January 2010 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo-beginner mailing list ?

by Stephen Taylor

Adrian Kuhn wrote: > For example, one thing we could do is pushing Stackoverflow. They have a large > userbase and excellent google ranks. When you ask a question on SO, it appears > *immediately* on google! StackOverflow is good. I recently asked a Pharo question there about missing browser features (can't show/exclude methods from superclasses) and got a few responses, so people will read Smalltalk questions. Steve

Jan. 11, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo for Professional Development

by Schwab,Wilhelm K

Dolphin is better than that<g>, and yes, it is a shame that it is tied to Windows. In fairness, I would have made the same initial decision as they did, but I would have started investigating wx or some other toolkit as early as XP's release, and would have gotten serious about it shortly thereafter. The feature you are describing is what they call an idea space, and it is probably my least favorite features of Dolphin. That said, the single main window of Pharo is both a blessing and a curse. It is nice if I have reason to run two images at once; it is less than optimal most other times. Bill -----Original Message----- From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Stephen Taylor Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2010 6:19 PM To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo for Professional Development Michael Rueger wrote: > Henrik Johansen wrote: > >> This is just another reason why multiple native windows would be >> nice, though, leaves the problem for someone else :) > > Interestingly enough a lot of the (complex) multiple native window > applications have (gone back to) all in one window UIs (Eclipse, all > of the Adobe products, ...). That was one of the last major developments on Dolphin Smalltalk before development was scaled back - a very nice tabbed window container for all of your workspaces, browsers, etc. I think the only thing it didn't hold was the Transcript, unfortunately. Dolphin's a fine piece of work - such a pity it's Windows only. > Michael Steve _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

Jan. 11, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] CUIS new Text Editor Classes

by Fernando olivero

I took a look at Safara, i loved the Object-Oriented approach to editors. But i've loaded the lastest version and had some bugs, seemed to me un-finished. Also i recall Lukas speaking of some performance issues. Is the creator of Safara working on it currently? Till Safara is usable and performant i think Cuis editors and TextMorph cleanup is the way to go. Fernando On Jan 11, 2010, at 12:16 AM, CÃ©drick BÃ©ler wrote: > Is it possible to integrate the work done in Safara ? > > Just asking ;) > > CÃ©drick > <ATT00001..txt>

Jan. 11, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Categorizing method extension with pragma

by Eliot Miranda

2010/1/10 CÃ©drick BÃ©ler <cdrick65(a)gmail.com> > Hi, > > Just a 2 cents thought on method extension. > > Why not associating a pragma instead of using the package name prefixed by > a star ? > > Say there is a package named MyPackage and I override a method in String or > add a new one. What I'd like is keeping the original method category name > (or find an appropriate one) instead of using *mypackage. For instance: > > String>>aMethod > <package: MyPackage> > ... > ... > ^result > > > Then, we would have to adapt monticello for that purpose. We could also use > dynamic protocols to get the list of extension method by package. > > What does other think ? I find it could be a good starting point to deal > with packages. > I don't like it because package location now means code changes. To move an extension method to another package one has to edit its source, and one would produce method differences when moving extension methods between packages. I think the praqma makes sense for namespaces, where an extension method can be in a different namespace than the class it is on. e.g. consider a Tools namespace that includes inspectors. The inspectorClass extension methods on kernel classes (e.g. Dictionary>>inspectorClass ^DictionaryInspector) logically belong to the Tools namespace, not to some Kernel namespace. So writing inspectorClass <environment: Tools.Inspectors> ^DictionaryInspector makes sense to me; it is directing the compiler to look for globals in the Tools.Inspector namespace, not elsewhere. This is a semantic difference and so of a different kind to the merely organizational package structure. We had a loooong (and possibly still unresolved) debate about this at Cincom where I argued (until I was blue in the face) that package organization should be orthogonal to namespaces, and others argued that they should be conflated. Personally, I find extension methods an integral part of good OO design because they allow a framework to be extended in arbitrary clients without the core framework being filled with client-dependent code. Whether those extensions are in the class's package or in the framework's package might be a matter of history (e.g. whether the framework came before the client or not) but the functioning of the extension should be the same in either case. So for me what package the code is in is a deployment/packaging issue, not a semantic one, and hence shouldn't be reflected in a pragma which is part of the method's source and metadata. But semantic issues (such as e.g. the namespace in which a method is compiled) can be reflected in pragmas. > > > -- > CÃ©drick > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Jan. 11, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo for Professional Development

by Stephen Taylor

Michael Rueger wrote: > Henrik Johansen wrote: > >> This is just another reason why multiple native windows would be nice, >> though, leaves the problem for someone else :) > > Interestingly enough a lot of the (complex) multiple native window > applications have (gone back to) all in one window UIs (Eclipse, all of > the Adobe products, ...). That was one of the last major developments on Dolphin Smalltalk before development was scaled back - a very nice tabbed window container for all of your workspaces, browsers, etc. I think the only thing it didn't hold was the Transcript, unfortunately. Dolphin's a fine piece of work - such a pity it's Windows only. > Michael Steve

Jan. 10, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] CUIS new Text Editor Classes

by CÃ©drick BÃ©ler

Is it possible to integrate the work done in Safara ? Just asking ;) CÃ©drick

Jan. 10, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] [BetaTesting] [ANN] Pharo1.0-10505-rc1dev10.01.1

by Lukas Renggli

Yeah, it should not have an effect on production. It is just the test that checked directly for the color to see if a button is highlighted and thus selected. The code is not used when running OB. I changed it to use some other magic morphic test that works with all themes. Lukas 2010/1/10 Tudor Girba <tudor.girba(a)gmail.com>: > Hi, > > I can now report that I worked 8 hours using the new dev image and I > encountered no problems at all. > > Cheers, > Doru > > > On 10 Jan 2010, at 21:11, Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > >> >> >> On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 9:02 PM, Stan Shepherd <stan.shepherd414(a)gmail.com >> > wrote: >> >> >> Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: >> > >> > Hi Folks/Beta-Testers! >> > >> > I have prepare a new PharoDev image. This image, has same >> differences with >> > the previous ones that you should know: >> > >> > 1) This is the first Dev image I ever prepare. I adapt to Mac OS >> Damien's >> > bash scripts to build them and I also cleanup all the Squeak stuff >> from >> > those bash scripts. So, maybe there are some problems. Forgive me >> if this >> > is >> > the case. I would like you to check, not only the Image in itself >> but also >> > the zip. The package.txt, changelog, the fonts, etc. >> > >> > 2) This image puts TrueType fonts again. We won't put StrikeFonts or >> > DejaVu >> > package until there is big bug with them. We know those fonts are >> faster, >> > but still a bit buggy. If you fix those issues, cool! >> > >> > 3) This image DOES NOT include O2. I know there are a lot of >> people who >> > use >> > it (mostly in Moose), but unfortunately, this was a decision >> taken. O2 >> > depends and overrides OB making this more unstable sometimes. The >> same as >> > the TrueType, we will put O2 again when this can be perfectly load >> in a >> > PharoCore image without anything about OB. >> > Sorry, but we rather affect only O2 users and not all. If you want >> > packages >> > support, then help in O2 development. >> > >> > 4) In previous Dev images only tests from PharoCore were included. >> Now, it >> > also includes the tests from the external packages loaded. >> > >> > 5) This image was build using Metacello configurations. If you want, >> > compare >> > the installScript.st from this image to the previous one. >> > >> > 6) There is no Web image this time. If you want to install Seaside >> 2.8.4 >> > evaluate: >> > >> > Gofer new >> > Â Â squeaksource: 'MetacelloRepository'; >> > Â Â package: 'ConfigurationOfSeaside28'; >> > Â Â load. >> > >> > (Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfSeaside28) load >> > >> > And if you want Seaside 3.0 evaluate: >> > >> > Gofer new >> > Â Â squeaksource: 'MetacelloRepository'; >> > Â Â package: 'ConfigurationOfSeaside30'; >> > Â Â load. >> > >> > (Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfSeaside30) loadLatestVersion >> > >> > However, I am not sure if this is perfectly working in Pharo. >> > >> > >> > >> > Ok .... Here is the link: >> > https://gforge.inria.fr/frs/download.php/25156/pharo1.0-10505-rc1dev10.01.1… >> > >> > I will wait a couple of days now and I will also start to use this >> image >> > for >> > my development. If there are issues, report them. If we have big >> issues, >> > this image is not release. On the other hand, if it works well, we >> release >> > it. >> > >> > >> >> Hi Mariano, great job. >> >> I was able to install Seaside 3 as per your instructions. Â Xubuntu >> 9.10. >> >> >> Cool. Thanks for reporting. I will put that code in the next ANN >> email. >> >> OB, refactoring, code critics all appear to be working faultlessly. >> I am >> impressed. >> >> >> Excellent. >> >> The only concern is that it took some hours >> >> hours ? seriously ? >> >> to download and install Seaside >> (albeit on a slow spare PC). And with occassional network glitches, >> I had to >> restart a method a few times from a debugger. So this would not be a >> practical proposition for a new Pharoer. >> >> >> Yes, maybe you are right with this. Anyway, a new Pharoer would use >> Seaside one click. That's what I suggested. >> >> Also the choice of fonts and theme makes for a better aesthetic >> result than >> >> Thanks. But the choice was not only mine. We try to decide between >> all of us. That's why eveytime I have a question, I send an email to >> the mailing list and then we do what the mayority of the people >> says :) >> >> the previous web image. For me, this is a much better image than that >> version. >> >> Thanks for all the work you have put into this, Â Â ...Stan >> >> >> You are welcome. Thanks for the report. >> >> >> -- >> View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/BetaTesting-ANN-Pharo1-0-10505-rc1dev10-01-1-tp4278312… >> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > > "Be rather willing to give than demanding to get." > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch

Jan. 10, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] [BetaTesting] [ANN] Pharo1.0-10505-rc1dev10.01.1

by Mariano Martinez Peck

Thanks Doru for the feedback!!! Now I hope to create a new one during the week with all the feedback I received and using Lukas OB. Thanks Lukas for the fix!!! This is cool :) On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 11:37 PM, Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> I guess we have to ignore it for now. > >> > > > > Yes, no problem at all. We are much better :) > > Ok, I found the reason and fixed it. It only appeared when one of the > Polymorph themes was activated. I was building with the default theme > and then switched to the standard theme before I saved. That's why I > could not reproduce. > > Lukas > > -- > Lukas Renggli > http://www.lukas-renggli.ch > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Jan. 10, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] [BetaTesting] [ANN] Pharo1.0-10505-rc1dev10.01.1

by Lukas Renggli

>> I guess we have to ignore it for now. >> > > Yes, no problem at all. We are much better :) Ok, I found the reason and fixed it. It only appeared when one of the Polymorph themes was activated. I was building with the default theme and then switched to the standard theme before I saved. That's why I could not reproduce. Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch

Jan. 10, 2010

Re: [Pharo-project] [BetaTesting] [ANN] Pharo1.0-10505-rc1dev10.01.1

by Tudor Girba

Hi, I can now report that I worked 8 hours using the new dev image and I encountered no problems at all. Cheers, Doru On 10 Jan 2010, at 21:11, Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > > On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 9:02 PM, Stan Shepherd <stan.shepherd414(a)gmail.com > > wrote: > > > Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > > > Hi Folks/Beta-Testers! > > > > I have prepare a new PharoDev image. This image, has same > differences with > > the previous ones that you should know: > > > > 1) This is the first Dev image I ever prepare. I adapt to Mac OS > Damien's > > bash scripts to build them and I also cleanup all the Squeak stuff > from > > those bash scripts. So, maybe there are some problems. Forgive me > if this > > is > > the case. I would like you to check, not only the Image in itself > but also > > the zip. The package.txt, changelog, the fonts, etc. > > > > 2) This image puts TrueType fonts again. We won't put StrikeFonts or > > DejaVu > > package until there is big bug with them. We know those fonts are > faster, > > but still a bit buggy. If you fix those issues, cool! > > > > 3) This image DOES NOT include O2. I know there are a lot of > people who > > use > > it (mostly in Moose), but unfortunately, this was a decision > taken. O2 > > depends and overrides OB making this more unstable sometimes. The > same as > > the TrueType, we will put O2 again when this can be perfectly load > in a > > PharoCore image without anything about OB. > > Sorry, but we rather affect only O2 users and not all. If you want > > packages > > support, then help in O2 development. > > > > 4) In previous Dev images only tests from PharoCore were included. > Now, it > > also includes the tests from the external packages loaded. > > > > 5) This image was build using Metacello configurations. If you want, > > compare > > the installScript.st from this image to the previous one. > > > > 6) There is no Web image this time. If you want to install Seaside > 2.8.4 > > evaluate: > > > > Gofer new > > squeaksource: 'MetacelloRepository'; > > package: 'ConfigurationOfSeaside28'; > > load. > > > > (Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfSeaside28) load > > > > And if you want Seaside 3.0 evaluate: > > > > Gofer new > > squeaksource: 'MetacelloRepository'; > > package: 'ConfigurationOfSeaside30'; > > load. > > > > (Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfSeaside30) loadLatestVersion > > > > However, I am not sure if this is perfectly working in Pharo. > > > > > > > > Ok .... Here is the link: > > https://gforge.inria.fr/frs/download.php/25156/pharo1.0-10505-rc1dev10.01.1… > > > > I will wait a couple of days now and I will also start to use this > image > > for > > my development. If there are issues, report them. If we have big > issues, > > this image is not release. On the other hand, if it works well, we > release > > it. > > > > > > Hi Mariano, great job. > > I was able to install Seaside 3 as per your instructions. Xubuntu > 9.10. > > > Cool. Thanks for reporting. I will put that code in the next ANN > email. > > OB, refactoring, code critics all appear to be working faultlessly. > I am > impressed. > > > Excellent. > > The only concern is that it took some hours > > hours ? seriously ? > > to download and install Seaside > (albeit on a slow spare PC). And with occassional network glitches, > I had to > restart a method a few times from a debugger. So this would not be a > practical proposition for a new Pharoer. > > > Yes, maybe you are right with this. Anyway, a new Pharoer would use > Seaside one click. That's what I suggested. > > Also the choice of fonts and theme makes for a better aesthetic > result than > > Thanks. But the choice was not only mine. We try to decide between > all of us. That's why eveytime I have a question, I send an email to > the mailing list and then we do what the mayority of the people > says :) > > the previous web image. For me, this is a much better image than that > version. > > Thanks for all the work you have put into this, ...Stan > > > You are welcome. Thanks for the report. > > > -- > View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/BetaTesting-ANN-Pharo1-0-10505-rc1dev10-01-1-tp4278312… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project -- www.tudorgirba.com "Be rather willing to give than demanding to get."

Jan. 10, 2010