January 2012 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: [Moose-dev] cogwin/Croquet (Win7) + Moose + very large model = crash (out of Memory)

by Igor Stasenko

On 26 January 2012 12:00, Hani Abdeen <hani.abdeen(a)gmail.com> wrote: > thanks, > any idea about 64bit version of win vm? (url, name.....) > or an vm for Linux Mint 11 32 bit. Cogwin does not works on this version > Cog works on 32bit only for now. > cheers, > hani > > > On 26 January 2012 10:28, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> On 26 January 2012 09:58, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> >> wrote: >> > >> > >> > Begin forwarded message: >> > >> > From: Hani Abdeen <hani.abdeen(a)gmail.com> >> > Subject: [Moose-dev] Re: cogwin/Croquet (Win7) + Moose + very large >> > model = >> > crash (out of Memory) >> > Date: January 26, 2012 8:52:15 AM GMT+01:00 >> > To: Moose-related development <moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch> >> > Reply-To: Moose-related development <moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch> >> > >> > Hi Doru, >> > >> > the image size starts at 400M, before doing anything on the model. >> > Now, as I start manipulating the model and sending navigation queries, >> > trying to create an Arki report about the model, the image >> > sizeÂ apparentlyÂ exceed 500M and the VM crashes! >> > For more information I enclosed the header of the crash.dmp file. >> > >> >> 521M is a hard limit for windows 32bit VM, sorry. >> >> I think that it would be better for you to check 64bit version of vm.. >> or, as i suggested already, change your data model(s) and introduce >> cache, or other memory conservation schemes. >> >> >> -- >> Best regards, >> Igor Stasenko. >> > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Jan. 26, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: [Moose-dev] cogwin/Croquet (Win7) + Moose + very large model = crash (out of Memory)

by Hani Abdeen

thanks, any idea about 64bit version of win vm? (url, name.....) or an vm for Linux Mint 11 32 bit. Cogwin does not works on this version cheers, hani On 26 January 2012 10:28, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On 26 January 2012 09:58, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> > wrote: > > > > > > Begin forwarded message: > > > > From: Hani Abdeen <hani.abdeen(a)gmail.com> > > Subject: [Moose-dev] Re: cogwin/Croquet (Win7) + Moose + very large > model = > > crash (out of Memory) > > Date: January 26, 2012 8:52:15 AM GMT+01:00 > > To: Moose-related development <moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch> > > Reply-To: Moose-related development <moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch> > > > > Hi Doru, > > > > the image size starts at 400M, before doing anything on the model. > > Now, as I start manipulating the model and sending navigation queries, > > trying to create an Arki report about the model, the image > > size apparently exceed 500M and the VM crashes! > > For more information I enclosed the header of the crash.dmp file. > > > > 521M is a hard limit for windows 32bit VM, sorry. > > I think that it would be better for you to check 64bit version of vm.. > or, as i suggested already, change your data model(s) and introduce > cache, or other memory conservation schemes. > > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. > >

Jan. 26, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] cogwin/Croquet (Win7) + Moose + very large models = crash (out of Memory)

by Igor Stasenko

On 25 January 2012 23:18, Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck(a)gmail.com> wrote: > I think Igor fixed that for the Windows VM, but such changes were not > integerated in Eliot VMs, but rather in the branch of Git. > But since the Jenkins is not building Windows VM, I have no idea where you > can get such a VM. > No, changes are there. But they are not "fixing" the hard limit which is still 512M. They only fixing a strange issue with growing image close to that limit (so 400M (and even less size) images was crashing before even reaching a limit). This is because of miscalculation between requested space and available space, after memory growth. > Cheers > > > On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 11:12 PM, Hani Abdeen <hani.abdeen(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> On 25 January 2012 23:05, Paul DeBruicker <pdebruic(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Hani Abdeen wrote >>> > >>> > Hello, >>> > >>> > I'm using cogwin/Croquet VM (last version >>> > http://www.mirandabanda.org/files/Cog/VM/VM.r2522/) on windows7, >>> > and today I had this probelm: when the size of the pharo image become >>> > so >>> > large the VM crashes with reason 'out of memory'. >>> > The same problem with previous versions of cogwin. >>> > Note that I use a PC with 8G of RAM, so it's really damage to have such >>> > a >>> > problem. >>> > >>> > Any idea about another VM working well on Windows and does not have >>> > such >>> > an >>> > issues? >>> > Any urgent solution? >>> > >>> > Thanks, >>> > Hani >>> > >>> >>> From this thread: >>> http://forum.world.st/experience-with-large-images-td4101765.html >>> >>> It seems that on windows the size of the image by default is limited to >>> 500MB in RAM. Â I don't know if you can change it or not. Â Linux/Mac is >>> limited to 2GB. Â Can you try your experiments on a Mac? >> >> >> Unfortunately no, I've not Mac, and the company for which I'll use Moose >> on their software, Tomorrow morning :(, do not use Mac. >> >> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> View this message in context: >>> http://forum.world.st/cogwin-Croquet-Win7-Moose-very-large-models-crash-out… >>> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >>> >> > > > > -- > Mariano > http://marianopeck.wordpress.com > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Jan. 26, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: [Moose-dev] cogwin/Croquet (Win7) + Moose + very large model = crash (out of Memory)

by Igor Stasenko

On 26 January 2012 09:58, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > > Begin forwarded message: > > From: Hani Abdeen <hani.abdeen(a)gmail.com> > Subject: [Moose-dev] Re: cogwin/Croquet (Win7) + Moose + very large model = > crash (out of Memory) > Date: January 26, 2012 8:52:15 AM GMT+01:00 > To: Moose-related development <moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch> > Reply-To: Moose-related development <moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch> > > Hi Doru, > > the image size starts at 400M, before doing anything on the model. > Now, as I start manipulating the model and sending navigation queries, > trying to create an Arki report about the model, the image > sizeÂ apparentlyÂ exceed 500M and the VM crashes! > For more information I enclosed the header of the crash.dmp file. > 521M is a hard limit for windows 32bit VM, sorry. I think that it would be better for you to check 64bit version of vm.. or, as i suggested already, change your data model(s) and introduce cache, or other memory conservation schemes. -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Jan. 26, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Noobs perspective on pasting example code

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On Jan 26, 2012, at 8:15 AM, Ben Coman wrote: > > Just a passing thought.... > It is common convention for example methods to be presented in text using '>>' preceded by the class. This is obviously needed to define the class/method relationship outside the image, but the whole example cannot be pasted directly into System Browser as the '>>' is not part of the Smalltalk syntax for defining methods. > For those new to Pharo going through tutorials, copy/pasting the whole of the presented code eg [1] returns only the error "Nothing more expected" which is a bit cryptic to noobs who expect to follow the example verbatim. Once past understanding this, it continues (for me) to be a minor annoyance to have to select only the text following the '>>'. would be nice! > I wonder whether it would be beneficial for the compiler to handle '>>' at the start of a method definition. The System Browser would then jump to the created method. As well as beneficial to those experiencing Pharo for the first time, this might be useful as a general shortcut such that when browsing one class you can define a method for another class without first having to browse to that class. Ideally I would like to have also the support for coral syntax :) > > cheers, Ben > > [1] > BExp>>testBlock: aBlock > | t | > t := nil. > aBlock value > > >

Jan. 26, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Noobs perspective on pasting example code

by Tudor Girba

I think Damien meant the other Ben(jamin) :) Cheers, Doru On Thu, Jan 26, 2012 at 10:35 AM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: > > Damien Cassou wrote: >> >> On Thu, Jan 26, 2012 at 9:57 AM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: >> >>> >>> Thanks Milan. Something new I've learnt. Â However I don't think this is a >>> conflict. >>> >> >> >> I agree, I don't see any conflict. I also like the proposal. Ben, do >> you think you could try to implement a prototype? I advise you to >> implement it either for OmniBrowser or for Nautilus and see if it >> makes sense. >> >> Thanks for the proposal >> >> > > I can't do anything for the next six months - I'm a long way behind where I > wanted to be with my dissertation. > I'll be happy to give it a go after that is complete. Â For now, I just let > out the idea while it occurs to me, so it does get lost. > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

Jan. 26, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Noobs perspective on pasting example code

by Ben Coman

Damien Cassou wrote: > On Thu, Jan 26, 2012 at 9:57 AM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: > >> Thanks Milan. Something new I've learnt. However I don't think this is a >> conflict. >> > > I agree, I don't see any conflict. I also like the proposal. Ben, do > you think you could try to implement a prototype? I advise you to > implement it either for OmniBrowser or for Nautilus and see if it > makes sense. > > Thanks for the proposal > > I can't do anything for the next six months - I'm a long way behind where I wanted to be with my dissertation. I'll be happy to give it a go after that is complete. For now, I just let out the idea while it occurs to me, so it does get lost.

Jan. 26, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Noobs perspective on pasting example code

by Damien Cassou

On Thu, Jan 26, 2012 at 9:57 AM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: > Thanks Milan. Something new I've learnt. Â However I don't think this is a > conflict. I agree, I don't see any conflict. I also like the proposal. Ben, do you think you could try to implement a prototype? I advise you to implement it either for OmniBrowser or for Nautilus and see if it makes sense. Thanks for the proposal -- Damien Cassou http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them popular by not having them." James Iry

Jan. 26, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] cogwin/Croquet (Win7) + Moose + very large models = crash (out of Memory)

by Hani Abdeen

Hi Stef, On 26 January 2012 10:05, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr>wrote: > Hani > > first import less information for your demo. You probably do not need this > and local argument. > yes I think so, I've also a pre loaded demo java model to demonstrate it Guillermo told me that he just compiled a VM for windows and he can send it to me to try. may be he did not read my email yet. I'll also see if they have a Linux machine on which we can on the image usign Pharo VM. Thanks Hani > > stef > > > > Hani Abdeen wrote > > > > > > Hello, > > > > > > I'm using cogwin/Croquet VM (last version > > > http://www.mirandabanda.org/files/Cog/VM/VM.r2522/) on windows7, > > > and today I had this probelm: when the size of the pharo image become > so > > > large the VM crashes with reason 'out of memory'. > > > The same problem with previous versions of cogwin. > > > Note that I use a PC with 8G of RAM, so it's really damage to have > such a > > > problem. > > > > > > Any idea about another VM working well on Windows and does not have > such > > > an > > > issues? > > > Any urgent solution? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Hani > > > > > > > From this thread: > > http://forum.world.st/experience-with-large-images-td4101765.html > > > > It seems that on windows the size of the image by default is limited to > > 500MB in RAM. I don't know if you can change it or not. Linux/Mac is > > limited to 2GB. Can you try your experiments on a Mac? > > > > Unfortunately no, I've not Mac, and the company for which I'll use Moose > on their software, Tomorrow morning :(, do not use Mac. > > > > > > > > > > -- > > View this message in context: > http://forum.world.st/cogwin-Croquet-Win7-Moose-very-large-models-crash-out… > > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > > > > > >

Jan. 26, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] cogwin/Croquet (Win7) + Moose + very large models = crash (out of Memory)

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Hani first import less information for your demo. You probably do not need this and local argument. stef > Hani Abdeen wrote > > > > Hello, > > > > I'm using cogwin/Croquet VM (last version > > http://www.mirandabanda.org/files/Cog/VM/VM.r2522/) on windows7, > > and today I had this probelm: when the size of the pharo image become so > > large the VM crashes with reason 'out of memory'. > > The same problem with previous versions of cogwin. > > Note that I use a PC with 8G of RAM, so it's really damage to have such a > > problem. > > > > Any idea about another VM working well on Windows and does not have such > > an > > issues? > > Any urgent solution? > > > > Thanks, > > Hani > > > > From this thread: > http://forum.world.st/experience-with-large-images-td4101765.html > > It seems that on windows the size of the image by default is limited to > 500MB in RAM. I don't know if you can change it or not. Linux/Mac is > limited to 2GB. Can you try your experiments on a Mac? > > Unfortunately no, I've not Mac, and the company for which I'll use Moose on their software, Tomorrow morning :(, do not use Mac. > > > > > -- > View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/cogwin-Croquet-Win7-Moose-very-large-models-crash-out… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > >

Jan. 26, 2012