July 2009 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] about fixing some primitives

by John M McIntosh

I've not yet a built a VM with these changes, let me do that next week once I"m back from Europe On 20-Jul-09, at 11:22 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > John > do you know if the primitives mentioned by nicolas are integrated in > the mac VM. > David Lewis integrated them apparently in VMmaker > http://bugs.squeak.org/view.php?id=7368 > http://bugs.squeak.org/view.php?id=7260 > > Stef > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project -- = = = ======================================================================== John M. McIntosh <johnmci(a)smalltalkconsulting.com> Twitter: squeaker68882 Corporate Smalltalk Consulting Ltd. http://www.smalltalkconsulting.com = = = ========================================================================

July 22, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Who are you?

by Johan Brichau

Hi Alex, We're a company in the making that will use pharo and seaside for a confirmed software project. I can provide more info in a month or so (names and all that... :-) On 20 Jul 2009, at 23:13, Alexandre Bergel wrote: > Dear all, > > 284 people are subscribed to this mailing list. It is a bit hard to > deduce how many users of Pharo there are, but the number of > subscriptions gives a number at least. > How many companies are using Pharo? Without thinking too much, I know > there are Netstyle.ch and Pinesoft. Are there more? > > I am preparing an academic presentation and having such figure will be > great. > > Kind regards, > Alexandre > -- > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project ---------------------------- Johan Brichau johan.brichau(a)uclouvain.be

July 22, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Show stopper network bug on Windows

by Damien Cassou

On Wed, Jul 22, 2009 at 12:53 AM, Igor Stasenko<siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Guys, see my comment on that issue.: > #localHostName should not be used before #initializeNetwork. #initializeNetwork doesn't prevent the bug from happening. -- Damien Cassou http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them popular by not having them." James Iry

July 22, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Persist a morph in a message.

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

I would loved to have the time to do that but no :) Stef On Jul 22, 2009, at 1:53 AM, Cameron Sanders wrote: > Perhaps Stef is "moonlighting" under an alias... ? (He replied to > himself for cover.) > > -cam > > On Jul 21, 2009, at 5:16 PM, Igor Stasenko wrote: > >> 2009/7/21 nullPointer <epicfan(a)gmail.com>: >>> >>>> Just a guess: maybe it is better to persist a morph(s) as is - as >>>> original objects - just keep them somewhere in classvars. >>>> Then to create a new view of it, just do a #deepCopy. >>> >>> Perhaps could be a combined solution. Persist the morph in a >>> method, but >>> only load one time, if class var is nothing. Then in the next times >>> send >>> #deepCopy to prototype morph . That could be a solution for the >>> velocity :) >>> I believe than EasyMorphicGUI works of that way too. >>> >>> Regards. >> >> Any reasons to stay anonymous? Hey, we don't/can't harm you in any >> way :) >> Instead, i think that it would be not only me, who could say, that we >> would really like to help you with that. >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

July 22, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Why Pharo?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Yes. Now it never run on mac so.... And ESUG was ready to participate to the bounty to get it opensource but the point was better dead than opensource so... we will see what we can do without being payed and been a true opensource software. Stef On Jul 21, 2009, at 9:06 PM, Travis Kay wrote: > Being a Dolphin Pro user myself, I have to agree with Esteban and > Bill on > all accounts. > > Travis Kay > > -----Original Message----- > From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of > Schwab,Wilhelm K > Sent: Tuesday, July 21, 2009 9:18 AM > To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Why Pharo? > > +100000000000000 to Esteban's comments on the Dolphin IDE - it's > slick in > ways that are not visually obvious. Some of it comes from speed, > some from > use of the good from GUI conventions, and the rest from good IDE > design. > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of > Esteban A. > Maringolo > Sent: Tuesday, July 21, 2009 10:59 AM > To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > Subject: [Pharo-project] Why Pharo? > > Hello, > > Mariano's post spurred me to write my reasons of "why to use it", so I > started this post. > >>> After many hesitations (I was reluctant to use Squeak) I decided to >>> use Pharo for it and not Dolphin (my favorite Smalltalk), because of >>> several reasons. >> would be nice to know them hehe >> sorry...in another thread. > > - It's mainly about getting mainstream, and not willing to develop > everything from scratch once and again. > > - At work we've developed everything by our own on VSE/Dolphin, so > every > time we wanted to do something, we had to build it by ourselves > (most of > it). We even had a Magritte like framework (years before Magritte > existed), > persistence, reporting, etc. Now some of them, are very mature > frameworks. > But I can't borrow any of them for personal use ;-) and don't want > to spend > a year rewriting the frameworks I've created, contributed to or used > at > work. > > - Because what I want to build is going to be web based (and I hope > to get > it mobile to), anything that runs on linux is good to be considered > as a > server solution. > > - So I wanted a rich class library/frameworks, in order to be able > to focus > on the business logic I want to build. > > - I wanted to have the latest versions of such frameworks, even when > it's > getting easier to port them (I did port Swazoo and Seaside in the > past), I'm > not in the mood to do it now (yes, I'm getting lazy). > > - Because Dolphin future is uncertain yet, DNG seems to be the > next-generation VM/Smalltalk, but I can't wait until it's ready, the > conditions clear ($$$) and have the above mentioned points included. > > - Because I like where Pharo is going to, or seems to be going. I > like its > mission and how its being managed (releases, issues, > patches,tests). It's a > solid foundation for any reliable project. > > - Because nothing really new has come from other really good > smalltalks like > VAST/Dolphin/VW, everything is getting ported, and eventually a > contribution > gets back to the source. I see GLASS as an "extension" of Pharo/ > Squeak, > because it was made very compatible, and the edges in contact work > very > close to each other (GLASS is useless if outdated in relation with > Pharo/Squeak). > > - Because after all, Pharo is also Smalltalk. And I rather choose it > before > going to other also good stuff (like Rails), or not so good as > PHP/Java/DotNet) > > - I want to focus on the business I'm trying to solve, and forget > about > everything mentioned above. > > The only thing that keeps me remembering the stuff above, is I'm > still not > comfortable as I am with Dolphin, not just because of habit. > Dolphin's IDE is really neat, quick, consistent, gets the stuff done > and > then gets out of your way. > You have to use it and do some real work to understand what I'm > talking > about. > But I'm pretty confident Pharo will achieve such level of maturity > in the > not so far future. > > I hope it clears my reasoning behind choosing Pharo. > > > Best regards, > > > -- > Esteban > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

July 22, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] [ANN] Algernon now available in Pharo

by Igor Stasenko

My main source of dissatisfaction with Algernon is the memory footprint. But one i had tried, was maybe a half-year ago .. does that changed somehow? 2009/7/22 Adrian Lienhard <adi(a)netstyle.ch>: > Algernon looks promising. > > Here some feedback > - Category actions are only fileOut and printOut, which I never use, > so all those category entries are useless to me > - "Press right arrow to drill into a class or category" does not work > (right arrow makes the list go away but nothing else is shown) > - how do I search for a method? Entering a selector does not show any > result. > - is there a way to search for senders, implementors, and class > references? > - I would show the result of expressions evaluated with = not in the > transcript but in the Algernon panel (often I don't have a transcript > open and then I can just as easily open a workspace doing the same > there). A history of previous expressions could be helpful too. > > HTH, > Adrian > > On Jul 18, 2009, at 20:59 , Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > >> On Fri, Jul 17, 2009 at 6:52 PM, Damien Cassou <damien.cassou(a)gmail.com >> >wrote: >> >>> 2009/7/15 Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck(a)gmail.com>: >>>> 9999 x 10^ 9999 to be in Pharo >>> >>> Could other people give their opinion too? >> >> >> Yes please. Give it a try. It very simple to install and very very >> very >> useful. >> >> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Damien Cassou >>> http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st >>> >>> "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them >>> popular by not having them." James Iry >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pharo-project mailing list >>> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

July 22, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] [ANN] Algernon now available in Pharo

by Adrian Lienhard

Algernon looks promising. Here some feedback - Category actions are only fileOut and printOut, which I never use, so all those category entries are useless to me - "Press right arrow to drill into a class or category" does not work (right arrow makes the list go away but nothing else is shown) - how do I search for a method? Entering a selector does not show any result. - is there a way to search for senders, implementors, and class references? - I would show the result of expressions evaluated with = not in the transcript but in the Algernon panel (often I don't have a transcript open and then I can just as easily open a workspace doing the same there). A history of previous expressions could be helpful too. HTH, Adrian On Jul 18, 2009, at 20:59 , Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > On Fri, Jul 17, 2009 at 6:52 PM, Damien Cassou <damien.cassou(a)gmail.com > >wrote: > >> 2009/7/15 Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck(a)gmail.com>: >>> 9999 x 10^ 9999 to be in Pharo >> >> Could other people give their opinion too? > > > Yes please. Give it a try. It very simple to install and very very > very > useful. > > >> >> >> -- >> Damien Cassou >> http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st >> >> "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them >> popular by not having them." James Iry >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

July 22, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Broken link

by Damien Cassou

On Tue, Jul 21, 2009 at 11:15 PM, Norbert Hartl<norbert(a)hartl.name> wrote: > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/wiki/Downloads?tm=2 > > does not work. It points to > > http://pharo-project.org/download > > but seems it should point to > > http://pharo-project.org/pharo-download Done. Thank you for the report -- Damien Cassou http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them popular by not having them." James Iry

July 22, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Copying image+changes between Windows and Linux

by Igor Stasenko

2009/7/22 Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu>: > Hello all, > > Are any of you using both Linux and Windows? Â Is it just me, or does button swapping get weird when bouncing between the two? Â I'm not sure if the behavior is random, or if there is a pattern to it. Â So far, it just seems to work as I expect sometimes, and not others, and I _think_ changing OS is a trigger for it. > Yes. See squeak.ini file in windoze co-located with your squeak.exe. Put: 3ButtonMouse = 1 there and it will make your image behave same as on linux. Personally, i think that option for swapping the buttons at VM side is redundant and only adds confusion. Because same thing can be done at image level. > Bill > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

July 22, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Show stopper network bug on Windows

by Igor Stasenko

2009/7/22 Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu>: > Sig, > > Queue veryLoudHeadSlap.wav - however, that is not a fix for it on Linux. Â Also, on Windows, I am not getting the fully qualified name, which is another problem. Â It also helps make the case for formalized session management, as the image should know when it has had its first cup of coffee (the vm can inform it). > Usually, all code , working with sockets , sending #initializeNetwork, to be sure it is initialized: Socket>>newTCP: family "Create a socket and initialise it for TCP" self initializeNetwork. ^[ super new initialize: TCPSocketType family: family ] repeatWithGCIf: [ :socket | socket isValid not ] --------- Socket>>initializeNetwork "Initialize the network drivers and the NetNameResolver. Do nothing if the network is already initialized." "Note: The network must be re-initialized every time Squeak starts up, so applications that persist across snapshots should be prepared to re-initialize the network as needed. Such applications should call 'Socket initializeNetwork' before every network transaction. " NetNameResolver initializeNetwork ---------- another way could be just add the #startUp method and initialize network there. But i think that current solution is more elegant, because if your image never using the network, it will never initialize the plugin and in this way, preserve some resources. And , of course , there could be the cases, where VMs built without network support, or running with disabled networking security setting (for sandboxing). In these cases this primitive (as well as rest of socket prims) will fail. As for retreiving a fully qualified name - can't give you answer right now. I think it can be answered by Andreas, who added the ipv6 support recently to Windoze VM platform code. > Bill > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Igor Stasenko > Sent: Tuesday, July 21, 2009 6:53 PM > To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Show stopper network bug on Windows > > Guys, see my comment on that issue.: > #localHostName should not be used before #initializeNetwork. > > Hope it helps. > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

July 22, 2009