May 2011 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

[Pharo-project] Think about migration upfront! (was Re: squeaksource is down - a different perspective)

by Janko MivÅ¡ek

I think we should learn very carefully from Gemstone migration experiences to develop our Smalltalk systems *upfront* with migration in mind. Just see all recent (or less recent) examples: MC2 seems too radical to be easily migrated from MC1 and obviously designed without migration in mind, SqueakSource as well, SS3 too? Such systems just don't have any chance to be accepted and old systems will live and live instead. So, don't develop just a "cool" stuff, take some time to think about migration and long-term maintenance issues as well, if you like that your system will be accepted with the community to your glory :) Janko On 27. 04. 2011 22:16, Dale Henrichs wrote: > Since you mention GemStone:) > > We have customers who have migrated repositories created 10+ years ago > with our 32 bit product to the latest current version of our 64 bit > product. > > We have changed our Smalltalk class-library over the years and customers > have had to upgrade their own class libraries if they chose to continue > taking advantage of our newer releases ... then there are some who have > chosen not to migrate: I think there are still production applications > running GemStone on a version 20 years old:) ... as long as their > hardware holds out they are fine:) > > Production customers don't tend to move very fast in upgrading their > hardware and software so we end up supporting older versions of oSes for > quite awhile...But when the os vendor announces and end of life of an > os, it becomes difficult for us to continue to support that version... > > For the older versions we backport critical bugfixes to the older > versions as long as their are active customers (read paying maintenance > dollars) using the older versions. > > Dale -- Janko MivÅ¡ek Aida/Web Smalltalk Web Application Server http://www.aidaweb.si

May 2, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] [Progress Report] Zinc HTTP Components

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

On 02 May 2011, at 09:51, Norbert Hartl wrote: > Am 01.05.2011 um 21:17 schrieb Sven Van Caekenberghe: > >> Thanks Lukas Renggli and Marcus Denker for adding Zn to their continuous integration servers. > > Just for the record: I have a zinc jenkins build for gemstone at > > https://hudson.selfish.org/job/zinc-gs/ > > It is triggered as soon as something is commited to the gemsource repository. > > Norbert Ai, sorry, Norbert, I knew I would be forgetting something, of course your build server (and the Gemstone port) are supercool as well ! Thx, Sven

May 2, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] [Progress Report] Zinc HTTP Components

by Norbert Hartl

Am 01.05.2011 um 21:17 schrieb Sven Van Caekenberghe: > Thanks Lukas Renggli and Marcus Denker for adding Zn to their continuous integration servers. Just for the record: I have a zinc jenkins build for gemstone at https://hudson.selfish.org/job/zinc-gs/ It is triggered as soon as something is commited to the gemsource repository. Norbert

May 2, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] System time

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Mon, May 2, 2011 at 12:56 AM, Andres Valloud < avalloud(a)smalltalk.comcastbiz.net> wrote: > Does the Windows VM depend on QueryPerformanceCounter()? I have no idea what that is, but a quick grep -n "QueryPerformanceCounte" -r ~/Pharo/vm/git/cogVMMaster/blessed/platforms tell me that not. > > > On 5/1/11 16:53 , Alexandre Bergel wrote: > >> Strange. I cannot produce this problem on OSX. >> >> Alexandre >> >> >> On 30 Apr 2011, at 22:15, Jimmie Houchin wrote: >> >> Hello, >>> >>> My OS for this application is Windows. On a freshly opened image, the >>> image and OS time are in sync. Over a period of time the image drifted 34 >>> seconds away from OS time. I do not know how long I had this image open, but >>> it has been a number of days, possibly a week plus. >>> >>> I saved the image and quit. I reopened the image and did DateAndTime now >>> and it was in sync with the OS once again. Same image, vm and OS that was >>> out of sync by 34 seconds only one minute before. >>> >>> I have opened an image on my server which is also running the latest cog >>> vm, the current Pharo 1.3 and Windows Vista. I am going to periodically do a >>> DateAndTime now to log the drift if any. Prior to opening this image I >>> updated the OS system clock with time.nist.gov which is about 1000 miles >>> away. >>> >>> I know that within a second or so it can be subject to my coordination of >>> doing DateAndTime now while watching my OS system clocks seconds. But 34 >>> seconds is beyond any subjective standards. >>> >>> The only reason I discovered this was while exploring how I want to >>> retrieve my data, act upon my data and then pause (Delay wait) until time to >>> repeat. >>> dtnow := DateAndTime now. >>> dtnext := DateAndTime year: 2011 month: 4 day: 30 hour: 11 minute: i >>> second: 5. "The next minute in the future" >>> (Delay forDuration: (dtnext - dtnow)) wait. >>> >>> I got an error, that Duration cannot be a negative number. As I processed >>> the debugger, I saw that dtnow was greater than dtnext. I watched the OS >>> clock and manually selected the next minute before I executed. However, I >>> was within that 34 second window. >>> >>> So now I am exploring the problem. >>> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> Jimmie >>> >>> On 4/30/2011 5:06 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote: >>> >>>> 'Time now' gives me the same result than OSX >>>> >>>> Alexandre >>>> >>>> >>>> On 30 Apr 2011, at 16:15, Jimmie Houchin wrote: >>>> >>>> On 4/30/2011 11:50 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I am developing a time sensitive application. I poll a server every >>>>>>> minute for new data. The data is time sensitive and the sooner I can get the >>>>>>> data to the release of the data the better. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I have noticed that Pharo's system time drifts away from the OS >>>>>>> system time. I would really like the Pharo system time to be the correct >>>>>>> time. >>>>>>> >>>>>> do you have a repeatable scenario? >>>>>> VM >>>>>> Image information. >>>>>> >>>>> Pharo 1.3 and the latest Cog. >>>>> >>>>> I have not been able to find where in Pharo I can call to update the >>>>>>> System clock to the correct time. >>>>>>> >>>>>> you can use OSProcess (only mac and linux) >>>>>> >>>>> No, that's not the problem. The OS clock is right. It's Pharo that has >>>>> drifted away from correct time. Regardless it would be nice if I have to >>>>> correct the OS clock, it would still be nice to resync Pharo with the OS, >>>>> keep both in sync and correct. What I am wanting is simply to resync the >>>>> Pharo clock with the OS clock. >>>>> >>>>> It seems that when the Pharo image is started that it gets the OS >>>>> System time, but keeps its own time after that. Now I do not know the >>>>> consequences of Pharo adjusting its time backward. If this isn't possible, >>>>> then I might have to do some workarounds to insure that I get my data in a >>>>> timely manner. >>>>> >>>>> The image I have been developing in is currently about 30 seconds ahead >>>>> of the OS clock. It is on my laptop. It might be due to the laptops sleep >>>>> and hibernation. I have not tested this on my server. >>>>> >>>>> That is the situation as best I know it. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks. >>>>> >>>>> Jimmie >>>>> >>>>> >>> >>> >> > -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

May 2, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] strange loop

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

:) still the debugger got in a funky state and I do not like that. Stef On May 1, 2011, at 11:31 PM, Igor Stasenko wrote: > On 1 May 2011 22:16, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >> >> On May 1, 2011, at 11:06 PM, Igor Stasenko wrote: >> >>> On 1 May 2011 21:38, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >>>> this is strange >>>> >>>> I was trying to code a simple list of method browser and my browser seems to >>>> >>>> MorphExtension>>valueOfProperty: aSymbol >>>> "answer the value of the receiver's property named aSymbol" >>>> ^ extension ifNotNil: [extension valueOfProperty: aSymbol] >>>> >>> hmm.. i have different implementation here: >>> >>> valueOfProperty: aSymbol >>> "answer the value of the receiver's property named aSymbol" >>> ^ self >>> valueOfProperty: aSymbol >>> ifAbsent: [] >>> >>> and there is no 'extension' ivar in MorphExtension class. >>> Or you changed something there? >> >> >> Not that I know. >> I was just in plain 13380 >> > > [OT].. wow.. my image is already 300 updates behind.. > What the ...! 300 updates. I mean 300. updates!!! > > And that is in scope of 1.3 development. :))) > > >> >>> >>>> I end up in a endless loop >>>> >>>> update: aParameter >>>> >>>> |state| >>>> aParameter ifNil: [^self]. >>>> getLabelSelector ifNotNil: [ >>>> aParameter == getLabelSelector ifTrue: [ >>>> (self labelMorph respondsTo: #font) >>>> ifTrue: [self label: (model perform: getLabelSelector) font: self labelMorph font] >>>> ifFalse: [self label: (model perform: getLabelSelector)]]]. >>>> state := self getModelState. >>>> (state ~= (self valueOfProperty: #lastState) or: [ >>>> ^^^ >>>> >>>> when I inspect self I get a PluggableButtonMorph >>>> but the method shown in the debugger is MoprhExtension?????? >>>> >>>> getStateSelector isNil and: [aParameter == #onOffColor]]) >>>> ifTrue: [self color: self colorToUse. >>>> self setProperty: #lastState toValue: state]. >>>> aParameter == getEnabledSelector ifTrue: [^self enabled: (model perform: getEnabledSelector)]. >>>> getColorSelector ifNotNil: [ | cc | >>>> color = (cc := model perform: getColorSelector) >>>> ifFalse: [ >>>> color := cc. >>>> self onColor: color offColor: color. >>>> self changed ]]. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Best regards, >>> Igor Stasenko AKA sig. >> >> >> > > > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko AKA sig. >

May 2, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] System time

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

thanks for the report. Stef On May 2, 2011, at 7:00 AM, Jimmie Houchin wrote: > I downloaded the latest Pharo 1.3 and Cog vm to my Vista server. > > I opened up a workspace and did the following at as precisely as my hand eye coordination allow at the top of the minute shown. > > The first time at the bottom shows exactly identical time with the OS clock. > The second time above it, show a 5 second gain in time in a little over 24 hours. > > I am going to let this image keep going and see how it continues. > > DateAndTime now. > 2011-05-01T23:45:05-05:00 lost 5 seconds since the below > 2011-04-30T20:16:00-05:00 opened Pharo and checked time. > > For me, this is now verified on 2 Windows Vista computers. One a laptop, and the other a Desktop machine I use as a server. Both are reasonably current Dells. The laptop with a duo-core processor and the desktop a quad-core processor. > > I have not done any attempts on any other OS. > > Thanks. > > Jimmie > > > > On 4/30/2011 12:03 PM, Jimmie Houchin wrote: >> I am developing a time sensitive application. I poll a server every minute for new data. The data is time sensitive and the sooner I can get the data to the release of the data the better. >> >> I have noticed that Pharo's system time drifts away from the OS system time. I would really like the Pharo system time to be the correct time. >> >> I have not been able to find where in Pharo I can call to update the System clock to the correct time. >> >> Any help greatly appreciated. >> >> Jimmie > >

May 2, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] System time

by Jimmie Houchin

I downloaded the latest Pharo 1.3 and Cog vm to my Vista server. I opened up a workspace and did the following at as precisely as my hand eye coordination allow at the top of the minute shown. The first time at the bottom shows exactly identical time with the OS clock. The second time above it, show a 5 second gain in time in a little over 24 hours. I am going to let this image keep going and see how it continues. DateAndTime now. 2011-05-01T23:45:05-05:00 lost 5 seconds since the below 2011-04-30T20:16:00-05:00 opened Pharo and checked time. For me, this is now verified on 2 Windows Vista computers. One a laptop, and the other a Desktop machine I use as a server. Both are reasonably current Dells. The laptop with a duo-core processor and the desktop a quad-core processor. I have not done any attempts on any other OS. Thanks. Jimmie On 4/30/2011 12:03 PM, Jimmie Houchin wrote: > I am developing a time sensitive application. I poll a server every > minute for new data. The data is time sensitive and the sooner I can > get the data to the release of the data the better. > > I have noticed that Pharo's system time drifts away from the OS system > time. I would really like the Pharo system time to be the correct time. > > I have not been able to find where in Pharo I can call to update the > System clock to the correct time. > > Any help greatly appreciated. > > Jimmie

May 2, 2011

[Pharo-project] right click on PluggableTreeMorph doesn't select

by Guillermo Polito

Hi! Let's say I have a PluggableTreeMorph with some options(a,b and c). Each option may show a menu when I do a right click. Buuut, If I have selected item a, and do a right clic on c, the menu shown is for a, not for c :(. I expect the right click to work on the item the click is done, not in the selected one :(. Is there a way to have this tree morph working as I want? Thanks in advance! Guille

May 2, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] System time

by Alexandre Bergel

Strange. I cannot produce this problem on OSX. Alexandre On 30 Apr 2011, at 22:15, Jimmie Houchin wrote: > Hello, > > My OS for this application is Windows. On a freshly opened image, the image and OS time are in sync. Over a period of time the image drifted 34 seconds away from OS time. I do not know how long I had this image open, but it has been a number of days, possibly a week plus. > > I saved the image and quit. I reopened the image and did DateAndTime now and it was in sync with the OS once again. Same image, vm and OS that was out of sync by 34 seconds only one minute before. > > I have opened an image on my server which is also running the latest cog vm, the current Pharo 1.3 and Windows Vista. I am going to periodically do a DateAndTime now to log the drift if any. Prior to opening this image I updated the OS system clock with time.nist.gov which is about 1000 miles away. > > I know that within a second or so it can be subject to my coordination of doing DateAndTime now while watching my OS system clocks seconds. But 34 seconds is beyond any subjective standards. > > The only reason I discovered this was while exploring how I want to retrieve my data, act upon my data and then pause (Delay wait) until time to repeat. > dtnow := DateAndTime now. > dtnext := DateAndTime year: 2011 month: 4 day: 30 hour: 11 minute: i second: 5. "The next minute in the future" > (Delay forDuration: (dtnext - dtnow)) wait. > > I got an error, that Duration cannot be a negative number. As I processed the debugger, I saw that dtnow was greater than dtnext. I watched the OS clock and manually selected the next minute before I executed. However, I was within that 34 second window. > > So now I am exploring the problem. > > Thanks. > > Jimmie > > On 4/30/2011 5:06 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote: >> 'Time now' gives me the same result than OSX >> >> Alexandre >> >> >> On 30 Apr 2011, at 16:15, Jimmie Houchin wrote: >> >>> On 4/30/2011 11:50 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: >>>>> I am developing a time sensitive application. I poll a server every minute for new data. The data is time sensitive and the sooner I can get the data to the release of the data the better. >>>>> >>>>> I have noticed that Pharo's system time drifts away from the OS system time. I would really like the Pharo system time to be the correct time. >>>> do you have a repeatable scenario? >>>> VM >>>> Image information. >>> Pharo 1.3 and the latest Cog. >>> >>>>> I have not been able to find where in Pharo I can call to update the System clock to the correct time. >>>> you can use OSProcess (only mac and linux) >>> No, that's not the problem. The OS clock is right. It's Pharo that has drifted away from correct time. Regardless it would be nice if I have to correct the OS clock, it would still be nice to resync Pharo with the OS, keep both in sync and correct. What I am wanting is simply to resync the Pharo clock with the OS clock. >>> >>> It seems that when the Pharo image is started that it gets the OS System time, but keeps its own time after that. Now I do not know the consequences of Pharo adjusting its time backward. If this isn't possible, then I might have to do some workarounds to insure that I get my data in a timely manner. >>> >>> The image I have been developing in is currently about 30 seconds ahead of the OS clock. It is on my laptop. It might be due to the laptops sleep and hibernation. I have not tested this on my server. >>> >>> That is the situation as best I know it. >>> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> Jimmie >>> > > -- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

May 1, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] System time

by Andres Valloud

Does the Windows VM depend on QueryPerformanceCounter()? On 5/1/11 16:53 , Alexandre Bergel wrote: > Strange. I cannot produce this problem on OSX. > > Alexandre > > > On 30 Apr 2011, at 22:15, Jimmie Houchin wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> My OS for this application is Windows. On a freshly opened image, the image and OS time are in sync. Over a period of time the image drifted 34 seconds away from OS time. I do not know how long I had this image open, but it has been a number of days, possibly a week plus. >> >> I saved the image and quit. I reopened the image and did DateAndTime now and it was in sync with the OS once again. Same image, vm and OS that was out of sync by 34 seconds only one minute before. >> >> I have opened an image on my server which is also running the latest cog vm, the current Pharo 1.3 and Windows Vista. I am going to periodically do a DateAndTime now to log the drift if any. Prior to opening this image I updated the OS system clock with time.nist.gov which is about 1000 miles away. >> >> I know that within a second or so it can be subject to my coordination of doing DateAndTime now while watching my OS system clocks seconds. But 34 seconds is beyond any subjective standards. >> >> The only reason I discovered this was while exploring how I want to retrieve my data, act upon my data and then pause (Delay wait) until time to repeat. >> dtnow := DateAndTime now. >> dtnext := DateAndTime year: 2011 month: 4 day: 30 hour: 11 minute: i second: 5. "The next minute in the future" >> (Delay forDuration: (dtnext - dtnow)) wait. >> >> I got an error, that Duration cannot be a negative number. As I processed the debugger, I saw that dtnow was greater than dtnext. I watched the OS clock and manually selected the next minute before I executed. However, I was within that 34 second window. >> >> So now I am exploring the problem. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Jimmie >> >> On 4/30/2011 5:06 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote: >>> 'Time now' gives me the same result than OSX >>> >>> Alexandre >>> >>> >>> On 30 Apr 2011, at 16:15, Jimmie Houchin wrote: >>> >>>> On 4/30/2011 11:50 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: >>>>>> I am developing a time sensitive application. I poll a server every minute for new data. The data is time sensitive and the sooner I can get the data to the release of the data the better. >>>>>> >>>>>> I have noticed that Pharo's system time drifts away from the OS system time. I would really like the Pharo system time to be the correct time. >>>>> do you have a repeatable scenario? >>>>> VM >>>>> Image information. >>>> Pharo 1.3 and the latest Cog. >>>> >>>>>> I have not been able to find where in Pharo I can call to update the System clock to the correct time. >>>>> you can use OSProcess (only mac and linux) >>>> No, that's not the problem. The OS clock is right. It's Pharo that has drifted away from correct time. Regardless it would be nice if I have to correct the OS clock, it would still be nice to resync Pharo with the OS, keep both in sync and correct. What I am wanting is simply to resync the Pharo clock with the OS clock. >>>> >>>> It seems that when the Pharo image is started that it gets the OS System time, but keeps its own time after that. Now I do not know the consequences of Pharo adjusting its time backward. If this isn't possible, then I might have to do some workarounds to insure that I get my data in a timely manner. >>>> >>>> The image I have been developing in is currently about 30 seconds ahead of the OS clock. It is on my laptop. It might be due to the laptops sleep and hibernation. I have not tested this on my server. >>>> >>>> That is the situation as best I know it. >>>> >>>> Thanks. >>>> >>>> Jimmie >>>> >> >> >

May 1, 2011