September 2008 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: [Seaside-dev] preliminary Seaside 2.9 alphauniverse

by Damien Cassou

On Fri, Sep 26, 2008 at 6:50 PM, Ramon Leon <ramon.leon(a)allresnet.com> wrote: > My objection, the big ball of mud called Kernel-Extensions and the liberal > use of overrides, which I think are evil. I don't know about Kernel-Extensions but if I look at http://installer.pbwiki.com/311-KernelExtensions, I can see that Â«It should be safe to install on any 3.7 or later image, as it only adds methods.Â» If this sentence is wrong, you should contact Keith. > I like using packages that do > their best to only use extensions and don't just go around the system willy > nilly monkey patching everything. I don't trust packages with overrides not > to break my system and I absolutely don't like packages that once installed > can't be uninstalled, try removing Kernel-Extensions sometime. If you only install Kernel-Extensions, it should be safe and easy to uninstall. Now, if you install packages that depend on Kernel-Extensions, it is understandable that Kernel-Extensions becomes harder to remove :-). This is even more true, if MC1.5 depends on Kernel-Extensions (but I don't know). > Now, the code may work perfectly fine, and Keith's done a lot of work, but > it's just not community friendly code. A package should have a clear > responsibility, few dependencies, not too many extensions, no overrides if > at all possible, and must install and uninstall cleanly without hosing my > system. If it doesn't meet those criteria, I don't consider it safe to even > experiment with. -- Damien Cassou Peter von der AhÃ©: Â«I'm beginning to see why Gilad wished us good luckÂ». (http://blogs.sun.com/ahe/entry/override_snafu)

Sept. 27, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: [Seaside-dev] preliminary Seaside 2.9 alpha universe

by Damien Cassou

On Fri, Sep 26, 2008 at 6:33 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > can you post the code to load > Sake > Packages > MC1.6 http://installer.pbwiki.com/Packages: Installer install: '311-KernelExtensions'. Installer squeaksource project: 'Sake'; install: 'Sake'. Installer squeaksource project: 'Packages'; install: 'Sake-Packages'. And you will get Sake and Packages. Look at the class PackagesDevU which contains the description of all packages from the dev-universe (it seems it is the new name for PackagesSqueak310U). For MC1.6, I don't know because it does not seem to be released yet. Look at http://installer.pbwiki.com/Monticello16-Beta and ask Keith and Matthew if you are really interested. -- Damien Cassou Peter von der AhÃ©: Â«I'm beginning to see why Gilad wished us good luckÂ». (http://blogs.sun.com/ahe/entry/override_snafu)

Sept. 27, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: [Seaside-dev] preliminary Seaside 2.9 alpha universe

by Damien Cassou

On Fri, Sep 26, 2008 at 6:28 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > What is Packages? compared to Sake Keith, please correct me if I'm wrong: - Sake is a domain specific language with all required tools to define make-like rules. It allows people to describe tasks (as done in the Ant/Java world) and execute these tasks when necessary (http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/5953) - Packages uses Sake to reimplement a universe-like tool with dependencies. Then, it describes a lot of Squeak packages with their dependencies. > What is PackagesSqueak310U....? this is a class which has been generated automatically by a Sake task from the Dev Universe. This means that each change I do in the Universe system is reflected automatically in Sake just by running a task. Moreover, the fact that each package is describe in a method using only Smalltalk code makes creating new set of packages very easy. For Pharo, we could just subclass PackagesSqueak310U and override the methods we want to change. For Seaside, they could just provide yet another class... I think it's much easier than with Universes. Finally, the package descriptions are hosted on SqueakSource instead of one's particular server. -- Damien Cassou Peter von der AhÃ©: Â«I'm beginning to see why Gilad wished us good luckÂ». (http://blogs.sun.com/ahe/entry/override_snafu)

Sept. 27, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: [Seaside-dev] preliminary Seaside 2.9 alpha universe

by Damien Cassou

On Fri, Sep 26, 2008 at 6:25 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > On Sep 26, 2008, at 5:03 PM, Damien Cassou wrote: > Did you check what LFP is doing? > I would like to know that. > Because the point is not that it would not be working but what are the stuff > it brings in. http://installer.pbwiki.org/LevelPlayingField LPF is a script which installs Monticello 1.5 and Installer in your image. The aim here is to get an equivalent playing field in all images. This script allowed me to install Universes, OmniBrowser and Shout in a Croquet image in a few minutes. For Pharo, we could have a look at what the script does exactly and integrate the interesting fixes. -- Damien Cassou Peter von der AhÃ©: Â«I'm beginning to see why Gilad wished us good luckÂ». (http://blogs.sun.com/ahe/entry/override_snafu)

Sept. 27, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Regression testing results within package manifesto

by Alexandre Bergel

The idea is nice. But how will you ensure that your meta-data are well synchronized with your code? Cheers, Alexandre On 27 Sep 2008, at 09:40, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > Hi guys > > For Moose we started to add package manifesto using DrDoc. > We will use the manifesto to document our package with license, > documentation, class diagram... > Now what I would really like to have is the results of SmallLint > rules and the tests > because when I run the tests if some of them were broken I do not > know whether I made progress or not. > > I think that the manifesto could be a nice place to keep such > information. > After we could have a simple manisfesto dropping script > Object allSubclasses do: .... > > what do you think about that, I would like to have a bit more self > documentation and software engineering > meta data within the system. > > Stef > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > -- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

Sept. 27, 2008

[Pharo-project] Regression testing results within package manifesto

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Hi guys For Moose we started to add package manifesto using DrDoc. We will use the manifesto to document our package with license, documentation, class diagram... Now what I would really like to have is the results of SmallLint rules and the tests because when I run the tests if some of them were broken I do not know whether I made progress or not. I think that the manifesto could be a nice place to keep such information. After we could have a simple manisfesto dropping script Object allSubclasses do: .... what do you think about that, I would like to have a bit more self documentation and software engineering meta data within the system. Stef

Sept. 27, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] About Flap

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

OK we will go slowly there. One of the problem is that flaps are taking also a cpu On Sep 27, 2008, at 12:27 AM, Gary Chambers wrote: > I quite like the tools flap, when configured for auto-popout and > with "solid" style... > Just my 2c > > Gary. > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Igor Stasenko" > <siguctua(a)gmail.com> > To: "An open mailing list to discuss any topics related to an open- > sourceSmalltalk" <pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> > Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 8:46 PM > Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] About Flap > > >> 2008/9/24 Marcus Denker <denker(a)iam.unibe.ch>: >>> >>> On 24.09.2008, at 20:14, Bill Schwab wrote: >>> >>>> Lukas, >>>> >>>> That's fine if my hands are on the keyboard, but if I have one on >>>> the >>>> mouse (common when browsing), then (in Dolphin at least), I end up >>>> either right clicking on a class in an open browser, or hitting a >>>> toolbar button. For the more obscure tools, the shell menus >>>> (Tools) do >>>> the trick. Shortcuts are great, but we should also provide mouse- >>>> based >>>> options. >>>> >>> >>> remember: there will be a menu, with a "tools" entry. And there will >>> always be the world-menu (click on the backround). >>> >>> the flap is not faster in the number of clicks than a pulldown >>> menu... >>> >> >> well, with flaps is more convenient because you can drag a tool >> window >> and place it where you want to. >> While from menu - first, it placing a window automatically, and then >> often you need to arrange it again. >> How about putting a window in hand, when you opening it from menu? >> I find it very convenient and useful feature - it gives you chance to >> arrange window with no extra clicks. >> >> >>> Marcus >>> >>> -- >>> Marcus Denker -- denker(a)iam.unibe.ch >>> http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~denker >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pharo-project mailing list >>> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Best regards, >> Igor Stasenko AKA sig. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Sept. 27, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] A .mcz of Pinesoft's accumulated fixes applicable to Pharo

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On Sep 26, 2008, at 10:07 PM, Simon Kirk wrote: > hi Stef. > > Hmm, strange. How are you viewing the diffs? If I browse the MCZ in > a Monticello browser I see extensions to these classes: > > BrowserCommentTextMorph > BrowserRequestor > CanvasCharacterScanner > Character > ConnectionQueue > GrafPort > MultiCanvasCharacterScanner > NaturalLanguageTranslator > Random > RemoteString > TranscriptStream > > Is this the diffs you're talking about? If so, I think they're > correct. It's possible my rough list below may have missed some > changes. I see the same but I cannot see the diff between the changes and what is in the image (for example in the merge tools I do not (changed) and the like. Stef > > > Cheers, > Simon > > On 26 Sep 2008, at 20:20, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > >> Simon >> >> with which machine did you create you mcz? >> Because apparently I can see the diffs for other packages. >> >> Can somebody else check the pinesoft package I put in the pharoInbox? >> >> Stef >> >> >> >>> Hi all. >>> >>> Gary and I decided we ought to give out an MCZ of our fixes that >>> we've put together over the last two years. >>> >>> Obviously some of those we found have been pulled into Pharo >>> already, but the attached MCZ represents those that we think are >>> still relevant :) >>> >>> This is a rough list of the fixes: >>> >>> 1. Fixed flaky borwser comment text area sometime not showing. >>> >>> 2. Added getArgumentPermutation to support RefactoringEngine. >>> >>> 3. Fixes to CanvasCharacterScanner and MultiCanvasCharacterScanner >>> to correctly align the first line of text when centered/justifed >>> etc. >>> >>> 4. Added more constant names to Character class. >>> >>> 5. Modified ConnectionQueue to not accept connections when queue >>> is full. >>> >>> 6. Changed GrafPort to answer a MultiDisplayScanner when >>> appropriate (allows subclasses of MultiNewParagraph). >>> >>> 7. NaturalLanguageTranslator startup postion move to after >>> PasteUpMorph since it will show a progress bar. >>> >>> 8. Fix to Random>>nextInt: to allow large numbers which would be >>> out of range if using Floats (as mentioned recently on dev, use of >>> Floats is dodgy anyway...) >>> >>> 9. Changed TranscriptStream>>clear to use a new buffer (was just >>> reset which could leave a massive collection). >>> >>> 10. Changed RemoteString to handle concurrent processes safely. >>> This one's particularly interesting: we were load-testing our >>> Seaside app here and getting lots of syntax errors when hitting >>> the image with around the 20 concurrent processes due to source >>> file access. After this change we were hitting it with >>> approximately 500 concurrent processes, and the failure was in the >>> Java load tester (it timed out). >>> >>> Hope just submitting a .mcz is OK! :) >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Simon and Gary >>> >>> >>> >>> ****************************************************************************************************************************************** >>> This email is from Pinesoft Limited. Its contents are confidential >>> to the intended recipient(s) at the email address(es) to which it >>> has been addressed. It may not be disclosed to or used by anyone >>> other than the addressee(s), nor may it be copied in anyway. If >>> received in error, please contact the sender, then delete it from >>> your system. Although this email and attachments are believed to >>> be free of virus, or any other defect which might affect any >>> computer or IT system into which they are received and opened, it >>> is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they are >>> virus free and no responsibility is accepted by Pinesoft for any >>> loss or damage arising in any way from receipt or use thereof. >>> ******************************************************************************************************************************************* >>> >>> >>> Pinesoft Limited are registered in England, Registered number: >>> 2914825. Registered office: 266-268 High Street, Waltham Cross, >>> Herts, EN8 7EA >>> <Pinesoft-Fixes-Misc-gvc.24.mcz> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pharo-project mailing list >>> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > > ****************************************************************************************************************************************** > This email is from Pinesoft Limited. Its contents are confidential > to the intended recipient(s) at the email address(es) to which it > has been addressed. It may not be disclosed to or used by anyone > other than the addressee(s), nor may it be copied in anyway. If > received in error, please contact the sender, then delete it from > your system. Although this email and attachments are believed to be > free of virus, or any other defect which might affect any computer > or IT system into which they are received and opened, it is the > responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they are virus free > and no responsibility is accepted by Pinesoft for any loss or damage > arising in any way from receipt or use thereof. > ******************************************************************************************************************************************* > > > Pinesoft Limited are registered in England, Registered number: > 2914825. Registered office: 266-268 High Street, Waltham Cross, > Herts, EN8 7EA > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Sept. 27, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] About Flap

by Gary Chambers

I quite like the tools flap, when configured for auto-popout and with "solid" style... Just my 2c Gary. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Igor Stasenko" <siguctua(a)gmail.com> To: "An open mailing list to discuss any topics related to an open-sourceSmalltalk" <pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 8:46 PM Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] About Flap > 2008/9/24 Marcus Denker <denker(a)iam.unibe.ch>: >> >> On 24.09.2008, at 20:14, Bill Schwab wrote: >> >>> Lukas, >>> >>> That's fine if my hands are on the keyboard, but if I have one on the >>> mouse (common when browsing), then (in Dolphin at least), I end up >>> either right clicking on a class in an open browser, or hitting a >>> toolbar button. For the more obscure tools, the shell menus (Tools) do >>> the trick. Shortcuts are great, but we should also provide mouse-based >>> options. >>> >> >> remember: there will be a menu, with a "tools" entry. And there will >> always be the world-menu (click on the backround). >> >> the flap is not faster in the number of clicks than a pulldown menu... >> > > well, with flaps is more convenient because you can drag a tool window > and place it where you want to. > While from menu - first, it placing a window automatically, and then > often you need to arrange it again. > How about putting a window in hand, when you opening it from menu? > I find it very convenient and useful feature - it gives you chance to > arrange window with no extra clicks. > > >> Marcus >> >> -- >> Marcus Denker -- denker(a)iam.unibe.ch >> http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~denker >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> > > > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko AKA sig. > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

Sept. 26, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] A .mcz of Pinesoft's accumulated fixes applicable to Pharo

by Simon Kirk

hi Stef. Hmm, strange. How are you viewing the diffs? If I browse the MCZ in a Monticello browser I see extensions to these classes: BrowserCommentTextMorph BrowserRequestor CanvasCharacterScanner Character ConnectionQueue GrafPort MultiCanvasCharacterScanner NaturalLanguageTranslator Random RemoteString TranscriptStream Is this the diffs you're talking about? If so, I think they're correct. It's possible my rough list below may have missed some changes. Cheers, Simon On 26 Sep 2008, at 20:20, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > Simon > > with which machine did you create you mcz? > Because apparently I can see the diffs for other packages. > > Can somebody else check the pinesoft package I put in the pharoInbox? > > Stef > > > >> Hi all. >> >> Gary and I decided we ought to give out an MCZ of our fixes that >> we've put together over the last two years. >> >> Obviously some of those we found have been pulled into Pharo >> already, but the attached MCZ represents those that we think are >> still relevant :) >> >> This is a rough list of the fixes: >> >> 1. Fixed flaky borwser comment text area sometime not showing. >> >> 2. Added getArgumentPermutation to support RefactoringEngine. >> >> 3. Fixes to CanvasCharacterScanner and MultiCanvasCharacterScanner >> to correctly align the first line of text when centered/justifed etc. >> >> 4. Added more constant names to Character class. >> >> 5. Modified ConnectionQueue to not accept connections when queue is >> full. >> >> 6. Changed GrafPort to answer a MultiDisplayScanner when >> appropriate (allows subclasses of MultiNewParagraph). >> >> 7. NaturalLanguageTranslator startup postion move to after >> PasteUpMorph since it will show a progress bar. >> >> 8. Fix to Random>>nextInt: to allow large numbers which would be >> out of range if using Floats (as mentioned recently on dev, use of >> Floats is dodgy anyway...) >> >> 9. Changed TranscriptStream>>clear to use a new buffer (was just >> reset which could leave a massive collection). >> >> 10. Changed RemoteString to handle concurrent processes safely. >> This one's particularly interesting: we were load-testing our >> Seaside app here and getting lots of syntax errors when hitting the >> image with around the 20 concurrent processes due to source file >> access. After this change we were hitting it with approximately 500 >> concurrent processes, and the failure was in the Java load tester >> (it timed out). >> >> Hope just submitting a .mcz is OK! :) >> >> Cheers, >> Simon and Gary >> >> >> >> ****************************************************************************************************************************************** >> This email is from Pinesoft Limited. Its contents are confidential >> to the intended recipient(s) at the email address(es) to which it >> has been addressed. It may not be disclosed to or used by anyone >> other than the addressee(s), nor may it be copied in anyway. If >> received in error, please contact the sender, then delete it from >> your system. Although this email and attachments are believed to be >> free of virus, or any other defect which might affect any computer >> or IT system into which they are received and opened, it is the >> responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they are virus free >> and no responsibility is accepted by Pinesoft for any loss or >> damage arising in any way from receipt or use thereof. >> ******************************************************************************************************************************************* >> >> >> Pinesoft Limited are registered in England, Registered number: >> 2914825. Registered office: 266-268 High Street, Waltham Cross, >> Herts, EN8 7EA >> <Pinesoft-Fixes-Misc-gvc.24.mcz> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project ****************************************************************************************************************************************** This email is from Pinesoft Limited. Its contents are confidential to the intended recipient(s) at the email address(es) to which it has been addressed. It may not be disclosed to or used by anyone other than the addressee(s), nor may it be copied in anyway. If received in error, please contact the sender, then delete it from your system. Although this email and attachments are believed to be free of virus, or any other defect which might affect any computer or IT system into which they are received and opened, it is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they are virus free and no responsibility is accepted by Pinesoft for any loss or damage arising in any way from receipt or use thereof. ******************************************************************************************************************************************* Pinesoft Limited are registered in England, Registered number: 2914825. Registered office: 266-268 High Street, Waltham Cross, Herts, EN8 7EA

Sept. 26, 2008