December 2010 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

[Pharo-project] Teleplace is hiring...

by Eliot Miranda

Hi All, Are you eager to work on cutting-edge business communications technology? Are you passionate about UI design? Do you have significant experience implementing innovative user interfaces in Smalltalk? Do you and your peers consider yourself a strong Smalltalk programmer? If so, Teleplace is hiring and looking for someone just like you. Please send resumes to Stephen Ceplenski <steve(a)teleplace.com>, Andreas Raab <andreas.raab(a)teleplace.com> or myself, Eliot Miranda <eliot(a)teleplace.com>. best Eliot

Dec. 6, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Popularity or not of smalltalk?

by Eliot Miranda

On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 2:38 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On 6 December 2010 23:22, Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi James, > > a good list of enterprise projects is > > here > http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/userblogs/cincom/blogView?content=successes > . > > The high-lights are JP Morgan, and Texas Instruments/Adventa. But also > try > > and dig up stuff on OOCL's ISIS 2 shipping app and Deutche Bahn's > schduling > > application (computes schedules for the entire German railway system). > > If you dig you'll find lots of enterprise applications written in > Smalltalk. > > When I started working for ParcPlace Systems companies like JPMorgan > didn't > > allow us to name then since using Smalltalk was such an important > > competitive advantage. That shot a lot of feet, indiscriminately amongst > > both corporate user and vendo aliker. > > > That's kind of fun. > It reminds me the fisherman, who i met once on the lake, > and when i said that i came here just for one day as a guest of my > really far relatives, then he smiled > and started saying everything about fishing, and saying that at his > place, a fish catching goes like on conveyor, > but for all people who passed by, he was making a bored face and > saying that , ohhh.. no fish damn it.. no fish.. > bad place, reaallyy bad one :) > it's great for the fisherman, but really bad for the bait shop... :) :( :/ best Eliot > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko AKA sig. > >

Dec. 6, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Popularity or not of smalltalk?

by Igor Stasenko

On 6 December 2010 23:22, Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi James, > Â Â Â a good list of enterprise projects is > hereÂ http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/userblogs/cincom/blogView?content=successes. > Â The high-lights are JP Morgan, and Texas Instruments/Adventa. Â But also try > and dig up stuff on OOCL's ISIS 2 shipping app and Deutche Bahn's schduling > application (computes schedules for the entire German railway system). > If you dig you'll find lots of enterprise applications written in Smalltalk. > Â When I started working for ParcPlace Systems companies like JPMorgan didn't > allow us to name then since using Smalltalk was such an important > competitive advantage. Â That shot a lot of feet, indiscriminately amongst > both corporate user and vendo aliker. > That's kind of fun. It reminds me the fisherman, who i met once on the lake, and when i said that i came here just for one day as a guest of my really far relatives, then he smiled and started saying everything about fishing, and saying that at his place, a fish catching goes like on conveyor, but for all people who passed by, he was making a bored face and saying that , ohhh.. no fish damn it.. no fish.. bad place, reaallyy bad one :) -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

Dec. 6, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Popularity or not of smalltalk?

by Eliot Miranda

Hi James, a good list of enterprise projects is here http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/userblogs/cincom/blogView?content=successes. The high-lights are JP Morgan, and Texas Instruments/Adventa. But also try and dig up stuff on OOCL's ISIS 2 shipping app and Deutche Bahn's schduling application (computes schedules for the entire German railway system). If you dig you'll find lots of enterprise applications written in Smalltalk. When I started working for ParcPlace Systems companies like JPMorgan didn't allow us to name then since using Smalltalk was such an important competitive advantage. That shot a lot of feet, indiscriminately amongst both corporate user and vendo aliker. On Sun, Dec 5, 2010 at 9:51 PM, James Ladd <james_ladd(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > While pleading for Smalltalk support with a developer from a popular and > great IDE company, I got the > > following response (below) > > > Is there anything I can do/show to prove or disprove the popularity of > Smalltalk? > > > Rgs, James. > > > >>Hello James. > >>About Smalltalk plugin. Weel, Iâm not sure Smalltalk has a big audience > now. Iâve never heard about commercial products based on Smalltalk. > >>Here, some statistics http://langpop.com/ >

Dec. 6, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Smalltalk in small steps ?

by Igor Stasenko

On 6 December 2010 21:50, James Ladd <james_ladd(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > Hi All, > > As some of you may know I am writing a Smalltalk for the Java Virtual > Machine and it is coming along well. > http://redline.st with source on http://github.com > > Recently I came across a series of blog posts by Peter Michaux on Scheme > from scratch and I wondered: > > Would it be worth while for the Smalltalk community, and language > enthusiasts if I were to do the same with > Redline Smalltalk, that is, make each features implementation part of a blog > post and a 'work along' ? > It is good for readers like me. Since you can describe the choices you made along the road and explain why you go that direction rather than another one. It is always interesting reading about such things. So, please do :) > Would you like to see this and or work along with Redline ? > > Rgs, James. > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

Dec. 6, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Popularity or not of smalltalk?

by Igor Stasenko

On 6 December 2010 21:22, Tudor Girba <tudor.girba(a)gmail.com> wrote: > This kind of view is nice as a joke, but I also think it tends to be counter productive. We should not kid ourselves. There are so many books because there is a market large enough to consume them. > No, but you know, books about Java or C++ dedicating a full chapters explaining classes, visibility rules, constructors, destructors, virtual functions, templates or <generics> and all things related to that. A lot of wasted paper (where the Green Peace looking? ;)) And now take the smalltalk at the other side. What we have? Just classes and methods. Simple rules. End. So, at the day when one student finish learning the basics of java or C++, a student who decided to learn smalltalk will finish learning a standard class library basics, and will be ready to go with first coding attempts. While Java/C++ student will still be 2 or 3 chapters away from finishing with basic language concepts and rules. It is a lot of time for reading, not mentioned about how much time it takes to comprehend and understand all the concepts and remember them. Yes, maybe its a bigger market. But i know a good way to learn something: write a description (book) of it. So it looks like many people wanting to learn C++ or Java so bad, that they start writing a books about it. Good for them. Good for readers. Bad for Green Peace :) > Cheers, > Doru -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

Dec. 6, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Problem updating Pharo Core

by Guillermo Polito

Oh, can I download the last core from there? :D On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 6:11 PM, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr>wrote: > > On Dec 6, 2010, at 7:59 PM, Guillermo Polito wrote: > > I have the last prebuild pharo core (12261), and clicking on update stops > in version 12266 with a DNU: > > *nil does not understand binary* > > It has something to do with the monticello a version with this info: > 'Issue 3191: SparseLargeArray-MarcusDenker.2.mcz' > > Did someone had this same issue? > > > the build server seems to have no problem: > > https://pharo-ic.lille.inria.fr/hudson/job/Pharo%20Core%201.2/ > > > -- > Marcus Denker -- http://www.marcusdenker.de > INRIA Lille -- Nord Europe. Team RMoD. > >

Dec. 6, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Issue 1594 in pharo: refactor to use #ifNil:

by Mariano Martinez Peck

In a VM mail Andreas said: "Some set of incomplete process/delay/semaphore changes in Pharo. One of the problems with processes and delays is that this part of the system reacts very badly to random "cleaning". I.e., changing "foo == nil" to "foo isNil" can have dramatic effects (since it introduces a suspension point) with just the kind of weird issue you're seeing." I don't know if this is related to this issue. cheers mariano On Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 10:50 PM, Peter van Rooijen <peter(a)vanrooijen.com>wrote: > On Thu, 02 Dec 2010 12:32:02 +0100, Levente Uzonyi <leves(a)elte.hu> wrote: > > On Thu, 2 Dec 2010, Peter van Rooijen wrote: >> >> I agree, >>> >>> If you want to know if a object is the same object as >>> that designated by the expression nil, you use the message #== >>> (this message had guaranteed semantics since it can not be redefined). >>> >>> If you want to know if the message ifNil: aBlock sent to the object >>> evaluates the block argument, you use the message #ifNil: >>> (which could do anything it has been defined to do >>> - at least, I would hope so!). >>> >>> Those two uses are distinct and mean something different. >>> >> >> In theory yes, but the compiler also inlines #ifNil:, #ifNil:ifNotNil:, >> #ifNotNil: and #ifNotNil:ifNil: if the arguments are literal blocks. So in >> that case, they are equivalent with == nil ifTrue:/ifFalse:. >> > > Thanks for explaining, I wasn't aware of that. > > Seems like a really ugly hack to me. > Deciding semantics based on an argument type, > before the receiver type is known...extremely fishy. > > Now, if the compiler inlined [...] ifNil: <something> > that would be a different matter, since the receiver > class is known at compile time, and it's not such > a big deal to require those semantics to be fixed. > > Cheers, Peter > > > Levente >> > >

Dec. 6, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Problem updating Pharo Core

by Marcus Denker

On Dec 6, 2010, at 7:59 PM, Guillermo Polito wrote: > I have the last prebuild pharo core (12261), and clicking on update stops in version 12266 with a DNU: > > nil does not understand binary > > It has something to do with the monticello a version with this info: 'Issue 3191: SparseLargeArray-MarcusDenker.2.mcz' > > Did someone had this same issue? > the build server seems to have no problem: https://pharo-ic.lille.inria.fr/hudson/job/Pharo%20Core%201.2/ -- Marcus Denker -- http://www.marcusdenker.de INRIA Lille -- Nord Europe. Team RMoD.

Dec. 6, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo Wishlist (was Native Windows in Pharo)

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 7:58 PM, Sean P. DeNigris <sean(a)clipperadams.com>wrote: > > There was a ( hijacked ;-) ) thread on the user list about a feature > wishlist. Although I think the "Benevolent Dictator" model is better > suited > for this stage of Pharo's evolution, it would be cool for the dictators > (since they are benevolent and the opin-ers will not "disappear") to see > what the community is passionate about. > > The reference was to the http://uservoice.com/ online app, which I've > enjoyed using for PersonalBrain (http://www.thebrain.com/) > I guess that if someone can give it a try (create the survey, etc), pharaoers will "vote". > > Sean > > See relevant quotes below from > http://forum.world.st/Native-Windows-in-Pharo-td3071794.html: > > > Andres Fortier-2 wrote: > > > > Ok, I see. Is there a "wishlist" associated with Pharo? Something like > > http://feedback.assembla.com/? > > > > thanks! > > AndrÃ©s > > > > > Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > > > There are some related pages in http://code.google.com/p/pharo/w/list > > > > For exampple: http://code.google.com/p/pharo/wiki/IdeasToImplement > > > > cheers > > > > mariano > > > > > Andres Fortier-2 wrote: > > > > Thanks Mariano! I was looking for something more "formal", to let user's > > vote for features and a commitment of the dev team to include N of the > > most voted per release (of course N depends on the release cycle and the > > feature complexity). > > > > Thanks! > > AndrÃ©s > > > -- > View this message in context: > http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Wishlist-was-Native-Windows-in-Pharo-tp3075089p… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > >

Dec. 6, 2010