October 2011 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: trying to understand loops in pharo

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On Oct 17, 2011, at 1:17 PM, Levente Uzonyi wrote: > On Sun, 16 Oct 2011, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > >> >> On Oct 16, 2011, at 10:33 PM, Nicolas Cellier wrote: >> >>> Ah, I see, this sound appealing. >>> But I would object this: (I'm speaking of do:, not only to:do:) >>> 1) what the last value mean for unordered collections? >>> 2) for a SequenceableCollection, the behavior is already >>> (someCollection inject: nil into: [:void :each | aBlock value: each]) >>> 3) returning the last value in all implementors of #do: would cost >>> complexification of code and possibly slow down (non clean blocks) >>> >>> Is it really useful? >> >> Not really I do not like the idea to rely on it. >> but in that case the code you be explicit >> >> #undefined/nil >> should be the last expression of the block. >> >> My point was: the semantics of a block is to return the last expression and we should be consistent with that. > > The block returns the last expression, but in this case a method returns > the value. Here's an example: > > (1 to: 10) collect: [ :each | each squared ]. > > You don't expect to get 100 as the result, do you? :) indeed :) I will have to reread the problem my friend got. Now my brain is glued with a little flu and excel salaries wonderful planning. Stef

Oct. 17, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: trying to understand loops in pharo

by Eliot Miranda

2011/10/17 Levente Uzonyi <leves(a)elte.hu> > On Sun, 16 Oct 2011, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > > >> On Oct 16, 2011, at 10:33 PM, Nicolas Cellier wrote: >> >> Ah, I see, this sound appealing. >>> But I would object this: (I'm speaking of do:, not only to:do:) >>> 1) what the last value mean for unordered collections? >>> 2) for a SequenceableCollection, the behavior is already >>> (someCollection inject: nil into: [:void :each | aBlock value: each]) >>> 3) returning the last value in all implementors of #do: would cost >>> complexification of code and possibly slow down (non clean blocks) >>> >>> Is it really useful? >>> >> >> Not really I do not like the idea to rely on it. >> but in that case the code you be explicit >> >> #undefined/nil >> should be the last expression of the block. >> >> My point was: the semantics of a block is to return the last expression >> and we should be consistent with that. >> > > The block returns the last expression, but in this case a method returns > the value. Here's an example: > > (1 to: 10) collect: [ :each | each squared ]. > > You don't expect to get 100 as the result, do you? :) > Just to hammer home the message. The below, which won't be inlined since the block argument is in a variable, | b | b := [:i| nil]. 1 to: 10 do: b of course answers 1, since Number methods for intervals to: stop do: aBlock "Normally compiled in-line, and therefore not overridable. Evaluate aBlock for each element of the interval (self to: stop by: 1)." | nextValue | nextValue := self. [nextValue <= stop] whileTrue: [aBlock value: nextValue. nextValue := nextValue + 1] which ends with an implicit ^self. > > Levente > > > >> Stef >> >> >>> Nicolas >>> >>> 2011/10/16 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr>: >>> >>>> for me the last expression of the block. >>>> >>>> Stef >>>> >>>>> Which return value would be useful? >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> That's not the right question. IMO the compiler should answer the >>>>>> same >>>>>> result as the non-inlined one when the return value is asked for. >>>>>> Arguably >>>>>> the non-inline version needs to be commented to specify that it >>>>>> returns the >>>>>> value it does (in this case self), and that the compiler's optimiser >>>>>> reflects this. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> Agree, but I was wondering what useful object this common answer could >>>>> be? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> Nicolas >>>>>>> >>>>>>> 2011/10/16 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr>: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> A friend of mine ask me the following >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> |result| >>>>>>>> result := String new. >>>>>>>> 1 to: 10 do: [:n | result := result, n printString, ' ']. >>>>>>>> I am trying to do or print this code. It prints 'nil' instead of a >>>>>>>> collection. Its an example from PBE book. >>>>>>>> do you know the reason? >>>>>>>> although this one's working: >>>>>>>> result := String new. >>>>>>>> (1 to: 10) do: [:n | result := result, n printString, ' ']. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I checked the implementation >>>>>>>> Interval>>do: aBlock >>>>>>>> "Evaluate aBlock for each value of the interval. >>>>>>>> Implementation note: instead of repeatedly incrementing the value >>>>>>>> aValue := aValue + step. >>>>>>>> until stop is reached, >>>>>>>> We prefer to recompute value from start >>>>>>>> aValue := start + (index * step). >>>>>>>> This is better for floating points accuracy, while not degrading >>>>>>>> Integer >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> Fraction speed too much. >>>>>>>> Moreover, this is consistent with methods #at: and #size" >>>>>>>> | aValue index size | >>>>>>>> index := 0. >>>>>>>> size := self size. >>>>>>>> [index < size] >>>>>>>> whileTrue: [aValue := start + (index * step). >>>>>>>> index := index + 1. >>>>>>>> aBlock value: aValue] >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Number>>to: stop do: aBlock >>>>>>>> "Normally compiled in-line, and therefore not overridable. >>>>>>>> Evaluate aBlock for each element of the interval (self to: stop by: >>>>>>>> 1)." >>>>>>>> | nextValue | >>>>>>>> nextValue := self. >>>>>>>> [nextValue <= stop] >>>>>>>> whileTrue: >>>>>>>> [aBlock value: nextValue. >>>>>>>> nextValue := nextValue + 1] >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> any further idea than := value is different from value: >>>>>>>> Stef >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> best, >>>>>> Eliot >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> -- best, Eliot

Oct. 17, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] RFB looks terribly broken

by Carlo

Hi It looks like you're running your vm headless is that right? As far as I understand this would cause the vm to shutdown as the NonInteractiveUIManager is running... Cheers Carlo On 17 Oct 2011, at 6:27 PM, Bernat Romagosa wrote: Yes, the VM crashes and there's no output on the console :( If I search for 'RFB' in the PharoDebug file I get around 300 matches, but I can't understand what the cause of the problem is... 2011/10/17 Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> You say the VM crashes? I don't see anything related to RFB in your PharoDebug.log. Lukas On 17 October 2011 16:47, Bernat Romagosa <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Lukas, > I made a copy of PharoDebug.log publicly accessible > from: http://seaside.citilab.eu/PharoDebug.log > There are some error messages stating: > "An attempt to use interactive tools detected, while in non-interactive > mode" > And others related to RFB. > Cheers, > 2011/10/17 Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> >> >> It works for me. Are you using RBF from my repostiory? >> >> Did you try with a different (newer, older, Pharo) VM? >> >> Any crash dumps that you want to share? >> >> Lukas >> >> On 17 October 2011 13:27, Bernat Romagosa >> <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> > Hi list, >> > I'm not able to develop remotely using the RFB server anymore. The image >> > just dies all the time. Examples of behaviours that trigger the crash: >> > - Right-clicking on a Workspace >> > - Saving a method in a Browser, then selecting another method in the >> > same >> > Browser >> > Any ideas on why is this happening? The same exact image (with the RFB >> > server also running and the same VM) works okay locally, but when I >> > access >> > it remotely it becomes unusable. >> > Here's my config: >> > 'Pharo1.3' (one click) >> > 'Croquet Closure Cog VM [CoInterpreter VMMaker-oscog-IgorStasenko.123]' >> > Debian 6.0 >> > >> > Cheers! >> > -- >> > Bernat Romagosa. >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Lukas Renggli >> www.lukas-renggli.ch >> > > > > -- > Bernat Romagosa. > -- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch -- Bernat Romagosa.

Oct. 17, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Linus Torvaldsâs Lessons on Software Development Management

by Schwab,Wilhelm K

Stef, Pharo is *very* useful, and getting more so with time. Now if YOU could just fix... :) Bill ________________________________________ From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of StÃ©phane Ducasse [stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr] Sent: Monday, October 17, 2011 1:10 PM To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Linus Torvaldsâs Lessons on Software Development Management âThe first thing is thinking that you can throw things out there and ask people to help,â when it comes to open-source software development, he says. âThat's not how it works. You make it public, and then you assume that you'll have to do all the work, and ask people to come up with suggestions of what you should do, not what they should do. Maybe they'll start helping eventually, but you should start off with the assumption that you're going to be the one maintaining it and ready to do all the work.â so true :) âThe other thingâand it's kind of relatedâthat people seem to get wrong is to think that the code they write is what matters,â says Torvalds. Most software development managers have seen this one. âNo, even if you wrote 100% of the code, and even if you are the best programmer in the world and will never need any help with the project at all, the thing that really matters is the users of the code. The code itself is unimportant; the project is only as useful as people actually find it.â Thanks for sharing that interview with us On Oct 17, 2011, at 3:38 PM, Ben Coman wrote: > While I am waiting for enough time to devote to learning more Smalltalk/Squeak/Pharo, I came across this article [1] which reflected upon recent discussion on Fuel version format compatibility, as well as on other projects. Perhaps it is that it is such a great environment for experimenting with ideas that it encourages developers to do so, but it seems that functionality often becomes orphaned as the trunk progresses. I see some efforts provide a more professional platform, and understand that involves 'some' ripping/replacement of unmaintainable code, but which contradicts the philosophy of 'no regressions' mentioned in the article - which in practice I imagine a hard line to walk. > Linux is the poster child of open source development success, and while it is more mature that Pharo such that the presented philosophy might not fit exactly, perhaps something can be learned. I hope you find parts of it interesting. > > cheers, Ben > > [1] http://h30565.www3.hp.com/t5/Feature-Articles/Linus-Torvalds-s-Lessons-on-S… >

Oct. 17, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] How to use freetype?

by Schwab,Wilhelm K

Sig, It sounds like you are on your way to typographic bliss, but just in case (or for others who might run across this later), I found it necessary (at least on Linux) to load the fonts using something like FreeTypeFontProvider current families isEmpty ifTrue:[ FreeTypeFontProvider current updateFromSystem. ]. Bill ________________________________________ From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Igor Stasenko [siguctua(a)gmail.com] Sent: Monday, October 17, 2011 11:17 AM To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] How to use freetype? On 17 October 2011 15:14, Gary Chambers <gazzaguru2(a)btinternet.com> wrote: > Try > > LogicalFont > familyName: 'Arial' > pointSize: 24 > Thanks. This is what i was looking for. > Regards, Gary > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Igor Stasenko" <siguctua(a)gmail.com> > To: "Pharo Development" <Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> > Sent: Monday, October 17, 2011 1:19 PM > Subject: [Pharo-project] How to use freetype? > > >> I feel a bit confused. >> >> I want to do something as easy as: >> >> font := Something fontByName: 'Arial'. >> >> but the problem is that i cannot find anything like that in freetype. >> >> There is >> FreeTypeFontProvider fontFor: aLogicalFont familyName: familyName >> >> but i puzzled, why it needs a logical font and why i should create it? >> >> Is there a general way to programmatically say: give me font 'Arial' pt >> size 9, >> or nil, if font cannot be found? >> >> -- >> Best regards, >> Igor Stasenko. >> > > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Oct. 17, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Linus Torvaldsâs Lessons on Software Development Management

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

âThe first thing is thinking that you can throw things out there and ask people to help,â when it comes to open-source software development, he says. âThat's not how it works. You make it public, and then you assume that you'll have to do all the work, and ask people to come up with suggestions of what you should do, not what they should do. Maybe they'll start helping eventually, but you should start off with the assumption that you're going to be the one maintaining it and ready to do all the work.â so true :) âThe other thingâand it's kind of relatedâthat people seem to get wrong is to think that the code they write is what matters,â says Torvalds. Most software development managers have seen this one. âNo, even if you wrote 100% of the code, and even if you are the best programmer in the world and will never need any help with the project at all, the thing that really matters is the users of the code. The code itself is unimportant; the project is only as useful as people actually find it.â Thanks for sharing that interview with us On Oct 17, 2011, at 3:38 PM, Ben Coman wrote: > While I am waiting for enough time to devote to learning more Smalltalk/Squeak/Pharo, I came across this article [1] which reflected upon recent discussion on Fuel version format compatibility, as well as on other projects. Perhaps it is that it is such a great environment for experimenting with ideas that it encourages developers to do so, but it seems that functionality often becomes orphaned as the trunk progresses. I see some efforts provide a more professional platform, and understand that involves 'some' ripping/replacement of unmaintainable code, but which contradicts the philosophy of 'no regressions' mentioned in the article - which in practice I imagine a hard line to walk. > Linux is the poster child of open source development success, and while it is more mature that Pharo such that the presented philosophy might not fit exactly, perhaps something can be learned. I hope you find parts of it interesting. > > cheers, Ben > > [1] http://h30565.www3.hp.com/t5/Feature-Articles/Linus-Torvalds-s-Lessons-on-S… >

Oct. 17, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] RFB looks terribly broken

by Bernat Romagosa

Yes, the VM crashes and there's no output on the console :( If I search for 'RFB' in the PharoDebug file I get around 300 matches, but I can't understand what the cause of the problem is... 2011/10/17 Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> > You say the VM crashes? > > I don't see anything related to RFB in your PharoDebug.log. > > Lukas > > On 17 October 2011 16:47, Bernat Romagosa > <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi Lukas, > > I made a copy of PharoDebug.log publicly accessible > > from: http://seaside.citilab.eu/PharoDebug.log > > There are some error messages stating: > > "An attempt to use interactive tools detected, while in non-interactive > > mode" > > And others related to RFB. > > Cheers, > > 2011/10/17 Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> > >> > >> It works for me. Are you using RBF from my repostiory? > >> > >> Did you try with a different (newer, older, Pharo) VM? > >> > >> Any crash dumps that you want to share? > >> > >> Lukas > >> > >> On 17 October 2011 13:27, Bernat Romagosa > >> <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> > Hi list, > >> > I'm not able to develop remotely using the RFB server anymore. The > image > >> > just dies all the time. Examples of behaviours that trigger the crash: > >> > - Right-clicking on a Workspace > >> > - Saving a method in a Browser, then selecting another method in the > >> > same > >> > Browser > >> > Any ideas on why is this happening? The same exact image (with the RFB > >> > server also running and the same VM) works okay locally, but when I > >> > access > >> > it remotely it becomes unusable. > >> > Here's my config: > >> > 'Pharo1.3' (one click) > >> > 'Croquet Closure Cog VM [CoInterpreter > VMMaker-oscog-IgorStasenko.123]' > >> > Debian 6.0 > >> > > >> > Cheers! > >> > -- > >> > Bernat Romagosa. > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Lukas Renggli > >> www.lukas-renggli.ch > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > Bernat Romagosa. > > > > > > -- > Lukas Renggli > www.lukas-renggli.ch > > -- Bernat Romagosa.

Oct. 17, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] RFB looks terribly broken

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Mon, Oct 17, 2011 at 6:20 PM, Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> wrote: > You say the VM crashes? > > I don't see anything related to RFB in your PharoDebug.log. > > Did you see at the end ? > Lukas > > On 17 October 2011 16:47, Bernat Romagosa > <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi Lukas, > > I made a copy of PharoDebug.log publicly accessible > > from: http://seaside.citilab.eu/PharoDebug.log > > There are some error messages stating: > > "An attempt to use interactive tools detected, while in non-interactive > > mode" > > And others related to RFB. > > Cheers, > > 2011/10/17 Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> > >> > >> It works for me. Are you using RBF from my repostiory? > >> > >> Did you try with a different (newer, older, Pharo) VM? > >> > >> Any crash dumps that you want to share? > >> > >> Lukas > >> > >> On 17 October 2011 13:27, Bernat Romagosa > >> <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> > Hi list, > >> > I'm not able to develop remotely using the RFB server anymore. The > image > >> > just dies all the time. Examples of behaviours that trigger the crash: > >> > - Right-clicking on a Workspace > >> > - Saving a method in a Browser, then selecting another method in the > >> > same > >> > Browser > >> > Any ideas on why is this happening? The same exact image (with the RFB > >> > server also running and the same VM) works okay locally, but when I > >> > access > >> > it remotely it becomes unusable. > >> > Here's my config: > >> > 'Pharo1.3' (one click) > >> > 'Croquet Closure Cog VM [CoInterpreter > VMMaker-oscog-IgorStasenko.123]' > >> > Debian 6.0 > >> > > >> > Cheers! > >> > -- > >> > Bernat Romagosa. > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Lukas Renggli > >> www.lukas-renggli.ch > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > Bernat Romagosa. > > > > > > -- > Lukas Renggli > www.lukas-renggli.ch > > -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Oct. 17, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] RFB looks terribly broken

by Lukas Renggli

You say the VM crashes? I don't see anything related to RFB in your PharoDebug.log. Lukas On 17 October 2011 16:47, Bernat Romagosa <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Lukas, > I made a copy of PharoDebug.log publicly accessible > from:Â http://seaside.citilab.eu/PharoDebug.log > There are some error messages stating: > "An attempt to use interactive tools detected, while in non-interactive > mode" > And others related to RFB. > Cheers, > 2011/10/17 Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> >> >> It works for me. Are you using RBF from my repostiory? >> >> Did you try with a different (newer, older, Pharo) VM? >> >> Any crash dumps that you want to share? >> >> Lukas >> >> On 17 October 2011 13:27, Bernat Romagosa >> <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> > Hi list, >> > I'm not able to develop remotely using the RFB server anymore. The image >> > just dies all the time. Examples of behaviours that trigger the crash: >> > - Right-clicking on a Workspace >> > - Saving a method in a Browser, then selecting another method in the >> > same >> > Browser >> > Any ideas on why is this happening? The same exact imageÂ (with the RFB >> > server also running and the same VM)Â works okay locally, but when I >> > access >> > it remotely it becomes unusable. >> > Here's my config: >> > Â 'Pharo1.3' (one click) >> > Â 'Croquet Closure Cog VM [CoInterpreter VMMaker-oscog-IgorStasenko.123]' >> > Debian 6.0 >> > >> > Cheers! >> > -- >> > Bernat Romagosa. >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Lukas Renggli >> www.lukas-renggli.ch >> > > > > -- > Bernat Romagosa. > -- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch

Oct. 17, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] How to use freetype?

by Igor Stasenko

On 17 October 2011 15:14, Gary Chambers <gazzaguru2(a)btinternet.com> wrote: > Try > > LogicalFont > Â familyName: 'Arial' > Â pointSize: 24 > Thanks. This is what i was looking for. > Regards, Gary > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Igor Stasenko" <siguctua(a)gmail.com> > To: "Pharo Development" <Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> > Sent: Monday, October 17, 2011 1:19 PM > Subject: [Pharo-project] How to use freetype? > > >> I feel a bit confused. >> >> I want to do something as easy as: >> >> font := Something fontByName: 'Arial'. >> >> but the problem is that i cannot find anything like that in freetype. >> >> There is >> FreeTypeFontProvider fontFor: aLogicalFont familyName: familyName >> >> but i puzzled, why it needs a logical font and why i should create it? >> >> Is there a general way to programmatically say: give me font 'Arial' pt >> size 9, >> or nil, if font cannot be found? >> >> -- >> Best regards, >> Igor Stasenko. >> > > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Oct. 17, 2011