July 2009 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Who are you?

by Gary Chambers

We (Pinesoft) are developing a new product, Pharo based. Not too many problems so far... Regards, Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: "Francois Stephany" <tulipe.moutarde(a)gmail.com> To: <pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> Sent: Tuesday, July 21, 2009 12:10 PM Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Who are you? > Alexandre Bergel wrote: >> How many companies are using Pharo? Without thinking too much, I know >> there are Netstyle.ch and Pinesoft. Are there more? > > We've just started a company ( http://agilitic.com/ ) with two friends. > We mainly do web development with Rails/Django but we're looking for > Seaside projects as well... > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

July 21, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Shall we forbid updating?

by Andreas Leidig

Rehi, the update more than once saved my day. As I experienced problems with the context menus on vista on latest images, the update function was the only workaround to get pharo acessible at all. Cheers, Andreas Damien Cassou schrieb: > Hi, > > in the Pharo images I produce, there is a System->Update that never > works. A lot of people are confused by it and don't know it only works > on the core. Shall we remove this item from the menu? > > Bye >

July 21, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo apparently slow on linux

by Andreas Leidig

Rehi, I experienced vm-does-not-start-anyway on linux. This make a throughout of 0 instructions/sec; rather slow... Cheers, Andreas StÃ©phane Ducasse schrieb: > Hi > > David shaffer reported to me in fuzzy way that pharo is slow on linux. > Dear linux users can you report if you experienced the same and > on which > machine > distributions > vm > image > > please compare the core and the dev (with browser usage) > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

July 21, 2009

[Pharo-project] Fwd: [SEWORLD] Call for Papers: Evaluation and Usability of Programming Languages and Tools (PLATEAU) 2009

by Alexandre Bergel

I like the idea of this workshop. If someone is going to OOPSLA this year, this may be interesting. If someone plan to go there, let me know. Cheers, Alexandre Begin forwarded message: > From: Shane Markstrum <smarkstr(a)acm.org> > Date: 20 July 2009 16:40:22 GMT-04:00 > To: types-announce(a)lists.seas.upenn.edu, seworld(a)sigsoft.org, announce(a)aosd.net > , chi-announcements(a)LISTSERV.ACM.ORG, hci-link(a)lists.uni-paderborn.de > Subject: [SEWORLD] Call for Papers: Evaluation and Usability of > Programming Languages and Tools (PLATEAU) 2009 > > Call for Papers > > PLATEAU 2009 > > First Workshop on > Evaluation and Usability of Programming Languages and Tools (PLATEAU) > in conjunction with Onward!/OOPSLA 2009 > October 25-29, 2009 (Orlando, FL) > > http://ecs.victoria.ac.nz/Events/PLATEAU/WebHome > > SUBMISSION SITE > > http://www.easychair.org/conferences/?conf=plateau09 > > IMPORTANT DATES > > Submission August 31 > Notification Mid-September (before close of early registration for > OOPSLA/Onward!) > Final version TBA > Workshop TBA, one-half or one-full day between October 25 and 29 > > SCOPE > > Programming languages exist to enable programmers to develop software > effectively. But how efficiently programmers can write software > depends on the usability of the languages and tools that they develop > with. The aim of this workshop is to discuss methods, metrics and > techniques for evaluating the usability of languages and language > tools. The supposed benefits of such languages and tools cover a large > space, including making programs easier to read, write, and maintain; > allowing programmers to write more flexible and powerful programs; and > restricting programs to make them more safe and secure. > > We plan to gather the intersection of researchers in the programming > language, programming tool, and human-computer interaction communities > to share their research and discuss the future of evaluation and > usability of programming languages and tools. We are also interested > in the input of other members of the programming research community > working on related areas, such as refactoring, design patterns, > program analysis, program comprehension, software visualization, > end-user programming, and other programming language paradigms. Some > particular areas of interest are: > > - empirical studies of programming languages > - methodologies and philosophies behind language and tool evaluation > - software design metrics and their relations to the underlying > language > - user studies of language features and software engineering tools > - visual techniques for understanding programming languages > - critical comparisons of programming paradigms, such as > object-oriented vs. functional > - tools to support evaluating programming languages > > SUBMISSIONS > > Participants are invited to submit a position paper describing their > on going work. We will accept papers (from 4 to 6 pages) that describe > work-in-progress or recently completed work based on the themes and > goals of the workshop or related topics, report on experiences gained, > question accepted wisdom, raise challenging open problems, or propose > speculative new approaches. Longer submissions will be considered, but > all submissions must be fewer than 10 pages. > > Submissions and final papers should be formatted using the ACM SIGPLAN > 10 point format. Templates for Word and LaTeX are available at > http://www.acm.org/sigs/sigplan/authorInformation.htm; this site also > contains links to useful information on how to write effective > submissions. > > Accepted submissions will be made available through this website and > workshop participants are encouraged to have read the position papers > before attending the workshop. Participants are also asked to prepare > a presentation to support their position paper. > > ORGANIZERS (and members of the Committee) > > Craig Anslow - Victoria University of Wellington, New Zealand > Shane Markstrum - Bucknell University, USA > Emerson Murphy-Hill - University of British Columbia, Canada > > PROGRAM COMMITTEE > > Andrew Black - Portland State University, USA > Larry Constantine - University of Madeira, Portugal > Jeff Foster - University of Maryland, College Park, USA > Robert Fuhrer - IBM Research, USA > Donna Malayeri - EPFL, Switzerland/Carnegie Mellon University, USA > Stuart Marshall - Victoria University of Wellington, New Zealand > Todd Millstein - University of California, Los Angeles, USA > James Noble - Victoria University of Wellington, New Zealand > Ewan Tempero - University of Auckland, New Zealand > > For more information, please see the workshop website: > > http://ecs.victoria.ac.nz/Events/PLATEAU/WebHome > > ============================================================ > To contribute to SEWORLD, send your submission to > mailto:seworld@sigsoft.org > > http://www.sigsoft.org/seworld provides more > information on SEWORLD as well as a complete archive of > messages posted to the list. > ============================================================ > > -- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

July 21, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Method Finder?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

I do often. Stef On Jul 21, 2009, at 3:27 PM, Adrian Lienhard wrote: > I wonder whether this is only useful as a cool demo or if people > actually use it (and find what they are looking for)? > > I never do. > > Adrian > > On Jul 21, 2009, at 15:21 , Marcus Denker wrote: > >> >> On 20.07.2009, at 22:48, Carlos Crosetti wrote: >> >>> Why is Method Finder delivered when Method Search is doing better? >> >> Method finder has one cool feature: search by example. You can put in >> 3. 4. 7 >> >> and it tells you which methods to call to get 3 <something> 4 = 7. >> >> But on the negative side, it does duplicate functionality and it >> references >> *a lot* of symbols (as it has tables of methods to call). >> >> Marcus >> >> -- >> Marcus Denker -- marcus(a)2denker.de >> http://www.2denker.de >> >> 2denker UG (haftungsbeschrÃ¤nkt) >> Sitz KÃ¶ln >> Amtsgericht - Registergericht - KÃ¶ln, HRB 65065 >> GeschÃ¤ftsfÃ¼hrer: Christian Denker und Dr. Marcus Denker >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

July 21, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Method Finder?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On Jul 21, 2009, at 3:21 PM, Marcus Denker wrote: > > On 20.07.2009, at 22:48, Carlos Crosetti wrote: > >> Why is Method Finder delivered when Method Search is doing better? > > Method finder has one cool feature: search by example. You can put in > 3. 4. 7 > > and it tells you which methods to call to get 3 <something> 4 = 7. > > But on the negative side, it does duplicate functionality and it > references > *a lot* of symbols (as it has tables of methods to call). I will clean that by using pragmas but no time so far. Stef > > Marcus > > -- > Marcus Denker -- marcus(a)2denker.de > http://www.2denker.de > > 2denker UG (haftungsbeschrÃ¤nkt) > Sitz KÃ¶ln > Amtsgericht - Registergericht - KÃ¶ln, HRB 65065 > GeschÃ¤ftsfÃ¼hrer: Christian Denker und Dr. Marcus Denker > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

July 21, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Who are you?

by David Mitchell

Using Pharo for internal web development at work. Mostly departmental reporting stuff inside a Fortune 500 company. On Mon, Jul 20, 2009 at 4:13 PM, Alexandre Bergel<alexandre(a)bergel.eu> wrote: > Dear all, > > 284 people are subscribed to this mailing list. It is a bit hard to > deduce how many users of Pharo there are, but the number of > subscriptions gives a number at least. > How many companies are using Pharo? Without thinking too much, I know > there are Netstyle.ch and Pinesoft. Are there more? > > I am preparing an academic presentation and having such figure will be > great. > > Kind regards, > Alexandre > -- > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > Alexandre Bergel Â http://www.bergel.eu > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

July 21, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] GC limitations?

by Schwab,Wilhelm K

Miguel, I stumbled into PointerFinder and the menu commands (why both chase and explore?), so far without helpful results. It was late though, so I'll give it another try. Thanks! Bill -----Original Message----- From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Miguel Enrique CobÃ¡ Martinez Sent: Tuesday, July 21, 2009 12:34 AM To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] GC limitations? El mar, 21-07-2009 a las 01:13 -0400, Schwab,Wilhelm K escribiÃ³: > Hello all, > > I have a weird-looking bug that I am willing to assume is my doing and in my code. That said, some debugging lead me to a situation I really do not enjoy: objects that I think should be gc'd are happily living in my image. I _think_ I have gagged workspace variables (they truly are more trouble than they are worth). Dolphin sometimes has "zombie" views that can lurk in a broken/invisible state but still hold onto other objects. Is there anything like that here? I know about the various #become: tricks, and do not like to resort to them; I would like to understand what is holding onto the would-be garbage. > > Can the Squeak/Pharo gc collect objects with cyclic references? Is there anything else comes to mind when hunting for objects that just won't go away? > > Bill Use the pointer finder, either from a debug window where you can see a variable that you think should not exist, search the context menu for "Chase pointers" or "explore pointers" or directly by using PointerFinder. From the class comment: I can search for reasons why a certain object isn't garbage collected. I'm a quick port of a VisualWorks program written by Hans-Martin Mosner. Call me as shown below. I'll search for a path from a global variable to the given object, presenting it in a small morphic UI. Examples: PointerFinder on: self currentHand PointerFinder on: StandardSystemView someInstance Now, let's see why this image contains more HandMorphs as expected... HandMorph allInstancesDo: [:e | PointerFinder on: e] Miguel CobÃ¡ > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

July 21, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Method Finder?

by Adrian Lienhard

I wonder whether this is only useful as a cool demo or if people actually use it (and find what they are looking for)? I never do. Adrian On Jul 21, 2009, at 15:21 , Marcus Denker wrote: > > On 20.07.2009, at 22:48, Carlos Crosetti wrote: > >> Why is Method Finder delivered when Method Search is doing better? > > Method finder has one cool feature: search by example. You can put in > 3. 4. 7 > > and it tells you which methods to call to get 3 <something> 4 = 7. > > But on the negative side, it does duplicate functionality and it > references > *a lot* of symbols (as it has tables of methods to call). > > Marcus > > -- > Marcus Denker -- marcus(a)2denker.de > http://www.2denker.de > > 2denker UG (haftungsbeschrÃ¤nkt) > Sitz KÃ¶ln > Amtsgericht - Registergericht - KÃ¶ln, HRB 65065 > GeschÃ¤ftsfÃ¼hrer: Christian Denker und Dr. Marcus Denker > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

July 21, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Method Finder?

by Marcus Denker

On 20.07.2009, at 22:48, Carlos Crosetti wrote: > Why is Method Finder delivered when Method Search is doing better? Method finder has one cool feature: search by example. You can put in 3. 4. 7 and it tells you which methods to call to get 3 <something> 4 = 7. But on the negative side, it does duplicate functionality and it references *a lot* of symbols (as it has tables of methods to call). Marcus -- Marcus Denker -- marcus(a)2denker.de http://www.2denker.de 2denker UG (haftungsbeschrÃ¤nkt) Sitz KÃ¶ln Amtsgericht - Registergericht - KÃ¶ln, HRB 65065 GeschÃ¤ftsfÃ¼hrer: Christian Denker und Dr. Marcus Denker

July 21, 2009