, Ciprian Teodorov wrote: > Hi guys, > > today I have commited to the NativeBoost repository a new core class, the NBExternalEnumerationType, > which reifies the enum declarations in C and offers a nice interface (especially in terms of debug/inspect). > > To use it just subclass the NBExternalEnumeration and add an #enumDecl method to the class side such as: > Did you add this cool class comment :) > NBExternalEnumeration subclass: #NBTestEnumeration > instanceVariableNames: '' > classVariableNames: '' > poolDictionaries: '' > category: 'NativeBoost-Tests' > > NBTestEnumeration class>>enumDecl > ^ {(#AAA -> 1). > (#BBB -> 2). > (#CCC -> 3). > (#DDD -> 2400)} asDictionary > > DO NOT FORGET to call the #initialize method on your class. The rest is automatically done ;) > > You can use your new enum in two ways: > â¢ add it to a client class poolDictionaries list (see #NBExternalEnumTests for an example), and then just write CCC in your code -- CCC here is an item of your enum > â¢ or you can send the name of an item to your class --- NBTestEnumeration DDD > The NBExternalEnumeration implements (instance and class) some more API methods like: > â¢ #itemAt: retrieves the item having a specific value --- NBTestEnumeration itemAt: 2 > â¢ #includes: checks the existence of a specific item in the enum --- NBTestEnumeration includes: #AAA > Having this already gives us a nice interface to working with enums. Now I plan to improve a little bit on performance and usage scenarios: > â¢ the possibility to accept smalltalk integers as valid input/output for functions(or callbacks) that use enums as arguments/return. > â¢ support the different representation types for the enum values (int/uint) > So that will be for now. Feel free to try it out and send me any comments and/or improvement ideas, It will be my pleasure to improve it. > Cheers, > -- > Dr. Ciprian TEODOROV > IngÃ©nieur DÃ©veloppement CAO > > tÃ©l : 06 08 54 73 48 > mail : ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com > www.teodorov.ro

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Protecting against stack overflow ?

by Eliot Miranda

On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 9:26 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On 12 December 2012 00:43, Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 3:35 PM, Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda(a)gmail.com> > > wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 10:26 AM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> hehe.. > >>> it looks like we can do it: > >>> > >>> - when memory hits the waterline mark, VM should do the following: > >>> - for every currently scheduled process , push an artificial stack > >>> frame on top , which is > >>> StackOverflow signal. > >> > >> > >> If the VM supports the LowSpaceSignal mechanism as it used to be then > this > >> can be done in the image with a high-priority process. And tehrefore > it can > >> e.g. be avoided for processes such as the Delay process, where IMO it is > >> inappropriate. > > > > > > And if it is done in the image it is easy to e.g. avoid pushing two such > > frames on the same process because the process has made no progress since > > the last occurrence, etc. > > > indeed.. i did not realized that this can be done inside an image :) > > i was thinking more about stack limit, not space limit. > because scanning the stack will trigger putting all contexts on heap > (which in own turn will put even more pressure on memory).. while in > VM, to determine stack depth, it can walk the stack frames without > marrying them with heap contexts to count stack depth. > or it is not the case? is accessing the context state triggers > "marrying" it with heap object, i.e. > > [ count := count + 1. context := context sender. ] whileNotNil > > ? > exactly. The VM can provide a primitive to walk the stack without creating objects (which worsens the space situation). Even better the VM could maintain stack depth in Process, but that's for the future, because it needs a) a slot in Process and b) the support writing in both VMs. -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. > > -- best, Eliot

Dec. 12, 2012