September 2009 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: Universes? or Metacello meta repository

by Tudor Girba

Basically yes, but for that we just need a way to manage Pharo versions. So, as long as we can say what Pharo 1.0 is, we should be able to do that. Cheers, Doru On 16 Sep 2009, at 13:29, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > Ok but for pharo1.0 it would be nice to have it :) > then after we plug metacello underneath > > Doru with metacello will we be able to say > I want to load in the past the version of moose which worked with > pharo1.0 > even if now I'm working on pharo 3.2 (the real future :)) > > Stef > On Sep 16, 2009, at 1:08 PM, Damien Cassou wrote: > >> On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 11:38 AM, Tudor Girba <girba(a)iam.unibe.ch> >> wrote: >>> I believe Metacello is a very nice piece of work and it should be a >>> very strong contender for managing releases. The ui tools are not >>> quite there yet, but it works very nicely for allowing someone to >>> specify the exact configuration to be loaded. >> >> I agree. Universes is cool but: >> >> - it requires a dedicated server and only few people installed one >> already >> - it only allows one administrator per package description >> - the interface is well... not very nice :-) >> - we would need to create a new universe from scratch >> >> -- >> Damien Cassou >> http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st >> >> "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them >> popular by not having them." James Iry >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project -- www.tudorgirba.com "Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be done."

Sept. 16, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: Universes? or Metacello meta repository

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Ok but for pharo1.0 it would be nice to have it :) then after we plug metacello underneath Doru with metacello will we be able to say I want to load in the past the version of moose which worked with pharo1.0 even if now I'm working on pharo 3.2 (the real future :)) Stef On Sep 16, 2009, at 1:08 PM, Damien Cassou wrote: > On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 11:38 AM, Tudor Girba <girba(a)iam.unibe.ch> > wrote: >> I believe Metacello is a very nice piece of work and it should be a >> very strong contender for managing releases. The ui tools are not >> quite there yet, but it works very nicely for allowing someone to >> specify the exact configuration to be loaded. > > I agree. Universes is cool but: > > - it requires a dedicated server and only few people installed one > already > - it only allows one administrator per package description > - the interface is well... not very nice :-) > - we would need to create a new universe from scratch > > -- > Damien Cassou > http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st > > "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them > popular by not having them." James Iry > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

Sept. 16, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Status of Alien FFI

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

> Probably that is the easiest solution. > Most of the time we did not rely on the dependencies because I'm not sure that the order can be specified. I think that in the future we will use metacello to resolve this ordering. > I'm just a bit lost in what is the preferred way of expressing package > dependencies and loading process. I see Monticello's package > dependencies but I also see specifically created load scripts and > things like Flair and Gofer. Flair was a parallel track to get a kind of metacello system. It will disappear. Gofer is a simple interface to replace Installer and metacello will use it to load and script loading of packages. > I'm rediscovering development in Pharo-Squeak (I have been mostly > working in Visualworks the last 5 years). So perhaps I'm asking a > silly question that does not make sense? ;-) No the problem is that we are also inventing new ways of managing our artefacts. Stef

Sept. 16, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: Universes? or Metacello meta repository

by Damien Cassou

On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 11:38 AM, Tudor Girba <girba(a)iam.unibe.ch> wrote: > I believe Metacello is a very nice piece of work and it should be a > very strong contender for managing releases. The ui tools are not > quite there yet, but it works very nicely for allowing someone to > specify the exact configuration to be loaded. I agree. Universes is cool but: - it requires a dedicated server and only few people installed one already - it only allows one administrator per package description - the interface is well... not very nice :-) - we would need to create a new universe from scratch -- Damien Cassou http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them popular by not having them." James Iry

Sept. 16, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Status of Alien FFI

by Peter Hugosson-Miller

On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 11:33 AM, Johan Brichau <johan.brichau(a)uclouvain.be>wrote: > > On 16 Sep 2009, at 10:33, Peter Hugosson-Miller wrote: > > > Is it possible to make 'Alien-Core' depend on 'Alien-Prereqs' (i.e. > > a nested dependency)? If it were then the correct loading order > > would be achieved > > Probably that is the easiest solution. > > I'm just a bit lost in what is the preferred way of expressing package > dependencies and loading process. I see Monticello's package > dependencies but I also see specifically created load scripts and > things like Flair and Gofer. > > I'm rediscovering development in Pharo-Squeak (I have been mostly > working in Visualworks the last 5 years). So perhaps I'm asking a > silly question that does not make sense? ;-) > > ---------------------------- > Johan Brichau > johan.brichau(a)uclouvain.be > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > Heh, it makes sense to me, since I come from VisualAge, where dependencies can be nested as deep as you like. I'm quite new to PharO though, so that's why I asked the question. Hopefully someone knows the answer. -- Cheers, Peter

Sept. 16, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] why pharo? :)

by Igor Stasenko

2009/9/16 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr>: > hi guys > > I found again this beautiful video that samuel sent when we were > brainstorming about the name of Pharo. > > Â Â Â Â http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2LeNBY_5gk&feature=related > > Enjoy. > Wery impressive video. Thanks Stef. > Stef > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

Sept. 16, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Visual nonsense

by Gary Chambers

Do you mean the icon or the button background? Regards, Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: "Schwab,Wilhelm K" <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu> To: <Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 12:02 AM Subject: [Pharo-project] Visual nonsense > Gary, especially for the W2k theme, it would be really nice to have a > distinct look for the selected view's icon in the task bar. > > Andy, is there a good place to change the background fill style? When I > last looked, it seemed to me that it was hard-coded. You mentioned a > configuration tool you wanted to build, but I would be happy to use a > do-it chunk to make the change; I just could not find a relevant style. > > Sorry to bug you guys with such relative minutia. Thanks to all for the > lots of stuff that works well enough that I notice these things. > > Bill > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

Sept. 16, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Polymorph - TabIndex and layoutFrames questions

by Gary Chambers

It is not a problem, as such. Just the wau layouts work. There used to be a good description on Bob's Super Swiki, though that seems to have vanished. Try here http://www.visoracle.com/squeak/faq/morphic_.html instead. Regards, Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: "nullPointer" <epicfan(a)gmail.com> To: <pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 10:23 PM Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Polymorph - TabIndex and layoutFrames questions > > > IÂ´m surely have a lack of knowledge. Can you orient to me a place where > that > problem is explained (a web page or resource)? > > Very thanks for the help. > > > Gary Chambers wrote: >> >> #position: and #extent: etc. won't work since the owner is laying out as >> per >> the layout frame. >> You'll need to adjust the offsets instead... >> >> Regards, Gary >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "nullPointer" <epicfan(a)gmail.com> >> To: <pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> >> Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 3:37 PM >> Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Polymorph - TabIndex and layoutFrames >> questions >> >> >>> >>> >>> >>> iÂ´m already using fractions and offsets, through my class >>> CLDecorMorph... >>> http://paste.lisp.org/display/87049 >>> >>> (Note: in that class properties as #position or #top, #left etc be >>> relatives to owner) >>> >>> IÂ´m use the owner always with ProportionalLayout and the "anchors" with >>> the >>> fractions-offsets mechanism. The problem is when I try set the >>> #position: >>> or >>> #extent: accessors. DonÂ´t works. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Gary Chambers wrote: >>>> >>>> 1. "Fixed" positioning can be achived by setting the fractions to 0@0 >>>> for >>>> top-left and bottom-right then using the offsets. >>>> >>>> Regards, Gary >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: nullPointer >>>> To: pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >>>> Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 12:03 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Polymorph - TabIndex and layoutFrames >>>> questions >>>> >>>> >>>> 1. I have always work with owners in ProportionalLayout, donÂ´t let >>>> work >>>> with another layoutPolicy in the canvas designer. In view designer >>>> exists >>>> the possibility of "anchor" a widget to top, left, down and right. That >>>> is >>>> all need the user ( for the moment ) for anchor a widget, but fails to >>>> change size and position.Exists the possibility of do it in >>>> ProportionalLayout on owner? >>>> >>>> >>>> 2. Then i understand than changing the order of submorphs that works? >>>> I >>>> will probe. >>>> >>>> Regards and many thanks. >>>> >>>> >>>> 2009/9/14 Gary Chambers (via Nabble) <[hidden email]> >>>> >>>> 1. position/extent depends on how thae morph is laid out in its >>>> owner. >>>> LayoutFrame is used when the owner specified a proportional layout, >>>> use the >>>> fractions to pin corners and the offsets to.. offset. >>>> If the owner specifies no layout then postion/extent work as >>>> expected. >>>> For table layouts things are more complicated (see >>>> hResizing/vResizing >>>> etc.) >>>> >>>> 2. Tab order (keyboard navigation) follows the order of the >>>> submorphs >>>> at >>>> present. Add your morphs (using addMorphback: or via the Polymorph >>>> row/column type stuff) in the order you want navigation to follow. >>>> >>>> Regards, Gary >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "nullPointer" <[hidden email]> >>>> To: <[hidden email]> >>>> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 9:48 PM >>>> Subject: [Pharo-project] Polymorph - TabIndex and layoutFrames >>>> questions >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > 1- How i can change the #position or #extent of a Morph with a >>>> layoutFrame >>>> > setted ? >>>> > >>>> > for example, i have a button "anchored" to top and right; if i >>>> set >>>> the >>>> > #position: of that button the position donÂ´t change. Then i try >>>> override >>>> > the >>>> > #position: accessor of my button; first set #layoutframe: to nil, >>>> later do >>>> > the set normally of #position: and later set again the old >>>> value >>>> of >>>> > #layoutFrame: , for remain the original anchors. But donÂ´t works. >>>> Well, if >>>> > I >>>> > execute the code in a WorkSpace, line to line, then works! but >>>> donÂ´t >>>> if >>>> > execute all code. I donÂ´t understand :| >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > 2- How works the tab index mechanism in Polymorph? >>>> > >>>> > in some of my Views i have controls with unordered tab order in >>>> controls. >>>> > How i can change the order? I donÂ´t see nothing for start. >>>> > >>>> > 3- Exists the possibility of change the position of cursor of a >>>> textbox? >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > Regards, and thanks for the help >>>> > >>>> > -- >>>> > View this message in context: >>>> > >>>> http://n2.nabble.com/Polymorph-TabIndex-and-layoutFrames-questions-tp363804… >>>> > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >>>> > >>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>> > Pharo-project mailing list >>>> > [hidden email] >>>> > >>>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Pharo-project mailing list >>>> [hidden email] >>>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> View this message in context: Re: [Pharo-project] Polymorph - >>>> TabIndex >>>> and layoutFrames questions >>>> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Pharo-project mailing list >>>> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >>>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Pharo-project mailing list >>>> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >>>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> View this message in context: >>> http://n2.nabble.com/Polymorph-TabIndex-and-layoutFrames-questions-tp363804… >>> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pharo-project mailing list >>> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> > > -- > View this message in context: > http://n2.nabble.com/Polymorph-TabIndex-and-layoutFrames-questions-tp363804… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

Sept. 16, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: Universes? or Metacello meta repository

by Tudor Girba

Hi Stef, I know I am not Dale, but I will give my two cents anyway :). I believe Metacello is a very nice piece of work and it should be a very strong contender for managing releases. The ui tools are not quite there yet, but it works very nicely for allowing someone to specify the exact configuration to be loaded. There are a couple of large case studies that already work (including Moose :)). Cheers, Doru On 16 Sep 2009, at 11:24, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > Hi > > I value the idea that when we look for a software (for example SIXX) > we can find a version that is working. In the past we used Universes > and > if was successful. > We cannot not have squeakmap and universe at the same time. > I discussed with damien briefly about that and he told me that we coud > have > a metacello alternative. > Now I wonder if for pharo 1.0 it makes sense. > May be having a nice Universe for pharo would be good and important. > > Dale what do you think? > Do you see metacello working in the story (may be for 1.1)? > Stef > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project -- www.tudorgirba.com "From an abstract enough point of view, any two things are similar."

Sept. 16, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Status of Alien FFI

by Johan Brichau

On 16 Sep 2009, at 10:33, Peter Hugosson-Miller wrote: > Is it possible to make 'Alien-Core' depend on 'Alien-Prereqs' (i.e. > a nested dependency)? If it were then the correct loading order > would be achieved Probably that is the easiest solution. I'm just a bit lost in what is the preferred way of expressing package dependencies and loading process. I see Monticello's package dependencies but I also see specifically created load scripts and things like Flair and Gofer. I'm rediscovering development in Pharo-Squeak (I have been mostly working in Visualworks the last 5 years). So perhaps I'm asking a silly question that does not make sense? ;-) ---------------------------- Johan Brichau johan.brichau(a)uclouvain.be

Sept. 16, 2009