March 2009 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Preference refactoring again

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On Mar 2, 2009, at 4:44 AM, Geert wrote: > > Hi Alain, this sounds very interesting. I have never been a big fan > of the > current "Preference Browser". I am now trying to grasp (still > learning > here) how this new "Pharo Preference Mechanism" works. It would be > great if > the mechanism could be explained in detail in something like the new > Pharo > By Example manual :) this is a great idea. if it is adopted I will write it. > > Alain Plantec wrote: >> >> I've joined 4 packages : >> - PrefCore contains PreferenceValue which is now the only mandatory >> class. >> >> 2 packages for testing: >> - PrefProvider contains PrefProvider class which declares some >> preferences >> - PrefUser contains PrefChangeListener (try PrefChangeListener test). >> >> 1 package for UI: >> - PrefTool contains PreferenceCollector and PreferenceDefinition. >> They >> are optional. >> > > -- > View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/Preference-refactoring-again-tp2403814p2407403.html > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

March 2, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Dynamic dead code alpha version

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

>>> I continued to code a little tool based on code of Alain to detect >>> deadcode, so far I'm too sick to have clear >>> idea why it freezes on Morph. >> >> This kinda reminds me of that moment in the horror film when you >> want to >> yell "Don't go in there!" at the characters on the screen. > > lol > > Except that you should do it from within the film itself and sit down > watching ourselves. > :) May be I should use reflectivity or byesurgeon for that. But I'm curious to see until where we can go expecially since the dnu method and automatic recompilation is in place before transforming the methods. Something else which is striking is that it is easier to redo a root hierarchy than doing a root morph ProtoObject subclass then.... doesNotUnderstand: aMessage | sel category | sel := aMessage selector. Transcript show: 'Does not understand ', aMessage selector printString ; cr. category := (Morph organization categoryOfElement: sel). self class compile: (Morph sourceCodeAt: sel) classified: category. ^ aMessage sentTo: self. works for Object but not for Morph. Stef

March 2, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] SortedCollection>>median

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

This reminds me some thoughts about time and date. Originally date and time were ok but not so great. Then one guy (brent) fixed it and people were happy and it was introduced in the base system. At that time when time was introduced (in 3.7 I guess) it was a obvious choice. Then chronos and aconcagua went out showing some other properties. Now retrospectively I think that it would be better to have a minimal version in the system and loadable external package. There are some exceptions to this strategy: announcements and regexp (where this is more a language decision), but in general this is a good strategy So we could rename median naiveMedian and have a package that does all the rest and that people can load it. Stef

March 2, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] SortedCollection>>median

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On Mar 2, 2009, at 1:34 AM, Rob Rothwell wrote: > I notice that the current median is: > > median > "Return the middle element, or as close as we can get." > > ^ self at: self size + 1 // 2 > > Any reason not to make that accurate and return the average of the > middle two values for collections containing an even number of items? > > Or...better yet...should statistics functions be removed and placed > into another package with other useful items like mode, range, > standardDeviation, etc...? I think that it would be good. A nice package with a nice documentation and associated tests. Stef

March 2, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] MIMEdatabase fix?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

excellent! I'm happy. >>> With my changes to Pharo (which of course first need to be >>> integrated), >> >> I will integrate them this evening. > > A quick test with loading the following packages into both the latest > Pharo and a Squeak 3.9.1 image seemed to work :-) > > from http://www.squeaksource.com/KomHttpServer > DynamicBindings-gc.7 > NamedProcess-RJT.2 > KomServices-gc.19 > > from http://squeaksource.com/PharoInbox > KomHttpServer-michael_rueger.45 > > from http://squeaksource.com/Seaside > Seaside2.8a1-pmm.583 > > Michael > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

March 2, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Dynamic dead code alpha version

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

>> I continued to code a little tool based on code of Alain to detect >> deadcode, so far I'm too sick to have clear >> idea why it freezes on Morph. > > This kinda reminds me of that moment in the horror film when you > want to > yell "Don't go in there!" at the characters on the screen. lol Except that you should do it from within the film itself and sit down watching ourselves. :) Stef

March 2, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] Dynamic dead code alpha version

by Colin Putney

StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > Hi > > I continued to code a little tool based on code of Alain to detect > deadcode, so far I'm too sick to have clear > idea why it freezes on Morph. This kinda reminds me of that moment in the horror film when you want to yell "Don't go in there!" at the characters on the screen. Colin

March 2, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] {Spam?} Re: A point a.k.a excuse to you

by Schwab,Wilhelm K

Matthew, By the right thing too soon, I think there are influential people who are not yet ready to allow Squeak to change. I do not necessarily agree that Stef et al. have rekindled interest in Smalltalk so much as they have given many new hope for Squeak to realize its potential to be a clean fast and robust open source Smalltalk. Bill -----Original Message----- From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Matthew Fulmer Sent: Sunday, March 01, 2009 11:12 PM To: pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: {Spam?} Re: [Pharo-project] A point a.k.a excuse to you On Sun, Mar 01, 2009 at 08:47:53PM -0500, Schwab,Wilhelm K wrote: > My sense is that Matthew is doing the right thing, with the best of intentions, but might be trying it too soon. I would appreciate it if you would expand on that. > Pharo is establishing a spirit of finding the common problem and solving it such that we can all have what we want. I believe you are correct, but not everybody sees Pharo that way. Edgar and Keith in particular, sometimes see it as non-appreciation of their work, which is similar in spirit, but not as well managed. Others have more vague objections I don't yet understand. > As Gandhi put it, "First they ignore you, then they ridicule > you, then they fight you, then you win." Some of those > pressuring you have probably just moved on from ridicule. Let me apologize on behalf of the squeak-dev community. Not all of us feel so harshly toward you, but I did not speak up enough to convince you of our appreciation. You deserve better, and I'm sorry we did not deliver it. > Making Pharo the best it can be will be a win for everyone, even if some do not see it that way at the time. I plan to work with Pharo soon, probably once summer starts and school is out, to get Keith's tools debugged and working in the context of Pharo, especially Monticello 1.6 (My patches to MC1.5 to enable real atomic loading (= no more problems upgrading Polymorph), and Bob (the automated image builder and regression tester). I know this is deep stuff, but I believe an automated image builder will have several advantages, both for you, as Pharo developers, and for me, as an enthusiast for cross-squeak compatibility: - making releases is faster - Regression bugs are caught faster - the scripts serve as poor-man's code sharing between squeak distributions until we have real package-level sharing of core code between core You may or may not know, but I am a core Cobalt developer, and I hope to bring Pharo and Cobalt much closer together. These two projects are hosting many core changes to the image, with little regard to backward compatibility. We may even get tweak to the level where it is a compelling replacement for Morphic, and I want Pharo to benefit from that if it does indeed happen. Too many improvements to Squeak happen in the dark (Newspeak, Spoon), and we can ill afford to estrange the truly open projects from each other (Pharo and Cobalt, IMO). > Thanks for doing this! Yes, thank you Stef and Marcus for rekindling the passion for Smalltalk in many people. With luck, squeak.org may be a free, open, and useful product again. Too long has it been stuck, with nobody to bring it forward. Pharo has done much to re-awaken the love of smalltalk in many people, and that, if nothing else, is a gift beyond measure. As Squeak.org release team leader, you have my goodwill and my support. I will do what I can to spread the gifts of your efforts to the rest of squeak, and bring their efforts to you. -- Matthew Fulmer -- http://mtfulmer.wordpress.com/ _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

March 2, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] A point a.k.a excuse to you

by Matthew Fulmer

On Sun, Mar 01, 2009 at 11:12:23PM -0500, Matthew Fulmer wrote: > I know this is deep stuff, but I believe an automated image > builder will have several advantages, both for you, as Pharo > developers, and for me, as an enthusiast for cross-squeak > compatibility: > - making releases is faster > - Regression bugs are caught faster > - the scripts serve as poor-man's code sharing between squeak > distributions until we have real package-level sharing of core > code between core That should have been "sharing of core code between squeak distributions" -- Matthew Fulmer -- http://mtfulmer.wordpress.com/

March 2, 2009

Re: [Pharo-project] A point a.k.a excuse to you

by Matthew Fulmer

On Sun, Mar 01, 2009 at 08:47:53PM -0500, Schwab,Wilhelm K wrote: > My sense is that Matthew is doing the right thing, with the best of intentions, but might be trying it too soon. I would appreciate it if you would expand on that. > Pharo is establishing a spirit of finding the common problem and solving it such that we can all have what we want. I believe you are correct, but not everybody sees Pharo that way. Edgar and Keith in particular, sometimes see it as non-appreciation of their work, which is similar in spirit, but not as well managed. Others have more vague objections I don't yet understand. > As Gandhi put it, "First they ignore you, then they ridicule > you, then they fight you, then you win." Some of those > pressuring you have probably just moved on from ridicule. Let me apologize on behalf of the squeak-dev community. Not all of us feel so harshly toward you, but I did not speak up enough to convince you of our appreciation. You deserve better, and I'm sorry we did not deliver it. > Making Pharo the best it can be will be a win for everyone, even if some do not see it that way at the time. I plan to work with Pharo soon, probably once summer starts and school is out, to get Keith's tools debugged and working in the context of Pharo, especially Monticello 1.6 (My patches to MC1.5 to enable real atomic loading (= no more problems upgrading Polymorph), and Bob (the automated image builder and regression tester). I know this is deep stuff, but I believe an automated image builder will have several advantages, both for you, as Pharo developers, and for me, as an enthusiast for cross-squeak compatibility: - making releases is faster - Regression bugs are caught faster - the scripts serve as poor-man's code sharing between squeak distributions until we have real package-level sharing of core code between core You may or may not know, but I am a core Cobalt developer, and I hope to bring Pharo and Cobalt much closer together. These two projects are hosting many core changes to the image, with little regard to backward compatibility. We may even get tweak to the level where it is a compelling replacement for Morphic, and I want Pharo to benefit from that if it does indeed happen. Too many improvements to Squeak happen in the dark (Newspeak, Spoon), and we can ill afford to estrange the truly open projects from each other (Pharo and Cobalt, IMO). > Thanks for doing this! Yes, thank you Stef and Marcus for rekindling the passion for Smalltalk in many people. With luck, squeak.org may be a free, open, and useful product again. Too long has it been stuck, with nobody to bring it forward. Pharo has done much to re-awaken the love of smalltalk in many people, and that, if nothing else, is a gift beyond measure. As Squeak.org release team leader, you have my goodwill and my support. I will do what I can to spread the gifts of your efforts to the rest of squeak, and bring their efforts to you. -- Matthew Fulmer -- http://mtfulmer.wordpress.com/

March 2, 2009