September 2011 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] about Shout default to shout any text?

by Lukas Renggli

>> No, #shoutEnabled returning true makes it enabled. > > shoutEnabled return true if Shout classes are installed in the system. This is a bug then. #okToStyle should never be called when Shout is not installed. #shoutEnabled returns true, if the model might request highlighting. I suggested Alain to remove it, I don't think it was ever used. > (model respondsTo: #shoutAboutToStyle:) > Â Â Â Â ifFalse: [^true]. > > which shout the text if the model do not know #shoutAboutToStyle: No. The interaction is different: 1. TextMorph changes its contents. 2. TextMorph notifies its styler withe the morph and its model that there might be the need to style. 3. The styles does whatever it wants to do: - The null styler might ignore the request. - The ShoutStyler calls #shoutAboutToStyle: on the model to ask if and how to style (earlier versions also called #okToStyle before they called #shoutAboutToStyle:). - The ShoutStyler might also decide to auto format the text. I believe earlier versions of Shout could do that. Lukas -- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch

Sept. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] about Shout default to shout any text?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

>> >> >> The inspector is shouted because the "not to shout" was the default behavior >> of Shout, but now, >> okToStyle >> self shoutEnabled >> ifFalse: [^ false]. >> (model respondsTo: #shoutAboutToStyle:) >> ifFalse: [^true]. >> ^model shoutAboutToStyle: self >> the bold part make the default behavior "to shout". >> So maybe this value should be changed. But let's wait for Alain explanation > > No, #shoutEnabled returning true makes it enabled. I do not get it okToStyle self shoutEnabled ifFalse: [^ false]. (model respondsTo: #shoutAboutToStyle:) ifFalse: [^true]. ^model shoutAboutToStyle: self shoutEnabled ^ self class shoutEnabled shoutEnabled ^ (Smalltalk globals includesKey: #SHPreferences) and: [(Smalltalk globals at: #SHPreferences) enabled] so when shout is loaded self shoutEnabled = true self shoutEnabled ifFalse: [^ false]. So okToStyle will return true when the method shoutAboutToStyle: is not defined (model respondsTo: #shoutAboutToStyle:) ifFalse: [^true]. and this is this default that I'm talking about. Because if we would return false then only places that specifically define shoutAboutToStyle would be styled. No? Stef

Sept. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] about Shout default to shout any text?

by Benjamin

On Sep 4, 2011, at 2:08 PM, Lukas Renggli wrote: > On 4 September 2011 14:05, Benjamin > <benjamin.vanryseghem.pharo(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> On Sep 4, 2011, at 1:53 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: >> >> On Sep 4, 2011, at 1:00 PM, Lukas Renggli wrote: >> >> On 4 September 2011 12:18, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> >> wrote: >> >> On Sep 4, 2011, at 11:11 AM, Lukas Renggli wrote: >> >> Now may be the default should be inverted. >> >> Not styled by default else we should really have a look at all the places >> where we should not shout and fix them. >> >> Because it looks strange to have a red text in inspector left pane >> especially when shout tries to parse anOrderedCollection (........) >> >> Do you do that in OB? >> >> Yes, by default all panes in OB are not shouted. If you load the >> >> package OB-Shout it adds a couple of #shoutAboutToStyle: methods to >> >> the models of the editors that require highlighting. The >> >> #shoutAboutToStyle: methods configure Shout as necessary with the >> >> class, extra bindings required, etc. Depending on the contents of the >> >> text pane (class def, method def, comment) Shout is configured >> >> differently, or even disabled. >> >> It is great that Alan is restoring this previous behavior again, >> >> because it made the system truly extensible (also with alternative >> >> highlighters like the PP based variation of Shout that Helvetia was >> >> using). >> >> sure we did not break it on purpose just lack of documentation. >> >> I did not say that. >> >> I know :) >> >> It is kind of surprising not to notice all the >> >> #shoutAboutToStyle: everywhere that are suddenly not used anymore :-/ >> >> learning is difficult when you have to learn too many things at once. >> You take the first actions that works and since it works your mental model >> does not push you >> to look for a better solution. Now with the help that alain is preparing >> then >> we will just read it, say ahhahah ok and behave correctly. >> >> >> Now my point is that may be in addition the default behavior should be not >> to style. >> >> else we will have to put a aboutToStyle to any model that do not care about >> shoutatall. >> >> Not to style was the default behavior of Shout. >> >> ah ok. >> I do not understand then why the inspector shouts some unwanted text. I will >> have a look during one boring meetings one of these >> day. >> >> >> The inspector is shouted because the "not to shout" was the default behavior >> of Shout, but now, >> okToStyle >> self shoutEnabled >> ifFalse: [^ false]. >> (model respondsTo: #shoutAboutToStyle:) >> ifFalse: [^true]. >> ^model shoutAboutToStyle: self >> the bold part make the default behavior "to shout". >> So maybe this value should be changed. But let's wait for Alain explanation > No, #shoutEnabled returning true makes it enabled. > shoutEnabled return true if Shout classes are installed in the system. but I was talking about (model respondsTo: #shoutAboutToStyle:) ifFalse: [^true]. which shout the text if the model do not know #shoutAboutToStyle: Ben > Lukas > > -- > Lukas Renggli > www.lukas-renggli.ch >

Sept. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] about Shout default to shout any text?

by Lukas Renggli

On 4 September 2011 14:05, Benjamin <benjamin.vanryseghem.pharo(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > On Sep 4, 2011, at 1:53 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > > On Sep 4, 2011, at 1:00 PM, Lukas Renggli wrote: > > On 4 September 2011 12:18, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> > wrote: > > On Sep 4, 2011, at 11:11 AM, Lukas Renggli wrote: > > Now may be the default should be inverted. > > Not styled by default else we should really have a look at all the places > where we should not shout and fix them. > > Because it looks strange to have a red text in inspector left pane > especially when shout tries to parse anOrderedCollection (........) > > Do you do that in OB? > > Yes, by default all panes in OB are not shouted. If you load the > > package OB-Shout it adds a couple of #shoutAboutToStyle: methods to > > the models of the editors that require highlighting. The > > #shoutAboutToStyle: methods configure Shout as necessary with the > > class, extra bindings required, etc. Depending on the contents of the > > text pane (class def, method def, comment) Shout is configured > > differently, or even disabled. > > It is great that Alan is restoring this previous behavior again, > > because it made the system truly extensible (also with alternative > > highlighters like the PP based variation of Shout that Helvetia was > > using). > > sure we did not break it on purpose just lack of documentation. > > I did not say that. > > I know :) > > It is kind of surprising not to notice all the > > #shoutAboutToStyle: everywhere that are suddenly not used anymore :-/ > > learning is difficult when you have to learn too many things at once. > You take the first actions that works and since it works your mental model > does not push you > to look for a better solution. Now with the help that alain is preparing > then > we will just read it, say ahhahah ok and behave correctly. > > > Now my point is that may be in addition the default behavior should be not > to style. > > else we will have to put a aboutToStyle to any model that do not care about > shoutatall. > > Not to style was the default behavior of Shout. > > ah ok. > I do not understand then why the inspector shouts some unwanted text. I will > have a look during one boring meetings one of these > day. > > > The inspector is shouted because the "not to shout" was the default behavior > of Shout, but now, > okToStyle > self shoutEnabled > ifFalse: [^ false]. > (model respondsTo: #shoutAboutToStyle:) > ifFalse: [^true]. > ^model shoutAboutToStyle: self > the bold part make the default behavior "to shout". > So maybe this value should be changed. But let's wait for Alain explanation No, #shoutEnabled returning true makes it enabled. Lukas -- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch

Sept. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] about Shout default to shout any text?

by Benjamin

On Sep 4, 2011, at 1:53 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > > On Sep 4, 2011, at 1:00 PM, Lukas Renggli wrote: > >> On 4 September 2011 12:18, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >>> >>> On Sep 4, 2011, at 11:11 AM, Lukas Renggli wrote: >>> >>>>> Now may be the default should be inverted. >>>>> Not styled by default else we should really have a look at all the places where we should not shout and fix them. >>>>> Because it looks strange to have a red text in inspector left pane especially when shout tries to parse anOrderedCollection (........) >>>>> >>>>> Do you do that in OB? >>>> >>>> Yes, by default all panes in OB are not shouted. If you load the >>>> package OB-Shout it adds a couple of #shoutAboutToStyle: methods to >>>> the models of the editors that require highlighting. The >>>> #shoutAboutToStyle: methods configure Shout as necessary with the >>>> class, extra bindings required, etc. Depending on the contents of the >>>> text pane (class def, method def, comment) Shout is configured >>>> differently, or even disabled. >>>> >>>> It is great that Alan is restoring this previous behavior again, >>>> because it made the system truly extensible (also with alternative >>>> highlighters like the PP based variation of Shout that Helvetia was >>>> using). >>> >>> sure we did not break it on purpose just lack of documentation. >> >> I did not say that. > > I know :) > >> It is kind of surprising not to notice all the >> #shoutAboutToStyle: everywhere that are suddenly not used anymore :-/ > > learning is difficult when you have to learn too many things at once. > You take the first actions that works and since it works your mental model does not push you > to look for a better solution. Now with the help that alain is preparing then > we will just read it, say ahhahah ok and behave correctly. > >> >>> Now my point is that may be in addition the default behavior should be not to style. >>> else we will have to put a aboutToStyle to any model that do not care about shoutatall. >> >> Not to style was the default behavior of Shout. > > ah ok. > I do not understand then why the inspector shouts some unwanted text. I will have a look during one boring meetings one of these > day. The inspector is shouted because the "not to shout" was the default behavior of Shout, but now, okToStyle self shoutEnabled ifFalse: [^ false]. (model respondsTo: #shoutAboutToStyle:) ifFalse: [^true]. ^model shoutAboutToStyle: self the bold part make the default behavior "to shout". So maybe this value should be changed. But let's wait for Alain explanation :) Ben > >> >> Lukas >> >>> Stef >>>> >>>> Lukas >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Lukas Renggli >>>> www.lukas-renggli.ch >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Lukas Renggli >> www.lukas-renggli.ch >> > >

Sept. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] about Shout default to shout any text?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On Sep 4, 2011, at 1:00 PM, Lukas Renggli wrote: > On 4 September 2011 12:18, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >> >> On Sep 4, 2011, at 11:11 AM, Lukas Renggli wrote: >> >>>> Now may be the default should be inverted. >>>> Not styled by default else we should really have a look at all the places where we should not shout and fix them. >>>> Because it looks strange to have a red text in inspector left pane especially when shout tries to parse anOrderedCollection (........) >>>> >>>> Do you do that in OB? >>> >>> Yes, by default all panes in OB are not shouted. If you load the >>> package OB-Shout it adds a couple of #shoutAboutToStyle: methods to >>> the models of the editors that require highlighting. The >>> #shoutAboutToStyle: methods configure Shout as necessary with the >>> class, extra bindings required, etc. Depending on the contents of the >>> text pane (class def, method def, comment) Shout is configured >>> differently, or even disabled. >>> >>> It is great that Alan is restoring this previous behavior again, >>> because it made the system truly extensible (also with alternative >>> highlighters like the PP based variation of Shout that Helvetia was >>> using). >> >> sure we did not break it on purpose just lack of documentation. > > I did not say that. I know :) > It is kind of surprising not to notice all the > #shoutAboutToStyle: everywhere that are suddenly not used anymore :-/ learning is difficult when you have to learn too many things at once. You take the first actions that works and since it works your mental model does not push you to look for a better solution. Now with the help that alain is preparing then we will just read it, say ahhahah ok and behave correctly. > >> Now my point is that may be in addition the default behavior should be not to style. >> else we will have to put a aboutToStyle to any model that do not care about shoutatall. > > Not to style was the default behavior of Shout. ah ok. I do not understand then why the inspector shouts some unwanted text. I will have a look during one boring meetings one of these day. > > Lukas > >> Stef >>> >>> Lukas >>> >>> -- >>> Lukas Renggli >>> www.lukas-renggli.ch >>> >> >> >> > > > > -- > Lukas Renggli > www.lukas-renggli.ch >

Sept. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] about Shout default to shout any text?

by Lukas Renggli

On 4 September 2011 12:18, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > On Sep 4, 2011, at 11:11 AM, Lukas Renggli wrote: > >>> Now may be the default should be inverted. >>> Not styled by default else we should really have a look at all the places where we should not shout and fix them. >>> Because it looks strange to have a red text in inspector left pane especially when shout tries to parse anOrderedCollection (........) >>> >>> Do you do that in OB? >> >> Yes, by default all panes in OB are not shouted. If you load the >> package OB-Shout it adds a couple of #shoutAboutToStyle: methods to >> the models of the editors that require highlighting. The >> #shoutAboutToStyle: methods configure Shout as necessary with the >> class, extra bindings required, etc. Depending on the contents of the >> text pane (class def, method def, comment) Shout is configured >> differently, or even disabled. >> >> It is great that Alan is restoring this previous behavior again, >> because it made the system truly extensible (also with alternative >> highlighters like the PP based variation of Shout that Helvetia was >> using). > > sure we did not break it on purpose just lack of documentation. I did not say that. It is kind of surprising not to notice all the #shoutAboutToStyle: everywhere that are suddenly not used anymore :-/ > Now my point is that may be in addition the default behavior should be not to style. > else we will have to put a aboutToStyle to any model that do not care about shoutatall. Not to style was the default behavior of Shout. Lukas > Stef >> >> Lukas >> >> -- >> Lukas Renggli >> www.lukas-renggli.ch >> > > > -- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch

Sept. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] about Shout default to shout any text?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On Sep 4, 2011, at 11:11 AM, Lukas Renggli wrote: >> Now may be the default should be inverted. >> Not styled by default else we should really have a look at all the places where we should not shout and fix them. >> Because it looks strange to have a red text in inspector left pane especially when shout tries to parse anOrderedCollection (........) >> >> Do you do that in OB? > > Yes, by default all panes in OB are not shouted. If you load the > package OB-Shout it adds a couple of #shoutAboutToStyle: methods to > the models of the editors that require highlighting. The > #shoutAboutToStyle: methods configure Shout as necessary with the > class, extra bindings required, etc. Depending on the contents of the > text pane (class def, method def, comment) Shout is configured > differently, or even disabled. > > It is great that Alan is restoring this previous behavior again, > because it made the system truly extensible (also with alternative > highlighters like the PP based variation of Shout that Helvetia was > using). sure we did not break it on purpose just lack of documentation. Now my point is that may be in addition the default behavior should be not to style. else we will have to put a aboutToStyle to any model that do not care about shoutatall. Stef > > Lukas > > -- > Lukas Renggli > www.lukas-renggli.ch >

Sept. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Glamour configuration doesn't load in Pharo 1.3

by Lukas Renggli

> Strange indeed. The thing is that in my image, these methods are not extensions. So, I cannot see why they would not load. > > In any case, Glamour was always loaded in the Dev image. Ok, I do not use the "official" dev image, but then again it worked up until a few days ago. Something must have changed in some of the dependent packages. Lukas -- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch

Sept. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] about Shout default to shout any text?

by Lukas Renggli

> Now may be the default should be inverted. > Not styled by default else we should really have a look at all the places where we should not shout and fix them. > Because it looks strange to have a red text in inspector left pane especially when shout tries to parse anOrderedCollection (........) > > Do you do that in OB? Yes, by default all panes in OB are not shouted. If you load the package OB-Shout it adds a couple of #shoutAboutToStyle: methods to the models of the editors that require highlighting. The #shoutAboutToStyle: methods configure Shout as necessary with the class, extra bindings required, etc. Depending on the contents of the text pane (class def, method def, comment) Shout is configured differently, or even disabled. It is great that Alan is restoring this previous behavior again, because it made the system truly extensible (also with alternative highlighters like the PP based variation of Shout that Helvetia was using). Lukas -- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch

Sept. 4, 2011