July 2010 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo 1.1 host menu os x

by Mariano Martinez Peck

2010/7/30 laurent laffont <laurent.laffont(a)gmail.com> > On Thu, Jul 29, 2010 at 11:52 PM, Michael Roberts <mike(a)mjr104.co.uk>wrote: > >> I gave the latest release a spin and it seams quit doesn't work (again). >> old reference -> >> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=1068 >> >> can someone confirm? if so do we want a new issue or reopen the old one? >> >> Also the host menu is not consistent with the world menu. for example >> the tools menu is different. Script manager is in one but not the >> other. The help browser text references it which is why i noticed. I >> haven't looked at the implementation. is there a way they are supposed >> to be kept in sync? >> > > I've once fixed it. Look at HostSystemMenusMacOSX, building-menus protocol. > I rarely use MacOSX so can you check ? > Ok...I did it. But...addToolsMenu calls self openMenu and openMenu calls ToolSet menuItems. which is hardcoded, and not using pragmas. And this is why for example, ScriptManager doesn't appear in the HOstMenu So yes...I think we should open an issue :) CHeers > > Cheers, > > Laurent > > > >> >> cheers, >> Mike >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

July 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo 1.1 host menu os x

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Thu, Jul 29, 2010 at 11:52 PM, Michael Roberts <mike(a)mjr104.co.uk> wrote: > I gave the latest release a spin and it seams quit doesn't work (again). > old reference -> > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=1068 > > can someone confirm? if so do we want a new issue or reopen the old one? > > Michael, it is working for me. Not only in the OneClick but also with the image and the Squeak 4.2.5beta1U what is exactly what it is NOT working for you? > Also the host menu is not consistent with the world menu. yes, this is true. > for example > the tools menu is different. Script manager is in one but not the > other. The help browser text references it which is why i noticed. I > haven't looked at the implementation. is there a way they are supposed > to be kept in sync? > > maybe both should use the pragmas now? > cheers, > Mike > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

July 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Request for test

by Hilaire Fernandes

Thanks to all of you for your feedback. Le 30/07/2010 05:45, Serge Stinckwich a Ã©crit : > The application icon is looking like a triangle and the UI is in > french on my mac. > Are the translations available somewhere online ? https://gforge.inria.fr/scm/viewvc.php/drgeo2/i18n/po/?root=istoa Hilaire

July 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] [squeak-dev] [ANN] Magma 1.1r2

by Miguel Enrique CobÃ¡ MartÃnez

Premature send El jue, 29-07-2010 a las 18:55 -0500, Chris Muller escribiÃ³: > I am pleased to announce a new release of Magma containing my updates > since 1.1r1: - All underscore assignments have now been updated to ANSI assignments. Very Good! > 'Ma files additions-cmm.13.mcz'. This is a new package. What other package depends on it? > > These package versions are available in the "MagmaTester" project of > squeaksource.com. > Why on MagmaTester? I thought that for released versions, they were always on Magma repository and that MagmaTester was for your beta and not released yet versions, isn't that true anymore? In repository squeaksource.com/WriteBarrier, there are packages: WriteBarrier-tbn.28.mcz WriteBarrier-cmm.27.mcz Then in MagmaTester repository there is WriteBarrier-cmm.28.mcz and in Magma there is WriteBarrier-pmm.26.mcz So I don't understand either, what is the policy here. Is the package modified, and pushed to the original repo (WriteBarrier) and *then* copied to MagmaTester and Magma or Is the package modified in your MagmaTester repo and when finished, copied to original repo (WriteBarrier) and releases repo (Magma) I have prepared an update to the configuration of Magma for 1.1r2 with the preferences corrected but I would like to have all the packages in WriteBarrier and in Magma (that I consider the releases repositories, or at least, everything on Magma so that the configuration doesn't refer to MagmaTester altogether). What do you think? Cheers and thanks for your work. -- Miguel CobÃ¡ http://miguel.leugim.com.mx

July 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] [squeak-dev] [ANN] Magma 1.1r2

by Miguel Enrique CobÃ¡ MartÃnez

El jue, 29-07-2010 a las 18:55 -0500, Chris Muller escribiÃ³: > I am pleased to announce a new release of Magma containing my updates > since 1.1r1: - All underscore assignments have now been updated to ANSI assignments. Very Good! > 'Ma files additions-cmm.13.mcz'. This is a new package. What other package depends on it? > > These package versions are available in the "MagmaTester" project of > squeaksource.com. > Why on MagmaTester? I thought that for released versions, they were always on Magma repository and that MagmaTester was for your beta and not released yet versions, isn't that true anymore? In repository squeaksource.com/WriteBarrier, there are packages: WriteBarrier-tbn.28.mcz WriteBarrier-cmm.27.mcz Then in MagmaTester repository there is WriteBarrier-cmm.28.mcz and in Magma there is -- Miguel CobÃ¡ http://miguel.leugim.com.mx

July 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] PharoCore 1.1 comments

by Michael Roberts

> - SystemVersion current majorMinorVersion prints: > > PharoCore 1.0: 'PharoCore1.0' > > PharoCore 1.1: 'Pharo1.1' > the version object has been downgraded again. the version string needs to be nil and it keeps on getting broken. I will deprecate the mechanism once i recheck the package issues. Normally, you just set #type to make the images different. thanks, Mike

July 30, 2010

[Pharo-project] PharoCore 1.1 comments

by Miguel Enrique CobÃ¡ MartÃnez

Hi all, some things I noticed in PharoCore 1.1 release: - This PharoCore-1.1.zip doesn't include a sources file. It was good to have it included in the zip as before. Can be included for every PharoCore release? - The page says that PharoV10.sources is for use with 1.0, 1.1 and 1.2. Shouldn't be better to have a different one for each release? (even if 1.1 is a copy of 1.0, the different name avoids doubts about numbering scheme): PharoCore-1.0.image PharoCore-1.0.changes PharoV10.sources PharoCore-1.1.image PharoCore-1.1.changes PharoV10.sources (???) ... PharoCore-1.7.image PharoCore-1.7.changes PharoV10.sources (bigger ???) Just a suggestion. ;) - SystemVersion current majorMinorVersion prints: PharoCore 1.0: 'PharoCore1.0' PharoCore 1.1: 'Pharo1.1' Maybe this should be in the script preparing the image so that correctly set the version string for PharoCore images and for Pharo images (or maybe already is there but wasn't executed?) Other than that, the new image is *very* fast! Cheers -- Miguel CobÃ¡ http://miguel.leugim.com.mx

July 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo 1.1 host menu os x

by laurent laffont

On Thu, Jul 29, 2010 at 11:52 PM, Michael Roberts <mike(a)mjr104.co.uk> wrote: > I gave the latest release a spin and it seams quit doesn't work (again). > old reference -> > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=1068 > > can someone confirm? if so do we want a new issue or reopen the old one? > > Also the host menu is not consistent with the world menu. for example > the tools menu is different. Script manager is in one but not the > other. The help browser text references it which is why i noticed. I > haven't looked at the implementation. is there a way they are supposed > to be kept in sync? > I've once fixed it. Look at HostSystemMenusMacOSX, building-menus protocol. I rarely use MacOSX so can you check ? Cheers, Laurent > > cheers, > Mike > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

July 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo 1.1/1.2 and class names in Chinese

by Serge Stinckwich

On Fri, Jul 30, 2010 at 1:29 AM, <csrabak(a)bol.com.br> wrote: > > Em 29/07/2010 03:10, laurent laffont < laurent.laffont(a)gmail.com > escreveu: > >> > On Â Wed, Â Jul Â 28, Â 2010 Â at Â 6:32 Â PM, Â Nicolas Â Cellier >> > Â wrote: >> > >> > > Once Â upon a Â time Â I wondered Â if Â it wouldn't Â be possible Â to >> > > Â translate the whole sources in any language (via a Dictionary). >> > > Â In Â any other language, Â we (think Â of a Â child) must Â learn to >> > > Â "talk' Â to Â computer Â in Â computer Â own Â language... Â So Â an >> > > Â apprentice has to learn a Â new language anyway Be it an english >> > > Â computer language is thus Â not that important. Â However, one of >> > > Â the nice Â properties of Smalltalk is enabling Â "talking" to the >> > > Â machine in a Â language close to our natural Â language, and that >> > > Â lowers Â the Â barriers. Â So Â the Â question Â of natural Â language >> > > Â naturally arises. >> > > >> > > 2010/7/28 Carla F. Â Griggio Â Well, that >> > Â last comment reminded me of Â something: I've read code written in >> > Â english by people that clearly didn't >> > know a lot of english, and it kept me weeks thinking that the code >> > did Â something Â that Â it Â didn't Â (and, of Â course, Â it Â was Â more >> > difficult >> > to Â realize why the Â code didn't Â behave like Â it was Â saying :P). >> > Â So... as writing everything in Â english can be a solution, it can >> > Â be a big problem too :( >> > >> Â And a lot (majority ?) of developpers don't want to use English, or >> don't Â understand Â English, Â or Â don't Â want to Â try Â to Â understand >> English, or don't have the courage to try to understand English. And >> they need to communicate their Â ideas / code with others developpers >> in the same position :) > > I think you're heading to a position I've already discussed several years > ago with Jecel (not surprisingly when he was teaching a tutorial on Smalltalk) > on the issue of non native English speakers 'lose' a bit of the user > friendliness of certain programming languages because they need to create a full > 'dictionary' in their heads about a certain programming concept and the > [foreign] language they need to memorize. Â He gave this example (IIRC): > > NNN FOR I=1 TO 120 NEXT I > > which for the Canadian boys he was accompanying they read as 'natural language', > whereas Brazilian children had to memorize that the 'tokens' "FOR" "TO" and > "NEXT" had to written in a certain syntax to create a loop in this language. > > The same happens in Smalltalk as most of the methods being in English, when > I. Tomek in his book or introductory paper mentions that it is natural to have > in Smalltalk: > > |rusty| > > rusty := Dog new. > > rusty bark. > > For a non native English speaker this syntax is tantamount to some obscure > mathematical notation. > >> Â I Â don't Â like Â writing Â in Â French, Â it's Â not Â suitable Â for >> programming. Have you ever Â seen WinDev code with auto-translation ? > > I cannot tell if it was successful or not but I remember in the seventies it > was reported that in France there was an attempt to translate to French the > COBOL keywords. Â Any account on the outcome of that? I dunno of the translation of COBOL in french, but i remember when i was in high school in the 80ies having using applications built in LSE (Language Symbolique d'Enseignement). It was a kind of BASIC written in french. More information here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LSE_%28programming_language%29 and in french here: http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/LSE_%28langage_de_programmation%29 I remember doing german lessons with LSE programs. One way to trick the programs was to stop the application, to look at the name of variable used to give the answer. After that everytime you replyed with the name of variable, every exercice was done right ! Regards, -- Serge Stinckwich UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC), Hanoi, Vietnam Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk http://doesnotunderstand.org/

July 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Request for test

by Serge Stinckwich

On Thu, Jul 29, 2010 at 8:38 PM, Hilaire Fernandes <hilaire.fernandes(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Dear all, > > I am preparing a DrGeo release. > > I will be very please if Windows and Mac user could test it for me please. > > I need to know if the application icon is looking like a triangle and if > DrGeo UI is in French for the French users. > > Here it is: http://people.ofset.org/hilaire/DrGeo.app.zip Great ! The application icon is looking like a triangle and the UI is in french on my mac. Are the translations available somewhere online ? Regards, -- Serge Stinckwich UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC), Hanoi, Vietnam Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk http://doesnotunderstand.org/

July 30, 2010