March 2010 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Squeak VM+FT2Plugin, all Pharo 1.0 rc3 tests green

by John M McIntosh

On 2010-03-30, at 11:43 AM, Levente Uzonyi wrote: > That's probably because Laurent built almost every plugin as external. These include those which are responsible for displaying stuff on the screen. Um, mmmm Once we find and load the plugin we cache the entry point so later references don't incur much of a cost. Maybe there is no compiler optimization in the compile for the external plugin? -- =========================================================================== John M. McIntosh <johnmci(a)smalltalkconsulting.com> Twitter: squeaker68882 Corporate Smalltalk Consulting Ltd. http://www.smalltalkconsulting.com ===========================================================================

March 30, 2010

[Pharo-project] Fluid menus.... wish list of K. Beck.

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Begin forwarded message: > From: Kent Beck <kentb(a)earthlink.net> > Date: March 30, 2010 9:55:03 PM GMT+02:00 > To: StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> > Subject: Re: feedback on the bees book > > Please do forward my idea to the list. I'm available for consultation with whoever is implementing it. The key seems to me to begin with the goal--a more fluid programming experience--and work backwards to measures that approximate "fluidity" and a way of rapidly experimenting and getting getting concrete feedback. > > Cheers, > > Kent > > On Mar 30, 2010, at 12:29 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > >>> >>> That's one of the deep lessons of software development--the tortoise beats the hare. Every day you make the software better, it gets better. >> >> exact, so sadly. Smalltalkers got trapped in their nice little boxes and now lua is popping up as well as ruby or python. So many missed opportunities >> and total lack of vision. ... >>> I do enjoy Pharo. I find that it's still quite awkward with a Mac, from a click path perspective (too many gestures necessary for the common actions), >>> but I don't have any concrete suggestions so I suppose I shouldn't complain. >> >>> I don't remember exactly which operations are hard to get to, except perhaps "extract method". I'd love to have Pharo instrumented so every menu item was tracked, then do a global optimization to reduce the number of gestures necessary to operate the interface. >> >> kent if you let me forward this mail to pharo may be somebody will do it just because you say so. >> >>> I suppose for completeness you'd also need to track the time between when a menu popped up and when the item was selected. This would avoid the Squeak problem of endlessly growing menus. I wonder if anyone has done this kind of quantitative UI design optimization before... >>> >>> Too many fun things to do. >> >> > Yes ;)

March 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Squeak VM+FT2Plugin, all Pharo 1.0 rc3 tests green

by laurent laffont

I've tried to put XDisplayControlPluggin as internal but it fails. After some search: http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/3350 Laurent Laffont On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 8:43 PM, Levente Uzonyi <leves(a)elte.hu> wrote: > On Tue, 30 Mar 2010, Adrian Lienhard wrote: > > Hi Laurent, >> >> Here a problem report concerning your VM ( >> http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-bin.tar.gz) >> from a Ubuntu 64bit user. >> >> His machine: >> >> (k)ubuntu karmic x64 >> Linux toat 2.6.31-20-generic #58-Ubuntu SMP Fri Mar 12 04:38:19 UTC 2010 >> x86_64 GNU/Linux >> Pulseaudio: 1:0.9.19-0ubuntu4.1 >> Intel(R) Core(TM) i7 CPU, 950 @ 3.07GHz >> >> The first problem he had was that the VM segfaulted. He then disabled >> psdsp in the startup script. This fixed the crash and sound worked (Beeper >> beep). >> >> His tinyBenchmark results are: >> >> 582811610 bytecodes/sec; 15102233 sends/sec >> 562946673 bytecodes/sec; 16346261 sends/sec >> 583475783 bytecodes/sec; 16404381 sends/sec >> 589522164 bytecodes/sec; 16288551 sends/sec >> 570791527 bytecodes/sec; 16389812 sends/sec >> 527835051 bytecodes/sec; 14646769 sends/sec >> 590201729 bytecodes/sec; 16288551 sends/sec >> 586483390 bytecodes/sec; 16231248 sends/sec >> 590542099 bytecodes/sec; 16259849 sends/sec >> 542085759 bytecodes/sec; 14763943 sends/sec >> >> ...compared to a 3.9-8 #1 Tue Jan 13 16:33:40 UTC 2009 gcc 4.3.3 VM: >> >> 580828133 bytecodes/sec; 18995358 sends/sec >> 539515279 bytecodes/sec; 17677135 sends/sec >> 552617377 bytecodes/sec; 17865371 sends/sec >> 588167719 bytecodes/sec; 19129213 sends/sec >> 579185520 bytecodes/sec; 18947146 sends/sec >> 585812356 bytecodes/sec; 16785105 sends/sec >> 545551411 bytecodes/sec; 18164300 sends/sec >> 577226606 bytecodes/sec; 19227754 sends/sec >> 587155963 bytecodes/sec; 19080321 sends/sec >> 580498866 bytecodes/sec; 18815817 sends/sec >> >> The new VM is slower on sends/sec, but the really astonishing difference >> is not in the benchmarks but in the GUI performance. It is really slow. Just >> moving the mouse around on an empty world makes CPU consumption go up to >> over 70%! He didn't experience this problem with the old 3.9-8 VM. >> > > > That's probably because Laurent built almost every plugin as external. > These include those which are responsible for displaying stuff on the > screen. > > > Levente > > > >> Cheers, >> Adrian >> >> >> On Mar 26, 2010, at 22:11 , laurent laffont wrote: >> >> Hi, >>> >>> Finally I've managed to build squeak vm rev. 2135 (current stable) with >>> FT2Plugin which makes all tests green on Pharo 1.0 rc3 image........ on >>> my >>> machine :) >>> >>> If some Linux users can test it on their distro, thanks. >>> >>> The clean binary archive: >>> http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-bin.tar.gz >>> >>> The generated source archive: >>> http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src.tar.gz >>> >>> PharoCore-1.0 + configured VMMaker 1.2 image (for new vm builders, to >>> have >>> a known working base): >>> http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/PharoCore-1.0-VMMaker-1.2.tar.gz >>> >>> >>> To build from source archive: >>> ======================= >>> wget >>> http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src.tar.gz >>> tar -xvzf Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src.tar.gz >>> cd Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src/ >>> mkdir build && cd build >>> ../unix/cmake/configure >>> make >>> sudo make install >>> >>> >>> Internal plugins: >>> ====================== >>> UUIDPlugin >>> >>> External plugins: >>> ====================== >>> ADPCMCodecPlugin >>> AioPlugin >>> AsynchFilePlugin >>> B2DPlugin >>> B3DAcceleratorPlugin >>> BMPReadWriterPlugin >>> BitBltPlugin >>> CroquetPlugin >>> DSAPrims >>> DropPlugin >>> FFTPlugin >>> FT2Plugin >>> FileCopyPlugin >>> FilePlugin >>> FloatArrayPlugin >>> FloatMathPlugin >>> GeniePlugin >>> HostWindowPlugin >>> JPEGReadWriter2Plugin >>> JPEGReaderPlugin >>> JoystickTabletPlugin >>> Klatt >>> LargeIntegers >>> LocalePlugin >>> MIDIPlugin >>> Matrix2x3Plugin >>> MiscPrimitivePlugin >>> Mpeg3Plugin >>> QuicktimePlugin >>> RePlugin >>> SecurityPlugin >>> SerialPlugin >>> SocketPlugin >>> SoundCodecPrims >>> SoundGenerationPlugin >>> SoundPlugin >>> Squeak3D >>> SqueakFFIPrims >>> StarSqueakPlugin >>> SurfacePlugin >>> UnixOSProcessPlugin >>> XDisplayControlPlugin >>> ZipPlugin >>> >>> >>> Fun story: if you don't have SecurityPlugin, LocaleTest>>testFontFullName >>> deletes your image :) >>> testFontFullName >>> "self debug: #testFontFullName" >>> | env dir | >>> env := (Locale isoLanguage: 'ja') languageEnvironment. >>> dir := FileDirectory on: SecurityManager default untrustedUserDirectory. >>> [dir recursiveDelete] <-------------- Cool !! >>> on: Error >>> do: [:e | e]. >>> env fontFullName. >>> self assert: dir exists >>> >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Laurent Laffont >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pharo-project mailing list >>> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

March 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Writing test

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Excellent!!!! Thanks a lot Date DateAndTime Character You also have http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=2234 sorted got introduced and it would be nice to have some tests. On Mar 30, 2010, at 8:10 PM, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: > I would like to help to write unit test for Pharo. > I have already contributed a simple one. > Which classes (category) need attention? > I prefer to start with simple one. > > Hilaire > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

March 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] The Windows VM

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 7:37 AM, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de> wrote: > >No, I don't think so. I don't know who did it > > I did it and will redo a new one based on the new 4.0 > hopefully this week to create a new installer. > > Ok...excellent. > Is the new 1.0 dev-image already in place? > > I don't know what you refer to that phrase. There is no Pharo 1.0 stable release done yet. The last one was RC3 and yes, it is in the "right place", the Pharo download section from the website. Maybe I understood wrong. This week there may be a PharoCore RC4 and after a dev. But not sure if a new core is needed or just a dev. > However - the changes from Andreas should only affect > Squeak and there should also be no problem in still using > the 3.11.8. VM > > Ok. Perfect. > Bye > T. > > > > > > > -- > GMX DSL: Internet, Telefon und Entertainment fÃ¼r nur 19,99 EUR/mtl.! > http://portal.gmx.net/de/go/dsl02 > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

March 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Squeak VM+FT2Plugin, all Pharo 1.0 rc3 tests green

by Levente Uzonyi

On Tue, 30 Mar 2010, Adrian Lienhard wrote: > Hi Laurent, > > Here a problem report concerning your VM (http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-bin.tar.gz) from a Ubuntu 64bit user. > > His machine: > > (k)ubuntu karmic x64 > Linux toat 2.6.31-20-generic #58-Ubuntu SMP Fri Mar 12 04:38:19 UTC 2010 x86_64 GNU/Linux > Pulseaudio: 1:0.9.19-0ubuntu4.1 > Intel(R) Core(TM) i7 CPU, 950 @ 3.07GHz > > The first problem he had was that the VM segfaulted. He then disabled psdsp in the startup script. This fixed the crash and sound worked (Beeper beep). > > His tinyBenchmark results are: > > 582811610 bytecodes/sec; 15102233 sends/sec > 562946673 bytecodes/sec; 16346261 sends/sec > 583475783 bytecodes/sec; 16404381 sends/sec > 589522164 bytecodes/sec; 16288551 sends/sec > 570791527 bytecodes/sec; 16389812 sends/sec > 527835051 bytecodes/sec; 14646769 sends/sec > 590201729 bytecodes/sec; 16288551 sends/sec > 586483390 bytecodes/sec; 16231248 sends/sec > 590542099 bytecodes/sec; 16259849 sends/sec > 542085759 bytecodes/sec; 14763943 sends/sec > > ...compared to a 3.9-8 #1 Tue Jan 13 16:33:40 UTC 2009 gcc 4.3.3 VM: > > 580828133 bytecodes/sec; 18995358 sends/sec > 539515279 bytecodes/sec; 17677135 sends/sec > 552617377 bytecodes/sec; 17865371 sends/sec > 588167719 bytecodes/sec; 19129213 sends/sec > 579185520 bytecodes/sec; 18947146 sends/sec > 585812356 bytecodes/sec; 16785105 sends/sec > 545551411 bytecodes/sec; 18164300 sends/sec > 577226606 bytecodes/sec; 19227754 sends/sec > 587155963 bytecodes/sec; 19080321 sends/sec > 580498866 bytecodes/sec; 18815817 sends/sec > > The new VM is slower on sends/sec, but the really astonishing difference is not in the benchmarks but in the GUI performance. It is really slow. Just moving the mouse around on an empty world makes CPU consumption go up to over 70%! He didn't experience this problem with the old 3.9-8 VM. That's probably because Laurent built almost every plugin as external. These include those which are responsible for displaying stuff on the screen. Levente > > Cheers, > Adrian > > > On Mar 26, 2010, at 22:11 , laurent laffont wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> Finally I've managed to build squeak vm rev. 2135 (current stable) with >> FT2Plugin which makes all tests green on Pharo 1.0 rc3 image........ on my >> machine :) >> >> If some Linux users can test it on their distro, thanks. >> >> The clean binary archive: >> http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-bin.tar.gz >> >> The generated source archive: >> http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src.tar.gz >> >> PharoCore-1.0 + configured VMMaker 1.2 image (for new vm builders, to have >> a known working base): >> http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/PharoCore-1.0-VMMaker-1.2.tar.gz >> >> >> To build from source archive: >> ======================= >> wget >> http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src.tar.gz >> tar -xvzf Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src.tar.gz >> cd Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src/ >> mkdir build && cd build >> ../unix/cmake/configure >> make >> sudo make install >> >> >> Internal plugins: >> ====================== >> UUIDPlugin >> >> External plugins: >> ====================== >> ADPCMCodecPlugin >> AioPlugin >> AsynchFilePlugin >> B2DPlugin >> B3DAcceleratorPlugin >> BMPReadWriterPlugin >> BitBltPlugin >> CroquetPlugin >> DSAPrims >> DropPlugin >> FFTPlugin >> FT2Plugin >> FileCopyPlugin >> FilePlugin >> FloatArrayPlugin >> FloatMathPlugin >> GeniePlugin >> HostWindowPlugin >> JPEGReadWriter2Plugin >> JPEGReaderPlugin >> JoystickTabletPlugin >> Klatt >> LargeIntegers >> LocalePlugin >> MIDIPlugin >> Matrix2x3Plugin >> MiscPrimitivePlugin >> Mpeg3Plugin >> QuicktimePlugin >> RePlugin >> SecurityPlugin >> SerialPlugin >> SocketPlugin >> SoundCodecPrims >> SoundGenerationPlugin >> SoundPlugin >> Squeak3D >> SqueakFFIPrims >> StarSqueakPlugin >> SurfacePlugin >> UnixOSProcessPlugin >> XDisplayControlPlugin >> ZipPlugin >> >> >> Fun story: if you don't have SecurityPlugin, LocaleTest>>testFontFullName >> deletes your image :) >> testFontFullName >> "self debug: #testFontFullName" >> | env dir | >> env := (Locale isoLanguage: 'ja') languageEnvironment. >> dir := FileDirectory on: SecurityManager default untrustedUserDirectory. >> [dir recursiveDelete] <-------------- Cool !! >> on: Error >> do: [:e | e]. >> env fontFullName. >> self assert: dir exists >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> Laurent Laffont >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

March 30, 2010

[Pharo-project] Writing test

by Hilaire Fernandes

I would like to help to write unit test for Pharo. I have already contributed a simple one. Which classes (category) need attention? I prefer to start with simple one. Hilaire

March 30, 2010

[Pharo-project] [update 1.1] #11301

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

11301 ----- - Issue 2183: Better MC feedback on HttpRepository (from squeak) - Issue 2191: sorted: and friends (from squeak) Stef

March 30, 2010

[Pharo-project] [update 1.1] #11300

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

- Issue 2236: Finalization of multiple resources. Thanks Henrik - Issue 1339: Pharo beta crashes with ODBC, perhaps FFI FFI fix for VM crashes which might happen after loading, and fields may be inproperly initialized... Thanks Henrik - CollectionsTest thanks Hilaire - Issue 2229: speedUp DecompilerTest. Thanks levente. Stef

March 30, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Squeak VM+FT2Plugin, all Pharo 1.0 rc3 tests green

by laurent laffont

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 6:29 PM, Adrian Lienhard <adi(a)netstyle.ch> wrote: > Hi Laurent, > > Here a problem report concerning your VM ( > http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-bin.tar.gz) > from a Ubuntu 64bit user. > > So he uses the binary archive ? As I compiled it on a 32bits machine, it's not really a surprise.... We need to provide both 32bits *and* 64bits version. Can he recompile the vm using http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src.tar.gz<http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-bin.tar.gz> , test it then send the archive ? I will rename my archive with -32 suffix. Thanks for the report. Laurent Laffont > His machine: > > (k)ubuntu karmic x64 > Linux toat 2.6.31-20-generic #58-Ubuntu SMP Fri Mar 12 04:38:19 UTC 2010 > x86_64 GNU/Linux > Pulseaudio: 1:0.9.19-0ubuntu4.1 > Intel(R) Core(TM) i7 CPU, 950 @ 3.07GHz > > The first problem he had was that the VM segfaulted. He then disabled psdsp > in the startup script. This fixed the crash and sound worked (Beeper beep). > > His tinyBenchmark results are: > > 582811610 bytecodes/sec; 15102233 sends/sec > 562946673 bytecodes/sec; 16346261 sends/sec > 583475783 bytecodes/sec; 16404381 sends/sec > 589522164 bytecodes/sec; 16288551 sends/sec > 570791527 bytecodes/sec; 16389812 sends/sec > 527835051 bytecodes/sec; 14646769 sends/sec > 590201729 bytecodes/sec; 16288551 sends/sec > 586483390 bytecodes/sec; 16231248 sends/sec > 590542099 bytecodes/sec; 16259849 sends/sec > 542085759 bytecodes/sec; 14763943 sends/sec > > ...compared to a 3.9-8 #1 Tue Jan 13 16:33:40 UTC 2009 gcc 4.3.3 VM: > > 580828133 bytecodes/sec; 18995358 sends/sec > 539515279 bytecodes/sec; 17677135 sends/sec > 552617377 bytecodes/sec; 17865371 sends/sec > 588167719 bytecodes/sec; 19129213 sends/sec > 579185520 bytecodes/sec; 18947146 sends/sec > 585812356 bytecodes/sec; 16785105 sends/sec > 545551411 bytecodes/sec; 18164300 sends/sec > 577226606 bytecodes/sec; 19227754 sends/sec > 587155963 bytecodes/sec; 19080321 sends/sec > 580498866 bytecodes/sec; 18815817 sends/sec > > The new VM is slower on sends/sec, but the really astonishing difference is > not in the benchmarks but in the GUI performance. It is really slow. Just > moving the mouse around on an empty world makes CPU consumption go up to > over 70%! He didn't experience this problem with the old 3.9-8 VM. > > Cheers, > Adrian > > > On Mar 26, 2010, at 22:11 , laurent laffont wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > Finally I've managed to build squeak vm rev. 2135 (current stable) with > > FT2Plugin which makes all tests green on Pharo 1.0 rc3 image........ on > my > > machine :) > > > > If some Linux users can test it on their distro, thanks. > > > > The clean binary archive: > > > http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-bin.tar.gz > > > > The generated source archive: > > > http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src.tar.gz > > > > PharoCore-1.0 + configured VMMaker 1.2 image (for new vm builders, to > have > > a known working base): > > http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/PharoCore-1.0-VMMaker-1.2.tar.gz > > > > > > To build from source archive: > > ======================= > > wget > > > http://lolgzs.free.fr/pharo/squeak-vm/Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src.tar.gz > > tar -xvzf Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src.tar.gz > > cd Squeak-3.11.3.2135-pharo-src/ > > mkdir build && cd build > > ../unix/cmake/configure > > make > > sudo make install > > > > > > Internal plugins: > > ====================== > > UUIDPlugin > > > > External plugins: > > ====================== > > ADPCMCodecPlugin > > AioPlugin > > AsynchFilePlugin > > B2DPlugin > > B3DAcceleratorPlugin > > BMPReadWriterPlugin > > BitBltPlugin > > CroquetPlugin > > DSAPrims > > DropPlugin > > FFTPlugin > > FT2Plugin > > FileCopyPlugin > > FilePlugin > > FloatArrayPlugin > > FloatMathPlugin > > GeniePlugin > > HostWindowPlugin > > JPEGReadWriter2Plugin > > JPEGReaderPlugin > > JoystickTabletPlugin > > Klatt > > LargeIntegers > > LocalePlugin > > MIDIPlugin > > Matrix2x3Plugin > > MiscPrimitivePlugin > > Mpeg3Plugin > > QuicktimePlugin > > RePlugin > > SecurityPlugin > > SerialPlugin > > SocketPlugin > > SoundCodecPrims > > SoundGenerationPlugin > > SoundPlugin > > Squeak3D > > SqueakFFIPrims > > StarSqueakPlugin > > SurfacePlugin > > UnixOSProcessPlugin > > XDisplayControlPlugin > > ZipPlugin > > > > > > Fun story: if you don't have SecurityPlugin, LocaleTest>>testFontFullName > > deletes your image :) > > testFontFullName > > "self debug: #testFontFullName" > > | env dir | > > env := (Locale isoLanguage: 'ja') languageEnvironment. > > dir := FileDirectory on: SecurityManager default untrustedUserDirectory. > > [dir recursiveDelete] <-------------- Cool !! > > on: Error > > do: [:e | e]. > > env fontFullName. > > self assert: dir exists > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > Laurent Laffont > > _______________________________________________ > > Pharo-project mailing list > > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

March 30, 2010