December 2012 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Anonymous subclasses support

by Ciprian Teodorov

On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 9:41 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On 16 December 2012 19:42, Ciprian Teodorov <ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > Hi guys, > > > > Can somebody tell what is the correct way of creating anonymous classes > in > > Pharo? > > When I say correct way I mean something that does not break the image or > the > > tools. > > > > The thing is that we can use them in NativeBoost and I cannot stop > running > > into errors because of these anonymous classes. > > Is it just me or maybe we should do something about it... > > > > I am really frustrated about this thing because everybody knows that we > can > > do it... but at the end of the day it is not working properly, > > and has bizzare side effects. > > > > Depends what you wanna do. > > > What about an official API for doing this? Or at least a way to check if > > your class is anonymous so that we can refactor the tools to ignore them > or > > something... > > > Using anonymous classes with tools which written to work with public ones > will never work. > There are too many places on different levels of system with strong > assumptions about how things are organized. > Perhaps if you tell, what you trying to do, we can see how to deal > with problems. > > I'm writing a FFI generator for Pharo that uses libclang to parse header files and generates nativeboost mapping as output. The beast is almost working (I can get libclang mapping, the core.h header)but there are still some small issues. So, that's why I've been poking at nativeboost ;) At the end I expect to have something that will generate correct ffi interface, and that will not bloat the image with thousand of visible classes, so that the user might get a chance to understand something of what I'm generating... The thing is this evening after 4-5 hours of looking around my conclusion is. In pharo 1.4 the anonymous subclasses are breaking the tools, and in the brand new pharo 2.0 the refactoring tools (RBNamespace & company) are not working as they should.... so i'm stuck with 1.4 for now (and still telling to myself that I do not want to bloat the image with many classes) Well that's about it for now... P.S. wellcome to bizarre world of metaprogramming :) > > > -- > > Dr. Ciprian TEODOROV > > IngÃ©nieur DÃ©veloppement CAO > > > > tÃ©l : 06 08 54 73 48 > > mail : ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com > > www.teodorov.ro > > > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. > > -- Dr. Ciprian TEODOROV IngÃ©nieur DÃ©veloppement CAO tÃ©l : 06 08 54 73 48 mail : ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com www.teodorov.ro

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Anonymous subclasses support

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Behavior new I fixed it to work long time ago. Now you have to pay attention because depending on what you want to do you will have to compile in these anonymous classes some methods. Now I would avoid them. Stef > Hi guys, > > Can somebody tell what is the correct way of creating anonymous classes in Pharo? > When I say correct way I mean something that does not break the image or the tools. > > The thing is that we can use them in NativeBoost and I cannot stop running into errors because of these anonymous classes. > Is it just me or maybe we should do something about it... > > I am really frustrated about this thing because everybody knows that we can do it... but at the end of the day it is not working properly, > and has bizzare side effects. > > What about an official API for doing this? Or at least a way to check if your class is anonymous so that we can refactor the tools to ignore them or something... > > -- > Dr. Ciprian TEODOROV > IngÃ©nieur DÃ©veloppement CAO > > tÃ©l : 06 08 54 73 48 > mail : ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com > www.teodorov.ro

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] about isAbstractClass

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On Dec 16, 2012, at 7:29 PM, Igor Stasenko wrote: > On 16 December 2012 16:34, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >> Hi guys >> >> I will deprecate isAbstractClass and introduce defineAbstractMethods. >> why? because as soon as we have an abstract method in Object nearly all the classes becomes abstract >> and this does not make sense. >> Now I can understand that we want to know if a class defineAbstractMethods and sometimes taking into account inheritance. >> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7123 >> > > well, since in smalltalk you can make everything extremely late bound, > i wonder, if it makes any sense to apply such terminology to classes at all. > these terms coming from static languages in their attempt to add OO.. Because some people need that. Now defineAbstractMethods is much better than isAstractClass because it just describes a real situation. Does a class has any subclassResponsibility method. So this is a good compromise and encapsulation sendLiteralâ¦. in a nice little method is nice. stef

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Anonymous subclasses support

by Igor Stasenko

On 16 December 2012 19:42, Ciprian Teodorov <ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi guys, > > Can somebody tell what is the correct way of creating anonymous classes in > Pharo? > When I say correct way I mean something that does not break the image or the > tools. > > The thing is that we can use them in NativeBoost and I cannot stop running > into errors because of these anonymous classes. > Is it just me or maybe we should do something about it... > > I am really frustrated about this thing because everybody knows that we can > do it... but at the end of the day it is not working properly, > and has bizzare side effects. > Depends what you wanna do. > What about an official API for doing this? Or at least a way to check if > your class is anonymous so that we can refactor the tools to ignore them or > something... > Using anonymous classes with tools which written to work with public ones will never work. There are too many places on different levels of system with strong assumptions about how things are organized. Perhaps if you tell, what you trying to do, we can see how to deal with problems. P.S. wellcome to bizarre world of metaprogramming :) > -- > Dr. Ciprian TEODOROV > IngÃ©nieur DÃ©veloppement CAO > > tÃ©l : 06 08 54 73 48 > mail : ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com > www.teodorov.ro -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] NativeBoost types -> anonymous subclasses issue

by Ciprian Teodorov

On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 7:37 PM, Ciprian Teodorov < ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com> wrote: > well... it turns out that my thing does not work either since the tools > are expecting named classes everywhere... stay tuned for my 1 billion dolar > question :)) > > it seems to work in 2.0, and not in 1.4? > > On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 7:25 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> On 16 December 2012 19:02, Ciprian Teodorov <ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > >> > >> > On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 6:27 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On 16 December 2012 16:05, Ciprian Teodorov < >> ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com> >> >> wrote: >> >> > Hi Igor, >> >> > >> >> > Besides some other small comits, in >> NativeBoost-Core-CiprianTeodorov.103 >> >> > I >> >> > have changed the way anonymous subclasses of NBExternalTypeValue and >> >> > NBExternalArray are created. >> >> > >> >> > The reason is that using the old way we would create multiple >> instances >> >> > of >> >> > the same metaclass which is not allowed in the image. >> >> > BTW, I was getting this problem when trying to modify (add or remove) >> >> > class >> >> > instance variables of the NBExternalArray. >> >> >> >> So, your problem is that you abusing it :) >> > >> > Lool. Yes I abused it a little bit ... ;) but not this time. >> >> >> >> Anonymous subclasses is there for sole purpose to provide common >> >> minimal protocol >> >> for their instances. >> >> If you need something else, you can just make normal subclasses. >> >> >> > >> > In your image just do >> > >> > before := NBExternalArray class allInstances size. >> > myFloatArray := NBExternalArray ofType: #NBFloat32 . >> > after := NBExternalArray class allInstances size. >> > >> > {before. after} inspect. >> > >> > the number of metaclass instances should be one. If there are more you >> get >> > errors when refactoring your class. >> > >> > Now just image that I have create a few of these external array types... >> > before being able to touch the NBExternalArray ever again you have to >> > somehow get rid of all wrong instances ... I did that yesterday and is >> not >> > funny... >> > >> yes, not funny. but why touching NBExternalArray in a first place? :) >> >> > >> >> >> >> > Doing NBExternalArray class allInstances, I was clearly getting more >> >> > than >> >> > one instance... >> >> > >> >> > Now the anonymous subclasses are build using >> >> > ClassBuilder>>#newSubclassOf:type:instanceVariables:from: which >> seems to >> >> > prevent this problem from happening. >> >> > >> >> > What do you think? Are there other ways to get around this problem? >> >> > >> >> >> >> Sure , you can use class builder, but again, you need it because you >> >> want to have >> >> more than just minimal interface. So, again, why don't just create own >> >> subclass? >> >> >> > I was playing a little bit with static arrays... passed by value on >> > stack... you know I already told you that I want to use arrays in >> structures >> > like struct {void *x[100]; }. I think that I can use the >> NBExternalStruct >> > for that but ... seeing NBExternalArray tempted me >> > >> > >> > And since we are here ;) one more question: Why the NBExternalArray >> does not >> > have a type ? It seems to me that they are not symmetric with all other >> > native types. >> >> well, it adds another dimension to type system.. >> it needs to be implemented.. one day :) >> >> >> Right now, for passing a pointer to array to some function, you can >> use 'myArray address' >> it works both for external/internal arrays. >> >> -- >> Best regards, >> Igor Stasenko. >> >> > > > -- > Dr. Ciprian TEODOROV > IngÃ©nieur DÃ©veloppement CAO > > tÃ©l : 06 08 54 73 48 > mail : ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com > www.teodorov.ro > -- Dr. Ciprian TEODOROV IngÃ©nieur DÃ©veloppement CAO tÃ©l : 06 08 54 73 48 mail : ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com www.teodorov.ro

Dec. 16, 2012

[Pharo-project] [update 2.0] #20437

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

20437 ----- Issue 7124: Spec new version http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7124 Thanks Benjamin van Ryseghem Diff information: http://ss3.gemstone.com/ss/Pharo20/Spec-Widgets-StephaneDucasse.73.diff http://ss3.gemstone.com/ss/Pharo20/Spec-Tools-StephaneDucasse.70.diff http://ss3.gemstone.com/ss/Pharo20/Spec-Tests-StephaneDucasse.16.diff http://ss3.gemstone.com/ss/Pharo20/Spec-Core-StephaneDucasse.69.diff http://ss3.gemstone.com/ss/Pharo20/Spec-Builder-StephaneDucasse.17.diff http://ss3.gemstone.com/ss/Pharo20/Spec-Bindings-StephaneDucasse.20.diff Thanks Ben. Stef

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] NativeBoost types -> anonymous subclasses issue

by Ciprian Teodorov

On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 7:25 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On 16 December 2012 19:02, Ciprian Teodorov <ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > > > On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 6:27 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > >> > >> On 16 December 2012 16:05, Ciprian Teodorov <ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com > > > >> wrote: > >> > Hi Igor, > >> > > >> > Besides some other small comits, in > NativeBoost-Core-CiprianTeodorov.103 > >> > I > >> > have changed the way anonymous subclasses of NBExternalTypeValue and > >> > NBExternalArray are created. > >> > > >> > The reason is that using the old way we would create multiple > instances > >> > of > >> > the same metaclass which is not allowed in the image. > >> > BTW, I was getting this problem when trying to modify (add or remove) > >> > class > >> > instance variables of the NBExternalArray. > >> > >> So, your problem is that you abusing it :) > > > > Lool. Yes I abused it a little bit ... ;) but not this time. > >> > >> Anonymous subclasses is there for sole purpose to provide common > >> minimal protocol > >> for their instances. > >> If you need something else, you can just make normal subclasses. > >> > > > > In your image just do > > > > before := NBExternalArray class allInstances size. > > myFloatArray := NBExternalArray ofType: #NBFloat32 . > > after := NBExternalArray class allInstances size. > > > > {before. after} inspect. > > > > the number of metaclass instances should be one. If there are more you > get > > errors when refactoring your class. > > > > Now just image that I have create a few of these external array types... > > before being able to touch the NBExternalArray ever again you have to > > somehow get rid of all wrong instances ... I did that yesterday and is > not > > funny... > > > > yes, not funny. but why touching NBExternalArray in a first place? :) > I'm writing a FFI generator for Pharo that uses clang to parse header files and generates nativeboost mapping as output. The beast is almost working but there are still some small issues. So, that's why I've been poking at nativeboost ;) At the end I expect to have something that will generate correct ffi interface, and that will not bloat the image with thousand classes... > > > > >> > >> > Doing NBExternalArray class allInstances, I was clearly getting more > >> > than > >> > one instance... > >> > > >> > Now the anonymous subclasses are build using > >> > ClassBuilder>>#newSubclassOf:type:instanceVariables:from: which seems > to > >> > prevent this problem from happening. > >> > > >> > What do you think? Are there other ways to get around this problem? > >> > > >> > >> Sure , you can use class builder, but again, you need it because you > >> want to have > >> more than just minimal interface. So, again, why don't just create own > >> subclass? > >> > > I was playing a little bit with static arrays... passed by value on > > stack... you know I already told you that I want to use arrays in > structures > > like struct {void *x[100]; }. I think that I can use the NBExternalStruct > > for that but ... seeing NBExternalArray tempted me > > > > > > And since we are here ;) one more question: Why the NBExternalArray does > not > > have a type ? It seems to me that they are not symmetric with all other > > native types. > > well, it adds another dimension to type system.. > it needs to be implemented.. one day :) > > > Right now, for passing a pointer to array to some function, you can > use 'myArray address' > it works both for external/internal arrays. > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. > > -- Dr. Ciprian TEODOROV IngÃ©nieur DÃ©veloppement CAO tÃ©l : 06 08 54 73 48 mail : ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com www.teodorov.ro

Dec. 16, 2012

[Pharo-project] Anonymous subclasses support

by Ciprian Teodorov

Hi guys, Can somebody tell what is the correct way of creating anonymous classes in Pharo? When I say correct way I mean something that does not break the image or the tools. The thing is that we can use them in NativeBoost and I cannot stop running into errors because of these anonymous classes. Is it just me or maybe we should do something about it... I am really frustrated about this thing because everybody knows that we can do it... but at the end of the day it is not working properly, and has bizzare side effects. What about an official API for doing this? Or at least a way to check if your class is anonymous so that we can refactor the tools to ignore them or something... -- Dr. Ciprian TEODOROV IngÃ©nieur DÃ©veloppement CAO tÃ©l : 06 08 54 73 48 mail : ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com www.teodorov.ro

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] NativeBoost types -> anonymous subclasses issue

by Ciprian Teodorov

well... it turns out that my thing does not work either since the tools are expecting named classes everywhere... stay tuned for my 1 billion dolar question :)) On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 7:25 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On 16 December 2012 19:02, Ciprian Teodorov <ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > > > On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 6:27 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > >> > >> On 16 December 2012 16:05, Ciprian Teodorov <ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com > > > >> wrote: > >> > Hi Igor, > >> > > >> > Besides some other small comits, in > NativeBoost-Core-CiprianTeodorov.103 > >> > I > >> > have changed the way anonymous subclasses of NBExternalTypeValue and > >> > NBExternalArray are created. > >> > > >> > The reason is that using the old way we would create multiple > instances > >> > of > >> > the same metaclass which is not allowed in the image. > >> > BTW, I was getting this problem when trying to modify (add or remove) > >> > class > >> > instance variables of the NBExternalArray. > >> > >> So, your problem is that you abusing it :) > > > > Lool. Yes I abused it a little bit ... ;) but not this time. > >> > >> Anonymous subclasses is there for sole purpose to provide common > >> minimal protocol > >> for their instances. > >> If you need something else, you can just make normal subclasses. > >> > > > > In your image just do > > > > before := NBExternalArray class allInstances size. > > myFloatArray := NBExternalArray ofType: #NBFloat32 . > > after := NBExternalArray class allInstances size. > > > > {before. after} inspect. > > > > the number of metaclass instances should be one. If there are more you > get > > errors when refactoring your class. > > > > Now just image that I have create a few of these external array types... > > before being able to touch the NBExternalArray ever again you have to > > somehow get rid of all wrong instances ... I did that yesterday and is > not > > funny... > > > yes, not funny. but why touching NBExternalArray in a first place? :) > > > > >> > >> > Doing NBExternalArray class allInstances, I was clearly getting more > >> > than > >> > one instance... > >> > > >> > Now the anonymous subclasses are build using > >> > ClassBuilder>>#newSubclassOf:type:instanceVariables:from: which seems > to > >> > prevent this problem from happening. > >> > > >> > What do you think? Are there other ways to get around this problem? > >> > > >> > >> Sure , you can use class builder, but again, you need it because you > >> want to have > >> more than just minimal interface. So, again, why don't just create own > >> subclass? > >> > > I was playing a little bit with static arrays... passed by value on > > stack... you know I already told you that I want to use arrays in > structures > > like struct {void *x[100]; }. I think that I can use the NBExternalStruct > > for that but ... seeing NBExternalArray tempted me > > > > > > And since we are here ;) one more question: Why the NBExternalArray does > not > > have a type ? It seems to me that they are not symmetric with all other > > native types. > > well, it adds another dimension to type system.. > it needs to be implemented.. one day :) > > > Right now, for passing a pointer to array to some function, you can > use 'myArray address' > it works both for external/internal arrays. > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. > > -- Dr. Ciprian TEODOROV IngÃ©nieur DÃ©veloppement CAO tÃ©l : 06 08 54 73 48 mail : ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com www.teodorov.ro

Dec. 16, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] about isAbstractClass

by Igor Stasenko

On 16 December 2012 16:34, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > Hi guys > > I will deprecate isAbstractClass and introduce defineAbstractMethods. > why? because as soon as we have an abstract method in Object nearly all the classes becomes abstract > and this does not make sense. > Now I can understand that we want to know if a class defineAbstractMethods and sometimes taking into account inheritance. > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7123 > well, since in smalltalk you can make everything extremely late bound, i wonder, if it makes any sense to apply such terminology to classes at all. these terms coming from static languages in their attempt to add OO.. > Stef -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Dec. 16, 2012