May 2011 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Circle is gone

by Igor Stasenko

There is an EllipseMorph and CircleMorph. Also, if you wanna draw circles directly using canvas you can use #fillOval: fillStyle: borderWidth: borderColor: message sent to canvas. On 18 May 2011 17:04, Damien Cassou <damien.cassou(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Wed, May 18, 2011 at 4:59 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor.girba(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> Hmm, I did not see the discussion. > > Can't find any thread or issue about it. > > -- > Damien Cassou > http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st > > "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them > popular by not having them." James Iry > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

May 18, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] [Vm-dev] Re: out of memory - cog on windows

by Igor Stasenko

On 18 May 2011 17:08, Tudor Girba <tudor.girba(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi, > > On 18 May 2011, at 16:51, Levente Uzonyi wrote: > >> On Wed, 18 May 2011, Tudor Girba wrote: >> >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> On 18 May 2011, at 16:30, Levente Uzonyi wrote: >>> >>>> On Wed, 18 May 2011, Tudor Girba wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Is there a possibility to have any sort of answer on this topic? >>>>> >>>>> It looks to me like this bug is critical given that it prevents us to work with images larger than some 200M. >>>> >>>> IMHO it's a problem on the image side. Change the behavior of #lowSpaceWatcher to fix the problem. >>> >>> How would you do it? :) >> >> According to Igor's mail, the UI process is suspended by the low space watcher, which prevents you from seeing the cause of the problem. So, for example you could wake up the UI process if that was suspended by the VM and/or log some info about the situation. This won't save your image, but since it works on non-windows VMs, that's not a problem. > > Thanks for the reply. Unfortunately, I do not know how to do that. > > Furthermore, it's not about one image. These images are produced automatically several times per day, and people want to be able to download them and play with the data inside. > > And again, having a 200M image cannot be so unusual. I tried in multiple situations to simply generate a large enough image and it won't open. > >>> And if it is an image problem, why does it only appear on Windows? >> >> Are you using the same VMs (interpreter/cog, version number matches, etc)? If you didn't try so far, then open the image with the latest interpreter VM on windows, it has some extra checks for allocations which is not implemented in Cog yet. > > I tried with several versions of Cog including the latest ones (on both platforms) and I got the same result. I did not try with an interpreter VM because I only have Cog images around (based on Pharo 1.2) and they are not compatible. > @Eliot, can you comment or recommend something concerning this issue? > Cheers, > Doru > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

May 18, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] A lil simplification of MorphTreeNodeMorph

by Igor Stasenko

On 18 May 2011 17:15, Tudor Girba <tudor.girba(a)gmail.com> wrote: > I just tried to load Glamorous Toolkit and run "GTCoder open" in a Pharo 1.3 and the tree does not fill the space horizontally. This prompted my mail. > We just checked it with Marcus, and yes, this stuff are already integrated into 1.3. About bugs you mentioning, it is hard to say. I remember there was a little piece of code which i forced to remove because it worked well in 1.2 images but caused complete layout mess in 1.3. Maybe it is because of it. Can you send a screenshot? > Cheers, > Doru > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

May 18, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] A lil simplification of MorphTreeNodeMorph

by Tudor Girba

I just tried to load Glamorous Toolkit and run "GTCoder open" in a Pharo 1.3 and the tree does not fill the space horizontally. This prompted my mail. Cheers, Doru On 18 May 2011, at 17:10, Igor Stasenko wrote: > On 18 May 2011 14:14, Tudor Girba <tudor.girba(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> Hi, >> >> In this thread, there were several cs proposed. I thought they were integrated in 1.3, but they do not seem to be there. >> >> I was so looking forward to using them :). Igor, could you take a look? >> > > hmm.. strange.. i thought we are integrated it. > >> Cheers, >> Doru >> >> > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko AKA sig. > -- www.tudorgirba.com "To lead is not to demand things, it is to make them happen."

May 18, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] RDF Framework and Pharo

by Laszlo Zsolt Kiss

Dear Pharoers! Many thanks for you.Your helping is quick and great. Best wishes Laszlo Zsolt Kiss

May 18, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] A lil simplification of MorphTreeNodeMorph

by Igor Stasenko

On 18 May 2011 14:14, Tudor Girba <tudor.girba(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi, > > In this thread, there were several cs proposed. I thought they were integrated in 1.3, but they do not seem to be there. > > I was so looking forward to using them :). Igor, could you take a look? > hmm.. strange.. i thought we are integrated it. > Cheers, > Doru > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

May 18, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] [Vm-dev] Re: out of memory - cog on windows

by Tudor Girba

Hi, On 18 May 2011, at 16:51, Levente Uzonyi wrote: > On Wed, 18 May 2011, Tudor Girba wrote: > >> >> Hi, >> >> On 18 May 2011, at 16:30, Levente Uzonyi wrote: >> >>> On Wed, 18 May 2011, Tudor Girba wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Is there a possibility to have any sort of answer on this topic? >>>> >>>> It looks to me like this bug is critical given that it prevents us to work with images larger than some 200M. >>> >>> IMHO it's a problem on the image side. Change the behavior of #lowSpaceWatcher to fix the problem. >> >> How would you do it? :) > > According to Igor's mail, the UI process is suspended by the low space watcher, which prevents you from seeing the cause of the problem. So, for example you could wake up the UI process if that was suspended by the VM and/or log some info about the situation. This won't save your image, but since it works on non-windows VMs, that's not a problem. Thanks for the reply. Unfortunately, I do not know how to do that. Furthermore, it's not about one image. These images are produced automatically several times per day, and people want to be able to download them and play with the data inside. And again, having a 200M image cannot be so unusual. I tried in multiple situations to simply generate a large enough image and it won't open. >> And if it is an image problem, why does it only appear on Windows? > > Are you using the same VMs (interpreter/cog, version number matches, etc)? If you didn't try so far, then open the image with the latest interpreter VM on windows, it has some extra checks for allocations which is not implemented in Cog yet. I tried with several versions of Cog including the latest ones (on both platforms) and I got the same result. I did not try with an interpreter VM because I only have Cog images around (based on Pharo 1.2) and they are not compatible. Cheers, Doru > > Levente > >> >> >> Cheers, >> Doru >> >> >> >>> >>> Levente >>> >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> Tudor >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 16 May 2011, at 11:06, Tudor Girba wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi Igor, >>>>> >>>>> Thanks a lot for looking into this. For us (around Moose), this is a critical issue because we play with our models in memory and regularly have images of several hundred megabytes. While most of us work on Mac without a problem, some other people work on Windows and this is a bottleneck. >>>>> >>>>> Unfortunately, I do not have enough know-how to dive into the VM, but I would be gladly help in any way I can. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> Doru >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 16 May 2011, at 10:50, Igor Stasenko wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On 10 May 2011 09:34, Tudor Girba <tudor.girba(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I am back with some more input on the matter. We played with it, and found that basically any image that goes beyond something like 200MB limit (or maybe it's the number of objects), will not open on Windows. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I would need some help on this. Has nobody else hit this wall, or is it that I am doing something wrong? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> One scenario that we used to reproduce the problem looks like this: >>>>>>> 1. Take a Moose image: >>>>>>> http://hudson.moosetechnology.org/job/moose-latest-dev/lastSuccessfulBuild/… >>>>>>> 2. Run: >>>>>>> 1 to: 3 do: [ :i | MooseScripts createModelForConfigurationOfMoose ] >>>>>>> This will basically create some 850000 objects and will get the image to some 400+MB >>>>>>> 3. Save and quit the image >>>>>>> 4. Reopen it >>>>>>> >>>>>>> A ready-made image with the result of this can be found here: >>>>>>> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/18323746/Tmp/moose-case-study-windows-problem.zip >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This works well on Mac, but on Windows when you reopen the image, you get the out of memory message. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>> Doru >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I using latest VMs built by cmake on windows, and everytime i run this image, >>>>>> it opens a 'Space is low' dialog and then image not reacting on anything. >>>>>> VM not crashing however and responds to windows events.. But because >>>>>> UI process is broken >>>>>> an image simply not reacts to anything. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I think that the problem is that this dialog are shown at early image >>>>>> startup time, >>>>>> before everything is properly initialized, and because of that UI >>>>>> stalls somewhere. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Next things which i tried is to increase a virtual memory limit in >>>>>> sqWin32Alloc.h >>>>>> >>>>>> #ifndef MAX_VIRTUAL_MEMORY >>>>>> #define MAX_VIRTUAL_MEMORY 512*1024*1024 >>>>>> #endif >>>>>> >>>>>> first i raised it to 768 Mbytes.. same behavior. >>>>>> then i raised it to 1Gb and again same behavior.. >>>>>> >>>>>> So, either this constant is overridden somewhere or it actually >>>>>> doesn't affecting the low-space detection mechanism as i would expect. >>>>>> Any suggestions? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I will continue looking , what happens on VM side, >>>>>> but in addition to that, i think we should do something on image side as well: >>>>>> - a low space watcher should not pop up before passing image startup, >>>>>> because if preempted process is UI process (and in 99.99% cases it is), >>>>>> then it means that low space watcher blocks UI process and as a consequence, >>>>>> your image stops handling events. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Also, i thinking about different approach for signaling a low space condition. >>>>>> Instead of signaling a low space semaphore, what VM could do is to >>>>>> fail an allocation primitive >>>>>> and set the error code to "low memory warning" >>>>>> then a primitive failure code could actually throw an exception, which >>>>>> then could be handled as usual... >>>>>> so you could write a code, like: >>>>>> >>>>>> [ self allocateSomethingReallyHuge ] on: LowMemoryWarning do: [:err | >>>>>> self shouldWeReallyCare ifFalse: [ self tellVMThatItsOk. err resume ] >>>>>> ifTrue: [ err pass ] >>>>>> ] >>>>>> >>>>>> Because by preempting a currently active process, which "possibly" >>>>>> causing a memory problems is not a solution, >>>>>> as you can see, if it happens during startup phase, then you it just >>>>>> stucks and image hangs. >>>>>> But if we could use exceptions, we could just ignore this warning (or >>>>>> do something else) during image startup, >>>>>> instead of blocking UI process , showing a useless popup message and >>>>>> letting image hang like that. >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>> Igor Stasenko AKA sig. >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> www.tudorgirba.com >>>>> >>>>> "If you interrupt the barber while he is cutting your hair, >>>>> you will end up with a messy haircut." >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> www.tudorgirba.com >>>> >>>> "Obvious things are difficult to teach." >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >> >> -- >> www.tudorgirba.com >> >> "Next time you see your life passing by, say 'hi' and get to know her." >> >> >> >> -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing should have the right to be different."

May 18, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] [Vm-dev] Re: out of memory - cog on windows

by Igor Stasenko

On 18 May 2011 16:51, Levente Uzonyi <leves(a)elte.hu> wrote: > > On Wed, 18 May 2011, Tudor Girba wrote: > >> >> Hi, >> >> On 18 May 2011, at 16:30, Levente Uzonyi wrote: >> >>> On Wed, 18 May 2011, Tudor Girba wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Is there a possibility to have any sort of answer on this topic? >>>> >>>> It looks to me like this bug is critical given that it prevents us to >>>> work with images larger than some 200M. >>> >>> IMHO it's a problem on the image side. Change the behavior of >>> #lowSpaceWatcher to fix the problem. >> >> How would you do it? :) > > According to Igor's mail, the UI process is suspended by the low space > watcher, which prevents you from seeing the cause of the problem. So, for > example you could wake up the UI process if that was suspended by the VM > and/or log some info about the situation. This won't save your image, but > since it works on non-windows VMs, that's not a problem. > Yes. I don't want to change the low-space signaling locgic in VM, since it works not only just for Windows but for other systems. It could be possible that Windows-specific code either reports wrong memory limit (which triggers low-space logic sooner than expected, even when you set the hardcoded virtual memory allocation to be much higher), or actually there is not enough address space on windows, and requesting to allocate contiguous 1Gb address space fails, and actually VM forced to use smaller address space for object memory. But then i would expect another failure, because a reasonably big image (>512Mb) could even not fit into memory during image startup, because there's not enough address space. >> >> And if it is an image problem, why does it only appear on Windows? > > Are you using the same VMs (interpreter/cog, version number matches, etc)? > If you didn't try so far, then open the image with the latest interpreter VM > on windows, it has some extra checks for allocations which is not > implemented in Cog yet. > > > Levente > >> >> >> Cheers, >> Doru >> >> >> >>> >>> Levente >>> >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> Tudor >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 16 May 2011, at 11:06, Tudor Girba wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi Igor, >>>>> >>>>> Thanks a lot for looking into this. For us (around Moose), this is a >>>>> critical issue because we play with our models in memory and regularly have >>>>> images of several hundred megabytes. While most of us work on Mac without a >>>>> problem, some other people work on Windows and this is a bottleneck. >>>>> >>>>> Unfortunately, I do not have enough know-how to dive into the VM, but I >>>>> would be gladly help in any way I can. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> Doru >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 16 May 2011, at 10:50, Igor Stasenko wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On 10 May 2011 09:34, Tudor Girba <tudor.girba(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I am back with some more input on the matter. We played with it, and >>>>>>> found that basically any image that goes beyond something like 200MB limit >>>>>>> (or maybe it's the number of objects), will not open on Windows. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I would need some help on this. Has nobody else hit this wall, or is >>>>>>> it that I am doing something wrong? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> One scenario that we used to reproduce the problem looks like this: >>>>>>> 1. Take a Moose image: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://hudson.moosetechnology.org/job/moose-latest-dev/lastSuccessfulBuild/… >>>>>>> 2. Run: >>>>>>> 1 to: 3 do: [ :i | MooseScripts createModelForConfigurationOfMoose ] >>>>>>> This will basically create some 850000 objects and will get the image >>>>>>> to some 400+MB >>>>>>> 3. Save and quit the image >>>>>>> 4. Reopen it >>>>>>> >>>>>>> A ready-made image with the result of this can be found here: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/18323746/Tmp/moose-case-study-windows-problem.zip >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This works well on Mac, but on Windows when you reopen the image, you >>>>>>> get the out of memory message. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>> Doru >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I using latest VMs built by cmake on windows, and everytime i run this >>>>>> image, >>>>>> it opens a 'Space is low' dialog and then image not reacting on >>>>>> anything. >>>>>> VM not crashing however and responds to windows events.. But because >>>>>> UI process is broken >>>>>> an image simply not reacts to anything. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I think that the problem is that this dialog are shown at early image >>>>>> startup time, >>>>>> before everything is properly initialized, and because of that UI >>>>>> stalls somewhere. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Next things which i tried is to increase a virtual memory limit in >>>>>> sqWin32Alloc.h >>>>>> >>>>>> #ifndef MAX_VIRTUAL_MEMORY >>>>>> #define MAX_VIRTUAL_MEMORY 512*1024*1024 >>>>>> #endif >>>>>> >>>>>> first i raised it to 768 Mbytes.. same behavior. >>>>>> then i raised it to 1Gb and again same behavior.. >>>>>> >>>>>> So, either this constant is overridden somewhere or it actually >>>>>> doesn't affecting the low-space detection mechanism as i would expect. >>>>>> Any suggestions? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I will continue looking , what happens on VM side, >>>>>> but in addition to that, i think we should do something on image side >>>>>> as well: >>>>>> - a low space watcher should not pop up before passing image startup, >>>>>> because if preempted process is UI process (and in 99.99% cases it >>>>>> is), >>>>>> then it means that low space watcher blocks UI process and as a >>>>>> consequence, >>>>>> your image stops handling events. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Also, i thinking about different approach for signaling a low space >>>>>> condition. >>>>>> Instead of signaling a low space semaphore, what VM could do is to >>>>>> fail an allocation primitive >>>>>> and set the error code to "low memory warning" >>>>>> then a primitive failure code could actually throw an exception, which >>>>>> then could be handled as usual... >>>>>> so you could write a code, like: >>>>>> >>>>>> [ self allocateSomethingReallyHuge ] on: LowMemoryWarning do: [:err | >>>>>> self shouldWeReallyCare ifFalse: [ self tellVMThatItsOk. err resume ] >>>>>> ifTrue: [ err pass ] >>>>>> ] >>>>>> >>>>>> Because by preempting a currently active process, which "possibly" >>>>>> causing a memory problems is not a solution, >>>>>> as you can see, if it happens during startup phase, then you it just >>>>>> stucks and image hangs. >>>>>> But if we could use exceptions, we could just ignore this warning (or >>>>>> do something else) during image startup, >>>>>> instead of blocking UI process , showing a useless popup message and >>>>>> letting image hang like that. >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>> Igor Stasenko AKA sig. >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> www.tudorgirba.com >>>>> >>>>> "If you interrupt the barber while he is cutting your hair, >>>>> you will end up with a messy haircut." >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> www.tudorgirba.com >>>> >>>> "Obvious things are difficult to teach." >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >> >> -- >> www.tudorgirba.com >> >> "Next time you see your life passing by, say 'hi' and get to know her." >> >> >> >> > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

May 18, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Circle is gone

by Damien Cassou

On Wed, May 18, 2011 at 4:59 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor.girba(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hmm, I did not see the discussion. Can't find any thread or issue about it. -- Damien Cassou http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them popular by not having them." James Iry

May 18, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Circle is gone

by Tudor Girba

Hmm, I did not see the discussion. So, does it mean that we should rescue the old classes and put them in a separate package? Cheers, Doru On 18 May 2011, at 16:42, Alexandre Bergel wrote: > There is no user of these classes in a 1.2. And nobody shouted against its removal. > This was a reason good enough to remove them :-) > > Alexandre > > > On 18 May 2011, at 10:36, Tudor Girba wrote: > >> I guess there was a reason behind removing them, and I also guess that the best way would be to find what is the other preferred solution besides adding them back :). Or was there removal a mistake? >> >> Cheers, >> Doru >> >> >> On 18 May 2011, at 16:08, Alexandre Bergel wrote: >> >>> I also bumped into the same problem. For the case of Mondrian, I will copy the missing classes into Mondrian. >>> These classes were removed quite some times ago from Pharo 1.3 >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Alexandre >>> >>> >>> On 18 May 2011, at 08:54, Tudor Girba wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Circle seems to be gone from Pharo 1.3. >>>> >>>> What is now the preferred way to specify a circle? >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> Doru >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> www.tudorgirba.com >>>> >>>> "When people care, great things can happen." >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> www.tudorgirba.com >> >> "We cannot reach the flow of things unless we let go." >> >> >> >> > > -- > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > > > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Be rather willing to give than demanding to get."

May 18, 2011