May 2009 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

[Pharo-project] [ANN] Register and contribute to ESUG Conference 2009

by Noury Bouraqadi

Dear Smalltalk enthusiastics, The registration to 17th edition of the ESUG Conference. So, you can already register and benefit from the early bird fees. Note that if your company is a gold or platinum sponsor, you have a discount (10% or 20%). More online: http://www.esug.org/Conferences/2009/Conference+Registration The ESUG yearly event is the premier forum for meeting other Smalltalk practitioners from both industry and academia. You can contribute to the event by giving a talk during the developers sessions, presenting a research paper during the workshop or demoing your software during the Innovation Technology Awards. Developers can meet and contribute to free software projects during a camp. Remember that by attending ESUG event, you support ESUG (a non-profit organization) and its actions for promoting Smalltalk. See you in Brest, Noury ESUG treasurer http://vst.ensm-douai.fr/noury/ -------------- -ESUG 17th International Smalltalk Conference - Brest, France, August 31 - September 4, 2009 http://www.esug.org/Conferences/2009 -17Ã¨mes JournÃ©es Francophones sur les SystÃ¨mes Multi-Agents (JFSMAâ09). Lyon, 21-23 Octobre 2009 http://bat710.univ-lyon1.fr/~sycosma/JFSMA09/

May 15, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] [ANN] OCompletion improves the accuracy of eCompletion

by Damien Cassou

2009/5/14 Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck(a)gmail.com>: > In my opinion this could be in the Pharo dev image by default. Let me think... ok :-D -- Damien Cassou http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them popular by not having them." James Iry

May 15, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Iso-Collections ....

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Hi guido This is good to have people with kicking ass arguments. Thanks for that. Now pay attention that you do not fall only in this category because after a while this will get the inverse effect to what you want to achieve. Because I imagine that you want us to be much better and we will try hard. > Hi! > > Frank sais: > > "Traditionally Smalltalk has one Object-Memory which is > garbage-collected. This introduces overhead and complicates things in > multihreading programs. LSWVST introduces multiple Object-Spaces, in > which garbage collection can be controlled by the programmer. Every > thread has its own Standard-Object-Memory avoiding synchronisation > problems. This is a nice idea. We got somebody here working on similar ideas. > Traditionally in Smalltalk every object is boxed. An object is a > pointer > which has a reference to the class. This is necessary to dynamically > lookup the method during resolving a message-send. This makes programs > which operate on huge data-collections of the same type rather > inefficient. I have problem with this statement since on VW with a jit I imagine that lot of the lookup gets cached already. > LSWVST introduces a new object-type - IsoCollections. Iso-Collections > stores type information of its elements only once." Can I get LSWVST running on my machine a mac? Now I imgaine that if I could I should not look at the code for license reasons. I like the idea of DNG because I was sad to see Dolphin disappear. Now it does not work on my machine since now more than 10 years. > > > Hmmm, opening a simple Array of 1.000.000 elements consumes 4 > megabytes > in Pharo ... I have a question: why don't you use LSWVST? I would have used Dolphin long time ago if I could have. Now we will build something open and free for the community. And communities are important else Smalltalk would be just a nice idea in the museum. Stef > > > regards, Guido Stepken > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

May 15, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] [ANN] OCompletion improves the accuracy of eCompletion

by Damien Cassou

2009/5/15 Romain Robbes <romain.robbes(a)lu.unisi.ch>: > Could you describe the symptoms more precisely? I was especially careful so > that the completion should be actually faster > than the default one (ECompletion looks at all the symbols in the image, > whereas OCompletion looks in a much more > restricted set of symbols), so I'm especially surprised of this. > Have you installed other packages in the same image that could cause this? Since he uses pharo-dev, I guess Hernan has eCompletion too on his image. Is that a problem? -- Damien Cassou http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st "Lambdas are relegated to relative obscurity until Java makes them popular by not having them." James Iry

May 15, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Couldn't find an icon so...

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On May 14, 2009, at 10:58 PM, Schwab,Wilhelm K wrote: > Cool!!!! > > Stef, please note that Pharo has gotten good enough that we are > starting to sweat over this type of minutia. Many thanks! :) What would be great is that we get some free fonts to improve the default look. But I have no time for that. > > > Bill > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr > ] On Behalf Of StÃ©phane Ducasse > Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 3:03 PM > To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Couldn't find an icon so... > > Ok > I asked samuel for the logos and icons and I will put them public. > > Stef > > On May 14, 2009, at 9:31 PM, Henrik Sperre Johansen wrote: > >> There's no problem with the logos (well, with the possible exception >> that the pdf containing an svg version was somewhat hard to find, >> maybe it could be hosted on the website instead of trawling through >> mail archives and finding a link that still works?), he was talking >> about an icon. >> >> Cheers, >> Henry >> >> On 14.05.2009 21:10, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: >>> >>> what is the problem with the logos? >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

May 15, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Couldn't find an icon so...

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Sure! Stef On May 14, 2009, at 10:55 PM, Schwab,Wilhelm K wrote: > Stef, > > I am motivated, perhaps not as (yet) empowered/capable as I would > like. However, I am open to taking a stab at it. If I find I can > get traction, I would be happy to put time on it. > > I suspect much of my ability to contribute will come as a side > effect of "moving in" to Pharo. If it meets my needs (which I > sincerely hope will be the case), then there are many tools that I > built over the years that have core fuctionality that can be made > open. As-is, you would not want them, but with some refactoring, > they could serve many purposes, and I would have no problem > releasing the results for others to use. > > As Pharo improves and my projects evolve (one that should seed this > has been stuck for months now, but should open up shortly), I hope > to show you what I mean. > > Bill > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr > ] On Behalf Of StÃ©phane Ducasse > Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 2:10 PM > To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Couldn't find an icon so... > > > On May 14, 2009, at 1:53 PM, Schwab,Wilhelm K wrote: > >> Hello all, >> >> Sorry to have dropped out for a whlie - nothing against Pharo. I am >> hopefully getting ready to ramp up some "real" work on Pharo, and >> toward that end, have a couple of questions. The first is a trivial >> concern that I have partially addressed with the attached icons. >> All I did was take the logo and chop off the lighthouse itself. So >> far it has been useless to me, but perhaps you will do better with >> it. > > what is the problem with the logos? > >> The next question is more aggressive. Having free use of underscores >> would be a huge help to me. There are external libraries that are >> littered with them, and relational databases for which the most >> natural (leaving aesthetics out of it - this is about simplicity). >> Is >> Gwenael's work to a point that it would be reasonable to hack it into >> my own image? > > I'm not sure anymore that gwenael finished that supports. > >> I probably don't want to take the chance, but might consider it >> depending on how close the code is to be reading. I have to at least >> ask the question. > > Sure. So far I do not know. > I imagine that if you really want this to happen so you propose some > code. > As you see in the bugTracker we put _ in selector for 1.1 > > >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> Bill >> >> >> <pharo.ico><pharo.png>_______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

May 15, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Missing info in the change log

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On May 15, 2009, at 12:04 AM, Hernan Wilkinson wrote: > Hi, > we realized (after pharo crash) that there are some code changes > that are not save to the changes file. Most of the are related to > dynamically defining the "change". Yes some are missing and the class definition in cs would be really welcomed because doit for classdef is annoying. Now when you see the state of the fileout code you want to run away. One of these days we will have to fix that. > For example: > 1) when saving a method that references a non created class and > after creating the class selecting "Define new class" strange > 2) when saving a method that references a non declared instance > variable and selecting "declare instance" > 3) categorizing methods using drag and drop that strange because I imagine that normally catgeory changes are captures and are funnel to a category and that this raises the systemchangeNotifier. So may be the browser short cuts some of the call > > I could not find a reported bug on this issues... does anybody know > if they are reported? I remember that there is one issue but if you can complete it with precise information this will help fixing it. Stef > > Thanks > Hernan. > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

May 15, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] [ANN] OCompletion improves the accuracy of eCompletion

by Romain Robbes

Hernan, Could you describe the symptoms more precisely? I was especially careful so that the completion should be actually faster than the default one (ECompletion looks at all the symbols in the image, whereas OCompletion looks in a much more restricted set of symbols), so I'm especially surprised of this. Have you installed other packages in the same image that could cause this? Cheers, Romain On May 14, 2009, at 11:37 PM, Hernan Wilkinson wrote: > I tried for two hours and I had to uninstall it because everything > got really slow... I tried on the latests a pharo-dev image > > On Thu, May 14, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Ramon Leon > <ramon.leon(a)allresnet.com> wrote: > Just wanted to say, I've been using it for the past couple of days and > really like it; seems pretty accurate. > > Ramon Leon > http://onsmalltalk.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > <ATT00001.txt> -- Romain Robbes http://www.inf.unisi.ch/phd/robbes

May 15, 2009

[Pharo-project] Underscores: clarifiation/thanks

by Schwab,Wilhelm K

Stef, I was thinking a little more about our correspondence earlier today and recalled something that appears to be correct. Stef wrote: "Sure. So far I do not know. I imagine that if you really want this to happen so you propose some code. As you see in the bugTracker we put _ in selector for 1.1" So that puts a partial solution plan in place for 1.1 instead of 2.0 as the original AST integrtion, which is real progress from my perspective. I see it!! There has been a long-standing patch that allows _ in selectors in any but the first position of a selector. Even that would be a help, it would be better still to allow them in all locations and of course in class names too. However, I will take what I can get, and am thrilled to see it on the agenda in any way prior to 2.0. I will help if I can, but doubt I am enough of a parser expert to be of real help, because it needs to be done solidly. It might also be that I can get the hack to work and start relying on it, knowing that I will stop being an rogue by 1.1. Thanks!!! Bill

May 15, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] accessors

by Igor Stasenko

Each time people thinking about the ways how to operate with concrete data, there are many ways in a languages which allow direct access to state. Some of them are more safe, some is not. I personally think that choosing accessors/direct ivar access is up to developer , or choose a stateless (pure functional) language which disregarding such problems completely. 2009/5/14 Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu>: > Hello all, > > private accessors, different category - +10.Â Howoever, I will take this > opportunity to re-re-express (sorry) my sincere hope for methods to have > multiple categories.Â Â Then they become useful tags and can flag all kinds > of things.Â Very useful. > > Bill > > ________________________________ > From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Steve > Wirts > Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 12:13 PM > To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] accessors > > perhaps private accessors could go into a different category? > > On Thu, May 14, 2009 at 1:10 PM, Cameron Sanders > <camsanders01(a)roadrunner.com> wrote: >> >> That is not always the best policy. If you provide public accessors >> for your private model elements (representation), the next thing you >> know people start using them! And then your model interfaces is >> constrained. >> >> ? or am i just talking trash ? >> >> >> On May 14, 2009, at 12:55 PM, Steve Wirts wrote: >> >> > Hi Folks, >> > >> > Would it be inappropriate to request that an effort be made at some >> > point to try to provide accessors for all instance/class instance >> > variables, and try to Â get rid of inappropriate direct variable >> > accessing where possible? >> > >> > The "chasing variables" function is handy but seems more cumbersome >> > than just putting a halt in a setter. >> > >> > I know this would be a lot of work but maybe it could be automated. >> > >> > Just tell me to shut up and go away if I'm being a nuisance. >> >> Oh, and please stick around... to draw attention away from my pesky >> questions. >> >> > >> > >> > Steve :) >> >> >> -cam >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

May 14, 2009