November 2010 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Cannot assign a parameter

by Henrik Sperre Johansen

On 28.11.2010 15:36, Adrian Lienhard wrote: > I'll also note that this topic was discussed before and some people argued that argument assignments can lead to bad code quality... +1 to that, your example of allowing nil to a method expecting something else as a prime example. Good luck debugging THAT (and figuring out it is indeed the cause) if nil is passed erroneously :) Cheers, Henry

Nov. 28, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Cannot assign a parameter

by laurent laffont

OK thank you. Little joke: http://magaloma.blogspot.com/2010/11/revenge-of-smalltalk.html Laurent. On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 3:36 PM, Adrian Lienhard <adi(a)netstyle.ch> wrote: > Its an artificial restriction. Method arguments are just like temps, i.e., > the interpreter does not distinguish between the two; its only the compiler > that restricts assignments to arguments (I'm not 100% sure, but I assume > that this still holds with Eliot's new closure compiler). > > I think it would be nice to be able to assign to arguments. In some cases > they make for concise and better readable code (I got used to this for > instance in Python and JavaScript). For example, consider a method that uses > an argument in multiple places and you figure that you need to handle the > case in which the argument is nil. You just add a line like: arg := arg > ifNil: [ 0 ]. Without argument assignment you would need to create a temp > var with a different name and change all usage of the old arg variable. > > Block args had been writable until the new closure compiler was introduced, > which by default disallows arg assignments. I don't remember what the > rationale for this change was (?). > > On the flip side, one has to consider code portability. For projects like > Seaside this probably is a no go. But for projects that don't need to be > ported I think it would be a worthwhile change. Projects that need to avoid > portability troubles with other dialects should use Lint rules (stuff like > this is better checked by Lint than the compiler...). > > I'll also note that this topic was discussed before and some people argued > that argument assignments can lead to bad code quality... > > Cheers, > Adrian > > On Nov 28, 2010, at 11:41 , Max Leske wrote: > > > +1 > > > > > > On 28.11.2010, at 11:26, laurent laffont wrote: > > > >> I would like to know whether it's a design choice or a technical > obstacle. > >> > >> I've seen: > >> > >> Parser>>assignment: varNode > >> " var ':=' expression => AssignmentNode." > >> | loc start | > >> (loc := varNode assignmentCheck: encoder at: prevMark + > requestorOffset) >= 0 > >> ifTrue: [^self notify: 'Cannot store into' at: loc]. > >> ..... > >> > >> > >> TempVariableNode>>assignmentCheck: encoder at: location > >> ^((self isBlockArg and: [Parser allowBlockArgumentAssignment not]) > >> or: [self isMethodArg]) > "<-- not allowed !" > >> ifTrue: [location] > >> ifFalse: [-1] > >> > >> But no explanation :( > >> > >> > >> Laurent > >> > >> > >> > >> On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:59 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> Yeah, that's true, I've noticed that too. I guess it's on purpose but I > have no idea. AFAIK you can't assign a new value to a parameter anywhere in > the method not only when using blocks. Maybe it's not possible because there > is not really a 'variable' but only a reference. So assigning a new value to > the parameter would effectively override the reference. But don't trust me > on this.... > >> > >> Cheers, > >> Max > >> > >> > >> On 28.11.2010, at 10:54, laurent laffont wrote: > >> > >>> Sorry > >>> > >>> foo: n > >>> ^[:i| n := n+i. ] > >>> > >>> vs > >>> > >>> foo: n > >>> |s| > >>> s := n. > >>> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] > >>> > >>> > >>> Laurent > >>> > >>> On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > >>> In the first example you didn't declare 's': > >>> > >>> foo:n > >>> ^ [ :i || s | s:= s+i ] > >>> > >>> Or did I misunderstand the question? > >>> > >>> Cheers, > >>> Max > >>> > >>> > >>> On 28.11.2010, at 10:30, laurent laffont wrote: > >>> > >>>> Hi, > >>>> > >>>> I can't write > >>>> > >>>> foo: n > >>>> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] > >>>> > >>>> but > >>>> > >>>> foo: n > >>>> |s| > >>>> s := n. > >>>> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Why ? > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Cheers, > >>>> > >>>> Laurent Laffont > >>>> > >>>> Pharo Smalltalk Screencasts: http://www.pharocasts.com/ > >>>> Blog: http://magaloma.blogspot.com/ > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > > > > >

Nov. 28, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Cannot assign a parameter

by Adrian Lienhard

Its an artificial restriction. Method arguments are just like temps, i.e., the interpreter does not distinguish between the two; its only the compiler that restricts assignments to arguments (I'm not 100% sure, but I assume that this still holds with Eliot's new closure compiler). I think it would be nice to be able to assign to arguments. In some cases they make for concise and better readable code (I got used to this for instance in Python and JavaScript). For example, consider a method that uses an argument in multiple places and you figure that you need to handle the case in which the argument is nil. You just add a line like: arg := arg ifNil: [ 0 ]. Without argument assignment you would need to create a temp var with a different name and change all usage of the old arg variable. Block args had been writable until the new closure compiler was introduced, which by default disallows arg assignments. I don't remember what the rationale for this change was (?). On the flip side, one has to consider code portability. For projects like Seaside this probably is a no go. But for projects that don't need to be ported I think it would be a worthwhile change. Projects that need to avoid portability troubles with other dialects should use Lint rules (stuff like this is better checked by Lint than the compiler...). I'll also note that this topic was discussed before and some people argued that argument assignments can lead to bad code quality... Cheers, Adrian On Nov 28, 2010, at 11:41 , Max Leske wrote: > +1 > > > On 28.11.2010, at 11:26, laurent laffont wrote: > >> I would like to know whether it's a design choice or a technical obstacle. >> >> I've seen: >> >> Parser>>assignment: varNode >> " var ':=' expression => AssignmentNode." >> | loc start | >> (loc := varNode assignmentCheck: encoder at: prevMark + requestorOffset) >= 0 >> ifTrue: [^self notify: 'Cannot store into' at: loc]. >> ..... >> >> >> TempVariableNode>>assignmentCheck: encoder at: location >> ^((self isBlockArg and: [Parser allowBlockArgumentAssignment not]) >> or: [self isMethodArg]) "<-- not allowed !" >> ifTrue: [location] >> ifFalse: [-1] >> >> But no explanation :( >> >> >> Laurent >> >> >> >> On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:59 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> Yeah, that's true, I've noticed that too. I guess it's on purpose but I have no idea. AFAIK you can't assign a new value to a parameter anywhere in the method not only when using blocks. Maybe it's not possible because there is not really a 'variable' but only a reference. So assigning a new value to the parameter would effectively override the reference. But don't trust me on this.... >> >> Cheers, >> Max >> >> >> On 28.11.2010, at 10:54, laurent laffont wrote: >> >>> Sorry >>> >>> foo: n >>> ^[:i| n := n+i. ] >>> >>> vs >>> >>> foo: n >>> |s| >>> s := n. >>> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >>> >>> >>> Laurent >>> >>> On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>> In the first example you didn't declare 's': >>> >>> foo:n >>> ^ [ :i || s | s:= s+i ] >>> >>> Or did I misunderstand the question? >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Max >>> >>> >>> On 28.11.2010, at 10:30, laurent laffont wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> I can't write >>>> >>>> foo: n >>>> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >>>> >>>> but >>>> >>>> foo: n >>>> |s| >>>> s := n. >>>> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >>>> >>>> >>>> Why ? >>>> >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> >>>> Laurent Laffont >>>> >>>> Pharo Smalltalk Screencasts: http://www.pharocasts.com/ >>>> Blog: http://magaloma.blogspot.com/ >>> >>> >> >> >

Nov. 28, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Cannot assign a parameter

by Nicolas Cellier

2010/11/28 laurent laffont <laurent.laffont(a)gmail.com>: > I would like to know whether it's a design choice or a technical obstacle. > Clearly a design choice as you discovered. One good reason is to ease debugging : it is easier to accept/restart if the method context has not changed. Nicolas

Nov. 28, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Shrinking image much more slow in Windows than MACOSX

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

cool the video is nice. Stef On Nov 28, 2010, at 2:24 PM, nullPointer wrote: > > I added the Shrink image tool on CLFramework, like a option in World menu. > > A example of use is showed in Youtube - > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tonZdxOOJ10 > > Regards > -- > View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Shrinking-image-much-more-slow-in-Windows-than-MACOSX… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >

Nov. 28, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Shrinking image much more slow in Windows than MACOSX

by nullPointer

I added the Shrink image tool on CLFramework, like a option in World menu. A example of use is showed in Youtube - > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tonZdxOOJ10 Regards -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Shrinking-image-much-more-slow-in-Windows-than-MACOSX… Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Nov. 28, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Cannot assign a parameter

by laurent laffont

Indeed if I rewrite TempVariableNode>>assignmentCheck: encoder at: location ^(self isBlockArg and: [Parser allowBlockArgumentAssignment not]) ifTrue: [location] ifFalse: [-1] then foo: n ^[:i| n := n+i. ] works. But I don't know the impact.... Laurent On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 11:41 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: > +1 > > > On 28.11.2010, at 11:26, laurent laffont wrote: > > I would like to know whether it's a design choice or a technical obstacle. > > I've seen: > > Parser>>assignment: varNode > " var ':=' expression => AssignmentNode." > | loc start | > (loc := varNode assignmentCheck: encoder at: prevMark + requestorOffset) >= > 0 > ifTrue: [^self notify: 'Cannot store into' at: loc]. > ..... > > > TempVariableNode>>assignmentCheck: encoder at: location > ^((self isBlockArg and: [Parser allowBlockArgumentAssignment not]) > or: [self isMethodArg]) > "<-- not allowed !" > ifTrue: [location] > ifFalse: [-1] > > But no explanation :( > > > Laurent > > > > On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:59 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> Yeah, that's true, I've noticed that too. I guess it's on purpose but I >> have no idea. AFAIK you can't assign a new value to a parameter anywhere in >> the method not only when using blocks. Maybe it's not possible because there >> is not really a 'variable' but only a reference. So assigning a new value to >> the parameter would effectively override the reference. But don't trust me >> on this.... >> >> Cheers, >> Max >> >> >> On 28.11.2010, at 10:54, laurent laffont wrote: >> >> Sorry >> >> foo: n >> ^[:i| n := n+i. ] >> >> vs >> >> foo: n >> |s| >> s := n. >> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >> >> >> Laurent >> >> On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> In the first example you didn't declare 's': >>> >>> foo:n >>> ^ [ :i || s | s:= s+i ] >>> >>> Or did I misunderstand the question? >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Max >>> >>> >>> On 28.11.2010, at 10:30, laurent laffont wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> I can't write >>> >>> foo: n >>> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >>> >>> but >>> >>> foo: n >>> |s| >>> s := n. >>> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >>> >>> >>> Why ? >>> >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Laurent Laffont >>> >>> Pharo Smalltalk Screencasts: http://www.pharocasts.com/ >>> Blog: http://magaloma.blogspot.com/ >>> >>> >>> >> >> > >

Nov. 28, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Cannot assign a parameter

by Max Leske

+1 On 28.11.2010, at 11:26, laurent laffont wrote: > I would like to know whether it's a design choice or a technical obstacle. > > I've seen: > > Parser>>assignment: varNode > " var ':=' expression => AssignmentNode." > | loc start | > (loc := varNode assignmentCheck: encoder at: prevMark + requestorOffset) >= 0 > ifTrue: [^self notify: 'Cannot store into' at: loc]. > ..... > > > TempVariableNode>>assignmentCheck: encoder at: location > ^((self isBlockArg and: [Parser allowBlockArgumentAssignment not]) > or: [self isMethodArg]) "<-- not allowed !" > ifTrue: [location] > ifFalse: [-1] > > But no explanation :( > > > Laurent > > > > On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:59 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Yeah, that's true, I've noticed that too. I guess it's on purpose but I have no idea. AFAIK you can't assign a new value to a parameter anywhere in the method not only when using blocks. Maybe it's not possible because there is not really a 'variable' but only a reference. So assigning a new value to the parameter would effectively override the reference. But don't trust me on this.... > > Cheers, > Max > > > On 28.11.2010, at 10:54, laurent laffont wrote: > >> Sorry >> >> foo: n >> ^[:i| n := n+i. ] >> >> vs >> >> foo: n >> |s| >> s := n. >> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >> >> >> Laurent >> >> On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> In the first example you didn't declare 's': >> >> foo:n >> ^ [ :i || s | s:= s+i ] >> >> Or did I misunderstand the question? >> >> Cheers, >> Max >> >> >> On 28.11.2010, at 10:30, laurent laffont wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> I can't write >>> >>> foo: n >>> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >>> >>> but >>> >>> foo: n >>> |s| >>> s := n. >>> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >>> >>> >>> Why ? >>> >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Laurent Laffont >>> >>> Pharo Smalltalk Screencasts: http://www.pharocasts.com/ >>> Blog: http://magaloma.blogspot.com/ >> >> > >

Nov. 28, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Cannot assign a parameter

by laurent laffont

I would like to know whether it's a design choice or a technical obstacle. I've seen: Parser>>assignment: varNode " var ':=' expression => AssignmentNode." | loc start | (loc := varNode assignmentCheck: encoder at: prevMark + requestorOffset) >= 0 ifTrue: [^self notify: 'Cannot store into' at: loc]. ..... TempVariableNode>>assignmentCheck: encoder at: location ^((self isBlockArg and: [Parser allowBlockArgumentAssignment not]) or: [self isMethodArg]) "<-- not allowed !" ifTrue: [location] ifFalse: [-1] But no explanation :( Laurent On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:59 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Yeah, that's true, I've noticed that too. I guess it's on purpose but I > have no idea. AFAIK you can't assign a new value to a parameter anywhere in > the method not only when using blocks. Maybe it's not possible because there > is not really a 'variable' but only a reference. So assigning a new value to > the parameter would effectively override the reference. But don't trust me > on this.... > > Cheers, > Max > > > On 28.11.2010, at 10:54, laurent laffont wrote: > > Sorry > > foo: n > ^[:i| n := n+i. ] > > vs > > foo: n > |s| > s := n. > ^[:i| s := s+i. ] > > > Laurent > > On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> In the first example you didn't declare 's': >> >> foo:n >> ^ [ :i || s | s:= s+i ] >> >> Or did I misunderstand the question? >> >> Cheers, >> Max >> >> >> On 28.11.2010, at 10:30, laurent laffont wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> I can't write >> >> foo: n >> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >> >> but >> >> foo: n >> |s| >> s := n. >> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >> >> >> Why ? >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> Laurent Laffont >> >> Pharo Smalltalk Screencasts: http://www.pharocasts.com/ >> Blog: http://magaloma.blogspot.com/ >> >> >> > >

Nov. 28, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Cannot assign a parameter

by Max Leske

Yeah, that's true, I've noticed that too. I guess it's on purpose but I have no idea. AFAIK you can't assign a new value to a parameter anywhere in the method not only when using blocks. Maybe it's not possible because there is not really a 'variable' but only a reference. So assigning a new value to the parameter would effectively override the reference. But don't trust me on this.... Cheers, Max On 28.11.2010, at 10:54, laurent laffont wrote: > Sorry > > foo: n > ^[:i| n := n+i. ] > > vs > > foo: n > |s| > s := n. > ^[:i| s := s+i. ] > > > Laurent > > On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: > In the first example you didn't declare 's': > > foo:n > ^ [ :i || s | s:= s+i ] > > Or did I misunderstand the question? > > Cheers, > Max > > > On 28.11.2010, at 10:30, laurent laffont wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> I can't write >> >> foo: n >> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >> >> but >> >> foo: n >> |s| >> s := n. >> ^[:i| s := s+i. ] >> >> >> Why ? >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> Laurent Laffont >> >> Pharo Smalltalk Screencasts: http://www.pharocasts.com/ >> Blog: http://magaloma.blogspot.com/ > >

Nov. 28, 2010