October 2011 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

[Pharo-project] How to port this code to 1.3

by Sean P. DeNigris

Old code: Smalltalk isMorphic ifTrue: [self buildMorphicViewOn: aSyntaxError. CurrentProjectRefactoring newProcessIfUI: Processor activeProcess. ^ Processor activeProcess suspend]. I started with: self buildViewOn: aSyntaxError. "Using Polymorph?" UIManager default spawnNewProcessIfThisIsUI: Processor activeProcess. ^ Processor activeProcess suspend. But #spawnNewProcessIfThisIsUI: is only defined for MorphicUIManager, which delegates to Project (I didn't know Project was even still in the image). It seems the UIManager hierarchy needs to be cleaned, but I don't understand it well enough. Some questions: * why does Project still exist? It doesn't seem very useful... * does Project play well with UIManager e.g. if DummyUIManager is active, does Project answer nil to #uiProcess? * is it reasonable to have a default UIManager>>#spawnNewProcessIfThisIsUI: that doesn't do anything, and override in UIManagers with UIs? Sean -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/How-to-port-this-code-to-1-3-tp3954648p3954648.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Oct. 31, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Still more problems with underscore

by Levente Uzonyi

On Sun, 30 Oct 2011, Lukas Renggli wrote: >> Hi guys. I still have problems with underscore in Pharo 1.3. I want to use >> underscore in both ways: in selectors and as assigment. > > Who would tell the system what you mean? > >> If I do: Scanner allowUnderscoreAsAssignment: true. >> then it works in selectrs but not in assigment. >> >> If I do String allowUnderscore. >> then it works for assigment but stops working for selector. > > This is the point of the design. Maybe the prefix "allow" is not quite > revealing enough, because you cannot have both. > > You load the old code with the setting set to true. You fix your > broken assignments and you switch to false to use underscores. > > Squeak has decided to go another way and allow both cases kind of > simultaneous. What a broken mess! It's definitely not broken and it's far from mess. If you enable bot preferences, then you still have an unambiguous grammar, which lets you use undescores both in selectors and for assignment. Levente > > Lukas > > -- > Lukas Renggli > www.lukas-renggli.ch > >

Oct. 31, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Jenkis is testing twice (or counting twice)

by Schwab,Wilhelm K

Nice catch! Things like that can be frustrating to find. But it gets to something I generally tell myself while chasing what seems to be a disproportionately stubborn defect: when Smalltalk fails, it usually does so for a "good" reason. By that, I mean that Smalltalk systems generally do just what we humans told them to do. Bill ________________________________ From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr] on behalf of Mariano Martinez Peck [marianopeck(a)gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2011 7:55 PM To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Jenkis is testing twice (or counting twice) Well, of course the problem was mine, since I was sending a list of CATEGORIES to HDTestReport runPackages: instead of packages.... On Mon, Oct 31, 2011 at 12:44 AM, Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck(a)gmail.com<mailto:marianopeck@gmail.com>> wrote: On Thu, Oct 6, 2011 at 2:49 AM, Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu<mailto:bschwab@anest.ufl.edu>> wrote: Mariano, You are, of course, correct in wanting to fix it. Do the troublesome tests result in debug logs? No, because they succeed :( You can see it here: https://ci.lille.inria.fr/pharo/job/Fuel/465/testReport/FuelTests.InternalM… I think it is something related to HDTestReport of HudsonBuildTools Lukas any idea? If not, could that be made to happen? There is no guarantee that it will show itself this way, but it might be worth a try. Bill ________________________________________ From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr> [pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr>] On Behalf Of Mariano Martinez Peck [marianopeck(a)gmail.com<mailto:marianopeck@gmail.com>] Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2011 4:48 PM To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto:Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr> Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Jenkis is testing twice (or counting twice) On Wed, Oct 5, 2011 at 10:15 PM, Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu<mailto:bschwab@anest.ufl.edu><mailto:bschwab@anest.ufl.edu<mailto:bschwab@anest.ufl.edu>>> wrote: Divide by two? *Somebody* was going to say it :) hehehehheheh. But the problem is that you know to which packages you have to divide. Because it affects only some of them, not all ;) On the optimistic side, the tests are being used and results reported. ________________________________________ From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr><mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr>> [pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr><mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr>>] On Behalf Of Mariano Martinez Peck [marianopeck(a)gmail.com<mailto:marianopeck@gmail.com><mailto:marianopeck@gmail.com<mailto:marianopeck@gmail.com>>] Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2011 3:50 PM To: Pharo Development Subject: [Pharo-project] Jenkis is testing twice (or counting twice) Take as an example Fuel. For 2 of the 6 packages, it runs the tests twice. Or at least they are count twice. Examples: https://ci.lille.inria.fr/pharo/job/Fuel/369/testReport/FuelTests.Collectio… https://ci.lille.inria.fr/pharo/job/Fuel/369/testReport/FuelTests.InternalM… Of course, running those tests from a normal TestRunner I see the correct amount of tests. Any ideas? -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Oct. 31, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Jenkis is testing twice (or counting twice)

by Mariano Martinez Peck

Well, of course the problem was mine, since I was sending a list of CATEGORIES to HDTestReport runPackages: instead of packages.... On Mon, Oct 31, 2011 at 12:44 AM, Mariano Martinez Peck < marianopeck(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > On Thu, Oct 6, 2011 at 2:49 AM, Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu>wrote: > >> Mariano, >> >> You are, of course, correct in wanting to fix it. Do the troublesome >> tests result in debug logs? >> > > No, because they succeed :( > > You can see it here: > https://ci.lille.inria.fr/pharo/job/Fuel/465/testReport/FuelTests.InternalM… > > I think it is something related to HDTestReport of HudsonBuildTools > > Lukas any idea? > > > If not, could that be made to happen? There is no guarantee that it will >> show itself this way, but it might be worth a try. >> >> Bill >> >> >> ________________________________________ >> From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [ >> pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Mariano >> Martinez Peck [marianopeck(a)gmail.com] >> Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2011 4:48 PM >> To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Jenkis is testing twice (or counting twice) >> >> On Wed, Oct 5, 2011 at 10:15 PM, Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu >> <mailto:bschwab@anest.ufl.edu>> wrote: >> Divide by two? >> >> *Somebody* was going to say it :) >> >> hehehehheheh. But the problem is that you know to which packages you have >> to divide. Because it affects only some of them, not all ;) >> >> On the optimistic side, the tests are being used and results reported. >> >> >> >> >> ________________________________________ >> From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto: >> pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> [ >> pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto: >> pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr>] On Behalf Of Mariano >> Martinez Peck [marianopeck(a)gmail.com<mailto:marianopeck@gmail.com>] >> Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2011 3:50 PM >> To: Pharo Development >> Subject: [Pharo-project] Jenkis is testing twice (or counting twice) >> >> Take as an example Fuel. For 2 of the 6 packages, it runs the tests >> twice. Or at least they are count twice. Examples: >> >> >> https://ci.lille.inria.fr/pharo/job/Fuel/369/testReport/FuelTests.Collectio… >> >> https://ci.lille.inria.fr/pharo/job/Fuel/369/testReport/FuelTests.InternalM… >> >> Of course, running those tests from a normal TestRunner I see the correct >> amount of tests. >> >> Any ideas? >> >> -- >> Mariano >> http://marianopeck.wordpress.com >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Mariano >> http://marianopeck.wordpress.com >> >> >> > > > -- > Mariano > http://marianopeck.wordpress.com > > -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Oct. 30, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Jenkis is testing twice (or counting twice)

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Thu, Oct 6, 2011 at 2:49 AM, Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu>wrote: > Mariano, > > You are, of course, correct in wanting to fix it. Do the troublesome > tests result in debug logs? > No, because they succeed :( You can see it here: https://ci.lille.inria.fr/pharo/job/Fuel/465/testReport/FuelTests.InternalM… I think it is something related to HDTestReport of HudsonBuildTools Lukas any idea? If not, could that be made to happen? There is no guarantee that it will > show itself this way, but it might be worth a try. > > Bill > > > ________________________________________ > From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [ > pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Mariano > Martinez Peck [marianopeck(a)gmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2011 4:48 PM > To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Jenkis is testing twice (or counting twice) > > On Wed, Oct 5, 2011 at 10:15 PM, Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu > <mailto:bschwab@anest.ufl.edu>> wrote: > Divide by two? > > *Somebody* was going to say it :) > > hehehehheheh. But the problem is that you know to which packages you have > to divide. Because it affects only some of them, not all ;) > > On the optimistic side, the tests are being used and results reported. > > > > > ________________________________________ > From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto: > pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> [ > pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto: > pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr>] On Behalf Of Mariano > Martinez Peck [marianopeck(a)gmail.com<mailto:marianopeck@gmail.com>] > Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2011 3:50 PM > To: Pharo Development > Subject: [Pharo-project] Jenkis is testing twice (or counting twice) > > Take as an example Fuel. For 2 of the 6 packages, it runs the tests twice. > Or at least they are count twice. Examples: > > > https://ci.lille.inria.fr/pharo/job/Fuel/369/testReport/FuelTests.Collectio… > > https://ci.lille.inria.fr/pharo/job/Fuel/369/testReport/FuelTests.InternalM… > > Of course, running those tests from a normal TestRunner I see the correct > amount of tests. > > Any ideas? > > -- > Mariano > http://marianopeck.wordpress.com > > > > > > -- > Mariano > http://marianopeck.wordpress.com > > > -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Oct. 30, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Smalltalk Job in L.A.

by blake

I've seen it a couple of places but this fellow called and emailed me: Kapil_Gupta(a)artechinfo.com ===Blake=== On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 12:52 AM, Noury Bouraqadi <bouraqadi(a)gmail.com>wrote: > Hi, > > Do you have link or a contact email for the job offrer ? > On 29 oct. 2011, at 18:28, blake wrote: > > > Hey, guys-- > > > > There's a job opening with Sempra, some kind of energy company, in the > Los Angeles area (Marina Del Rey, Monterey Park--you can Google the > locations), that requires C++ and Smalltalk. > > > > ===Blake=== > > Noury > -- > http://twitter.com/#!/NouryBouraqadi > > > > > >

Oct. 30, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Is RPackage dead?

by Tudor Girba

Hi, On 30 Oct 2011, at 22:43, Igor Stasenko wrote: > On 30 October 2011 23:05, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: >> Hi, >> >> Wait. The RPackage should not hold more than one category. That is the whole point. If you will allow mapping more than one category to an RPackage, we will either never get rid of categories or we will enter into the messy territory of nested packages. At this time, we certainly do not want the former, and we cannot afford the later. >> >> Please, let's keep it simple. There is no point allowing people to create mess by default. There is no practical use case for having this extra stuff. In fact, we know from experience that if we want to manage a larger than trivial system, we need strict conventions. Anything else pretty much fails in the long run. >> > I think you looking at this at wrong angle. I strongly disagree :). > People can create a mess with any software, no matter what good it is. Sure. But, the thing is that just because mess is possible, you do not want to make it easy. > If you deny people from doing the mess within the package , you are > not solving the problem - you just shifting it into another plane - a > package management. > So you forcing people to do the mess at package management level. Fine :) > But personally, I fail to see why mess with package management > (dependencies, load order etc) is better than single bloated package > with lots of categories. > > Because, imposing any strict naming rules is like trying to swim against stream. > If i want a _single_ package with two categories, like: > - core > - utils > > give me a strong reason why i can't have it, and why i have to waste > my time with package management, if all i need is single package? So now I think you are looking at the problem in a strange way. You seem to argue that we should optimize the system around toy examples. Almost anything meaningful requires more than that. Let's optimize around what matters. And regarding wasting time, you will waste much less than now at the moment when Monticello will become transparent as well. In other words, you will simply stay in your code browser and load and publish from there. No mess, no fuss. But to get there easily, we need this 1-to-1 between what is publishable and what is in the image. Perhaps where you will need some attention is loading order, but when Metacello will get a better integration, many things will be possible. But, we need a stable and simple base. Cheers, Doru > >> So, I come back to my point. At this point, we can safely load RPackage in the image (actually, in the Moose image, it is always loaded) and have tools be built on top of them. Then in Pharo 1.5 or later we start transitioning by not allowing people to commit more than one Category/RPackage in a Monticello package. >> >> It's a smooth transition that can be spread over a longer period of time. >> >> Cheers, >> Doru >> >> >> >> On 30 Oct 2011, at 15:29, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: >> >>> I agree now this is the path to arrive there that is important to me. >>> >>> Stef >>> >>> On Oct 30, 2011, at 3:23 PM, Igor Stasenko wrote: >>> >>>> Stephane, as i said before, i do not see problems with RPackage / naming. >>>> These things are orthogonal, as to me. >>>> We can keep naming scheme as we use today, but switch to RPackage. >>>> >>>> A package can keep the list of category names and that's it. They >>>> could even be completely different, if people want it. >>>> Say, package is named >>>> Foo >>>> and contain categories: >>>> 'Foo-Core' >>>> 'Bar' >>>> >>>> The rationale is simple: >>>> it is up to human(s) to decide what a package should contain, and what >>>> names to use. Let's just embrace the imperfection and do not dictate >>>> people >>>> how they should name their categories in order to make sure that >>>> classes in that categories will be put into concrete package. >>>> If people like to confuse themselves with category names, not matching >>>> the package name , it should be their own choice and responsibility. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Best regards, >>>> Igor Stasenko. >>>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> www.tudorgirba.com >> >> "Reasonable is what we are accustomed with." >> >> >> > > > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. > -- www.tudorgirba.com "What we can governs what we wish."

Oct. 30, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Is RPackage dead?

by Igor Stasenko

On 30 October 2011 23:05, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > Hi, > > Wait. The RPackage should not hold more than one category. That is the whole point. If you will allow mapping more than one category to an RPackage, we will either never get rid of categories or we will enter into the messy territory of nested packages. At this time, we certainly do not want the former, and we cannot afford the later. > > Please, let's keep it simple. There is no point allowing people to create mess by default. There is no practical use case for having this extra stuff. In fact, we know from experience that if we want to manage a larger than trivial system, we need strict conventions. Anything else pretty much fails in the long run. > I think you looking at this at wrong angle. People can create a mess with any software, no matter what good it is. If you deny people from doing the mess within the package , you are not solving the problem - you just shifting it into another plane - a package management. So you forcing people to do the mess at package management level. Fine :) But personally, I fail to see why mess with package management (dependencies, load order etc) is better than single bloated package with lots of categories. Because, imposing any strict naming rules is like trying to swim against stream. If i want a _single_ package with two categories, like: - core - utils give me a strong reason why i can't have it, and why i have to waste my time with package management, if all i need is single package? > So, I come back to my point. At this point, we can safely load RPackage in the image (actually, in the Moose image, it is always loaded) and have tools be built on top of them. Then in Pharo 1.5 or later we start transitioning by not allowing people to commit more than one Category/RPackage in a Monticello package. > > It's a smooth transition that can be spread over a longer period of time. > > Cheers, > Doru > > > > On 30 Oct 2011, at 15:29, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > >> I agree now this is the path to arrive there that is important to me. >> >> Stef >> >> On Oct 30, 2011, at 3:23 PM, Igor Stasenko wrote: >> >>> Stephane, as i said before, i do not see problems with RPackage / naming. >>> These things are orthogonal, as to me. >>> We can keep naming scheme as we use today, but switch to RPackage. >>> >>> A package can keep the list of category names and that's it. They >>> could even be completely different, if people want it. >>> Say, package is named >>> Foo >>> and contain categories: >>> 'Foo-Core' >>> 'Bar' >>> >>> The rationale is simple: >>> it is up to human(s) to decide what a package should contain, and what >>> names to use. Let's just embrace the imperfection and do not dictate >>> people >>> how they should name their categories in order to make sure that >>> classes in that categories will be put into concrete package. >>> If people like to confuse themselves with category names, not matching >>> the package name , it should be their own choice and responsibility. >>> >>> -- >>> Best regards, >>> Igor Stasenko. >>> >> >> > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > > "Reasonable is what we are accustomed with." > > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Oct. 30, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Is RPackage dead?

by Tudor Girba

Hi, Wait. The RPackage should not hold more than one category. That is the whole point. If you will allow mapping more than one category to an RPackage, we will either never get rid of categories or we will enter into the messy territory of nested packages. At this time, we certainly do not want the former, and we cannot afford the later. Please, let's keep it simple. There is no point allowing people to create mess by default. There is no practical use case for having this extra stuff. In fact, we know from experience that if we want to manage a larger than trivial system, we need strict conventions. Anything else pretty much fails in the long run. So, I come back to my point. At this point, we can safely load RPackage in the image (actually, in the Moose image, it is always loaded) and have tools be built on top of them. Then in Pharo 1.5 or later we start transitioning by not allowing people to commit more than one Category/RPackage in a Monticello package. It's a smooth transition that can be spread over a longer period of time. Cheers, Doru On 30 Oct 2011, at 15:29, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > I agree now this is the path to arrive there that is important to me. > > Stef > > On Oct 30, 2011, at 3:23 PM, Igor Stasenko wrote: > >> Stephane, as i said before, i do not see problems with RPackage / naming. >> These things are orthogonal, as to me. >> We can keep naming scheme as we use today, but switch to RPackage. >> >> A package can keep the list of category names and that's it. They >> could even be completely different, if people want it. >> Say, package is named >> Foo >> and contain categories: >> 'Foo-Core' >> 'Bar' >> >> The rationale is simple: >> it is up to human(s) to decide what a package should contain, and what >> names to use. Let's just embrace the imperfection and do not dictate >> people >> how they should name their categories in order to make sure that >> classes in that categories will be put into concrete package. >> If people like to confuse themselves with category names, not matching >> the package name , it should be their own choice and responsibility. >> >> -- >> Best regards, >> Igor Stasenko. >> > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Reasonable is what we are accustomed with."

Oct. 30, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] [squeak-dev] readFrom: vs readFromString:

by David T. Lewis

On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 05:07:48PM +0100, Nicolas Cellier wrote: > There is a huge mess in #readFrom: implementation. > Some classes will signal trailing characters as a bug, some other > won't and will simply leave the stream positioned after the valid > part. > I propose to change this behaviour uniformly: > - readFrom: aStream will never fail on trailing chars (hey, it's a > stream, it's up to sender to interpret the tail) > - readFromString: aString will always forbid trailing char (it's not a > stream, so this garbage is most probably an error and cannot be > ignored silently) > > What do you think ? This sounds right to me. I suspect that it might be difficult to do this without breaking some external packages, but it does seem like the right thing to do. Dave

Oct. 30, 2011