January 2010 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Building Pharo and Plugins for Mac OS X and Linux

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

thanks! Stef On Jan 5, 2010, at 3:55 PM, Javier PimÃ¡s wrote: > It's nice to see there's more info about VM's than I thought, it would be even nicer to have it all gathered in just one place and up to date so it's easier to find it. Recently I started compiling my own unix VMs and as I was very confused at first, I decided to write a small guide for beginers to share my experiences (and to remember the steps after some time). It has some still-unanswered questions, but is thought for beginners, so it might help you. The link is this: > > http://wwew.javipimas.com.ar/node/2 > > hope it helps. > > regards, > Javier. > > On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 1:21 AM, David T. Lewis <lewis(a)mail.msen.com> wrote: > On Mon, Jan 04, 2010 at 09:04:26PM +0100, St?phane Ducasse wrote: > > David > > check the squeak documentation on how to invoke external library with FFI. > > In pharo you have also alien (not tested on non intel - works on mac). > > > > You do not have to recompile the vm to invoke external library. You define methods with specific pragmas > > annotations and the plugin code can be invoked. > > > > One if these days we should write a better doc > > > > http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/2426 > > http://www.is.titech.ac.jp/~ohshima/squeak/DShowVideo/index.html > > http://www.visoracle.com/squeak/faq/ffi-windows.html > > http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/356 > > > > VMMaker is published on SqueakSource. > > May be people with more experience will comment. > > Tim Rowledge's explanation of VMMaker is here: > http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/2105 > > You will also find detailed instructions for VM builders along > with the platform source code, which is maintained in a Subversion > source code repository at squeakvm.org: > http://squeakvm.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/trunk/platforms/ > > For example, documentation on building for Unix (Linux) will > be found here: > http://squeakvm.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/trunk/platforms/unix/doc/HowToBuild… > > And for Windows: > http://squeakvm.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/trunk/platforms/win32/docs/?rev=2147 > which points to: > http://squeakvm.org/win32/ > > And for Mac OS: > http://squeakvm.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/trunk/platforms/Mac%20OS/vm/Documen… > as well as other documents that John mentioned in his reply. > > In other words, after you download the platform source code from the > Subversion repository, you will find detailed documentation in the > subdirectory for each of the major platforms. > > There is also a mailing list for the VM: > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/vm-dev > > Dave > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > > -- > Javier PimÃ¡s > Ciudad de Buenos Aires > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

Jan. 5, 2010

[Pharo-project] About documentation

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Hi guys I discussed with lukas and we could get the same infrastructure than for the seaside book http://book.seaside.st - editable but with editor control. - able to generate latex Now I want to know if some of you want to control that because I cannot. Stef

Jan. 5, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] What about killing PharoWeb images?

by Schwab,Wilhelm K

My experience is that the images on the site probably are not "stable" as-is, but that means the process needs to be fixed rather than killing off useful products - sending people off on their own will not help anything in itself. We also need to put some obstacles in the way of inclusion in Pharo; the latter will have pros and cons, but I suspect it will eventually be necessary for us to have a quality product. Bill ________________________________ From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Mariano Martinez Peck Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2010 12:01 PM To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] What about killing PharoWeb images? As an example...today I was in a Stef lesson at the Ecole de Mines. They have to do a TP with Pharo, and it was really sad to see Stef asking me in the middle of the class if the dev image from the website was usable or not. Image the students thoughts. I had to put the last image I had "stable" and put it in a USB key and give it to the students. On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 5:58 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck(a)gmail.com<mailto:marianopeck@gmail.com>> wrote: On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 5:48 PM, Geert Claes <geert.wl.claes(a)gmail.com<mailto:geert.wl.claes@gmail.com>> wrote: Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > Because of all the things I already have said: why to duplicate efforts? > In that case, you the Seaside one click. What cab be easier than that ? > And it would be FAR more stable than ours. Do we create PharoGlassClient > image ? no. Do we create PharoMoos image? no. Because it is obvious that > they know better than us what versions to include. Of course, if Seaside > ready images doesn't exist we will probably do it. Give me only one > reason why spending time and resources in PharoWeb? (taking into account > you have other several alternatives better than this) > I don't see it as duplicating efforts, the Pharo-Web image is (should be) more than Pharo-Seaside and having this sandpit image will probably give a lot more feedback than just having a Pharo-Dev image ... in my view. Ok, fortunately, we live in a free world :) Everybody can think whatever. And that's cool. Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > There is no such thing of "Pharo team". Pharo team are us. You. The > community. Pharo has NO employee. There is the board but doesn't mean they > are working full time in Pharo. > Settle down mate ... anyway, the Pharo Team is doing great stuff :) Yes, no problem :) But this is not something small to say. For me this is very important. For example, do you know who use to do the dev images since the last 2 or even more years ? Damien. Unfortunately Damien is very complicated with his studies (in Java) and has very little (or almost nothing) to prepare the images. So, it is easy to pretend. But who will do the images right now ? You will ? Anyway, I am glad to hear all the opinions. So...instead of building bad images, unstable and that gives a bad impression to the final user I proposed a simple solution for this. Maybe it is not the best. But this what we have. I even think I would do what I said having good images (but forget this). Damien also use to integrate stuff on OB and O2 for example before release. Who will do that now ? I don't know. That's why I am since 2 weeks writing Metacello configurations for all packages and that's why I asked Damien if he could send me his scrips and instructions of how to build those images. Kind regards, Mariano -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/What-about-killing-PharoWeb-images-tp4249050p4256091.h… Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto:Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

Jan. 5, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Permutations and Combinations in SequenceableCollection

by Henrik Johansen

On Jan 5, 2010, at 5:19 32PM, John Toohey wrote: > Hi, > I'm trying to generate the permutations of a sequence of numbers. I've found # permutationsDo: aBlock, but this generated the permutation of the entire sequence. I want to do it in groups of 2. The #combinations: anInteger atATimeDo: aBlock method does what I need for combinations, but I cannot find the equivalent for permutations. Does something like this exist in the standard library, or in an external package. > > -- > -JT How about: #(1 2 3 4) combinations: 2 atATimeDo: [:array | array permutationsDo: [:each | Transcript show: each printString; cr]] ? Cheers, Henry

Jan. 5, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] What about killing PharoWeb images?

by Mariano Martinez Peck

As an example...today I was in a Stef lesson at the Ecole de Mines. They have to do a TP with Pharo, and it was really sad to see Stef asking me in the middle of the class if the dev image from the website was usable or not. Image the students thoughts. I had to put the last image I had "stable" and put it in a USB key and give it to the students. On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 5:58 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck(a)gmail.com > wrote: > > > On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 5:48 PM, Geert Claes <geert.wl.claes(a)gmail.com>wrote: > >> >> >> Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: >> > >> > Because of all the things I already have said: why to duplicate efforts? >> > In that case, you the Seaside one click. What cab be easier than that ? >> > And it would be FAR more stable than ours. Do we create >> PharoGlassClient >> > image ? no. Do we create PharoMoos image? no. Because it is obvious >> that >> > they know better than us what versions to include. Of course, if >> Seaside >> > ready images doesn't exist we will probably do it. Give me only one >> > reason why spending time and resources in PharoWeb? (taking into >> account >> > you have other several alternatives better than this) >> > >> >> I don't see it as duplicating efforts, the Pharo-Web image is (should be) >> more than Pharo-Seaside and having this sandpit image will probably give a >> lot more feedback than just having a Pharo-Dev image ... in my view. >> >> >> > Ok, fortunately, we live in a free world :) > Everybody can think whatever. And that's cool. > > >> >> Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: >> > >> > There is no such thing of "Pharo team". Pharo team are us. You. The >> > community. Pharo has NO employee. There is the board but doesn't mean >> they >> > are working full time in Pharo. >> > >> >> Settle down mate ... anyway, the Pharo Team is doing great stuff :) >> > > > Yes, no problem :) But this is not something small to say. For me this is > very important. For example, do you know who use to do the dev images since > the last 2 or even more years ? > Damien. Unfortunately Damien is very complicated with his studies (in Java) > and has very little (or almost nothing) to prepare the images. So, it is > easy to pretend. But who will do the images right now ? You will ? Anyway, I > am glad to hear all the opinions. > So...instead of building bad images, unstable and that gives a bad > impression to the final user I proposed a simple solution for this. Maybe it > is not the best. But this what we have. I even think I would do what I said > having good images (but forget this). > > Damien also use to integrate stuff on OB and O2 for example before release. > Who will do that now ? I don't know. > > That's why I am since 2 weeks writing Metacello configurations for all > packages and that's why I asked Damien if he could send me his scrips and > instructions of how to build those images. > > Kind regards, > > Mariano > > -- >> >> View this message in context: >> http://n2.nabble.com/What-about-killing-PharoWeb-images-tp4249050p4256091.h… >> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> > >

Jan. 5, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] What about killing PharoWeb images?

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 5:48 PM, Geert Claes <geert.wl.claes(a)gmail.com>wrote: > > > Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > > > Because of all the things I already have said: why to duplicate efforts? > > In that case, you the Seaside one click. What cab be easier than that ? > > And it would be FAR more stable than ours. Do we create PharoGlassClient > > image ? no. Do we create PharoMoos image? no. Because it is obvious that > > they know better than us what versions to include. Of course, if Seaside > > ready images doesn't exist we will probably do it. Give me only one > > reason why spending time and resources in PharoWeb? (taking into account > > you have other several alternatives better than this) > > > > I don't see it as duplicating efforts, the Pharo-Web image is (should be) > more than Pharo-Seaside and having this sandpit image will probably give a > lot more feedback than just having a Pharo-Dev image ... in my view. > > > Ok, fortunately, we live in a free world :) Everybody can think whatever. And that's cool. > > Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > > > There is no such thing of "Pharo team". Pharo team are us. You. The > > community. Pharo has NO employee. There is the board but doesn't mean > they > > are working full time in Pharo. > > > > Settle down mate ... anyway, the Pharo Team is doing great stuff :) > Yes, no problem :) But this is not something small to say. For me this is very important. For example, do you know who use to do the dev images since the last 2 or even more years ? Damien. Unfortunately Damien is very complicated with his studies (in Java) and has very little (or almost nothing) to prepare the images. So, it is easy to pretend. But who will do the images right now ? You will ? Anyway, I am glad to hear all the opinions. So...instead of building bad images, unstable and that gives a bad impression to the final user I proposed a simple solution for this. Maybe it is not the best. But this what we have. I even think I would do what I said having good images (but forget this). Damien also use to integrate stuff on OB and O2 for example before release. Who will do that now ? I don't know. That's why I am since 2 weeks writing Metacello configurations for all packages and that's why I asked Damien if he could send me his scrips and instructions of how to build those images. Kind regards, Mariano -- > View this message in context: > http://n2.nabble.com/What-about-killing-PharoWeb-images-tp4249050p4256091.h… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Jan. 5, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] What about killing PharoWeb images?

by Geert Claes

Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > Because of all the things I already have said: why to duplicate efforts? > In that case, you the Seaside one click. What cab be easier than that ? > And it would be FAR more stable than ours. Do we create PharoGlassClient > image ? no. Do we create PharoMoos image? no. Because it is obvious that > they know better than us what versions to include. Of course, if Seaside > ready images doesn't exist we will probably do it. Give me only one > reason why spending time and resources in PharoWeb? (taking into account > you have other several alternatives better than this) > I don't see it as duplicating efforts, the Pharo-Web image is (should be) more than Pharo-Seaside and having this sandpit image will probably give a lot more feedback than just having a Pharo-Dev image ... in my view. Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > There is no such thing of "Pharo team". Pharo team are us. You. The > community. Pharo has NO employee. There is the board but doesn't mean they > are working full time in Pharo. > Settle down mate ... anyway, the Pharo Team is doing great stuff :) -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/What-about-killing-PharoWeb-images-tp4249050p4256091.h… Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Jan. 5, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] What about killing PharoWeb images?

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 5:20 PM, Geert Claes <geert.wl.claes(a)gmail.com>wrote: > > > Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > > > Ok....so, after reading all answers and comments I see the following > > possible actions: > > > > 1) Do nothing and keep things as now > > 2) Like 1) but change PharoWeb name to PharoSeaside. > > 3) Don't create PharoWeb images any more but gives the user the > > possibilities to use Seaside + Pharo. > > > > The Pharo-Web image is not just the Pharo Seaside image though! I also > remember earlier versions of Pharo-Web to have stuff like AIDAWeb and > others, but I recently noticed too that was no longer the case. > I haven't see AIDAWeb in a Web image, but that's a very good idea. > > I would go option 4 :) Until Pharo has a well established user friendly > package management system, why not look at the Pharo-Web image as Pharo's > showcase web development image? A one-click image people can play around > with without having to know too much about how to load stuff into their > image. > Because of all the things I already have said: why to duplicate efforts? In that case, you the Seaside one click. What cab be easier than that ? And it would be FAR more stable than ours. Do we create PharoGlassClient image ? no. Do we create PharoMoos image? no. Because it is obvious that they know better than us what versions to include. Of course, if Seaside ready images doesn't exist we will probably do it. Give me only one reason why spending time and resources in PharoWeb ? (taking into account you have other several alternatives better than this) > > On another note, the Pharo team probalby has enough other stuff on their > plate to worry too much about what to do with the Pharo-Web image :) > There is no such thing of "Pharo team". Pharo team are us. You. The community. Pharo has NO employee. There is the board but doesn't mean they are working full time in Pharo. > -- > View this message in context: > http://n2.nabble.com/What-about-killing-PharoWeb-images-tp4249050p4255967.h… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Jan. 5, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] What about killing PharoWeb images?

by Geert Claes

Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > Ok....so, after reading all answers and comments I see the following > possible actions: > > 1) Do nothing and keep things as now > 2) Like 1) but change PharoWeb name to PharoSeaside. > 3) Don't create PharoWeb images any more but gives the user the > possibilities to use Seaside + Pharo. > The Pharo-Web image is not just the Pharo Seaside image though! I also remember earlier versions of Pharo-Web to have stuff like AIDAWeb and others, but I recently noticed too that was no longer the case. I would go option 4 :) Until Pharo has a well established user friendly package management system, why not look at the Pharo-Web image as Pharo's showcase web development image? A one-click image people can play around with without having to know too much about how to load stuff into their image. On another note, the Pharo team probalby has enough other stuff on their plate to worry too much about what to do with the Pharo-Web image :) -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/What-about-killing-PharoWeb-images-tp4249050p4255967.h… Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Jan. 5, 2010

[Pharo-project] Permutations and Combinations in SequenceableCollection

by John Toohey

Hi, I'm trying to generate the permutations of a sequence of numbers. I've found # permutationsDo: aBlock, but this generated the permutation of the entire sequence. I want to do it in groups of 2. The #combinations: anInteger atATimeDo: aBlock method does what I need for combinations, but I cannot find the equivalent for permutations. Does something like this exist in the standard library, or in an external package. -- -JT

Jan. 5, 2010