October 2008 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Package browser bugs

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Yes! The browser is getting really good. may be one of thse days you should show to the people you multiple methods functionality Stef On Oct 3, 2008, at 3:32 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote: > Excellent David, > > Thanks for your hard work. > > Alexandre > > On 3 Oct 2008, at 15:22, David RÃ¶thlisberger wrote: > >> Hi Stef, >> >> ok, I was able to reproduce this bugs and will fix them soon. >> >> David >> >>> 2 bugs: >>> - when I select a class in a hierarchy when I click on package, >>> the package is not selected >>> - the drag and drop on a package does not work with me. >>> Let me know if you need a more precise example >>> Stef >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pharo-project mailing list >>> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> > > -- > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Oct. 3, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Save and quit menu

by David Mitchell

I love the new, simpler Pharo approach. There is a Save option and a Quit option. If you quit without Saving, a dialog appears. Just like every other other system. And, better than most other systems, saved code can always be recovered, even if I botch the image. On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 8:18 AM, Bill Schwab <BSchwab(a)anest.ufl.edu> wrote: > I never save and quit in one step; I learned the hard way a long time > ago, and (fair or not) the lesson stuck. There should be save, and > save+quit. > > > > > > Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. > University of Florida > Department of Anesthesiology > PO Box 100254 > Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 > > Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu > Tel: (352) 273-6785 > FAX: (352) 392-7029 > >>>> mathieusuen(a)yahoo.fr 10/03/08 8:22 AM >>> > Hi, > > From the latest pharo image the Save and quit menu have disappear. > Is there any reason for removing it. > I always use it so I found annoying to first click quit and then > answer the question... > > Mth > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Mail r*invente le mail ! D*couvrez le nouveau Yahoo! Mail et son > interface r*volutionnaire. > http://fr.mail.yahoo.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Oct. 3, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Package browser bugs

by Alexandre Bergel

Excellent David, Thanks for your hard work. Alexandre On 3 Oct 2008, at 15:22, David RÃ¶thlisberger wrote: > Hi Stef, > > ok, I was able to reproduce this bugs and will fix them soon. > > David > >> 2 bugs: >> - when I select a class in a hierarchy when I click on package, the >> package is not selected >> - the drag and drop on a package does not work with me. >> Let me know if you need a more precise example >> Stef >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > -- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

Oct. 3, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Package browser bugs

by David RÃ¶thlisberger

Hi Stef, ok, I was able to reproduce this bugs and will fix them soon. David > 2 bugs: > - when I select a class in a hierarchy when I click on package, the > package is not selected > > - the drag and drop on a package does not work with me. > > Let me know if you need a more precise example > Stef > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

Oct. 3, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Save and quit menu

by Bill Schwab

I never save and quit in one step; I learned the hard way a long time ago, and (fair or not) the lesson stuck. There should be save, and save+quit. Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. University of Florida Department of Anesthesiology PO Box 100254 Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu Tel: (352) 273-6785 FAX: (352) 392-7029 >>> mathieusuen(a)yahoo.fr 10/03/08 8:22 AM >>> Hi, From the latest pharo image the Save and quit menu have disappear. Is there any reason for removing it. I always use it so I found annoying to first click quit and then answer the question... Mth ___________________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Mail r*invente le mail ! D*couvrez le nouveau Yahoo! Mail et son interface r*volutionnaire. http://fr.mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

Oct. 3, 2008

[Pharo-project] Save and quit menu

by Mathieu Suen

Hi, From the latest pharo image the Save and quit menu have disappear. Is there any reason for removing it. I always use it so I found annoying to first click quit and then answer the question... Mth ___________________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Mail rï¿½invente le mail ! Dï¿½couvrez le nouveau Yahoo! Mail et son interface rï¿½volutionnaire. http://fr.mail.yahoo.com

Oct. 3, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] History and SUnit

by Alexandre Bergel

http://www.squeaksource.com/Testing/ http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/SUnit%20for%203.10 Alexandre On 3 Oct 2008, at 12:13, Simon Kirk wrote: > Stef, what do you mean by "the Testing package" ? > S > > > On 3 Oct 2008, at 09:46, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > >> Simon what would be good is a feedback on whether the Testing >> package is good, useful, .... >> >> Stef >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > > ****************************************************************************************************************************************** > This email is from Pinesoft Limited. Its contents are confidential > to the intended recipient(s) at the email address(es) to which it > has been addressed. It may not be disclosed to or used by anyone > other than the addressee(s), nor may it be copied in anyway. If > received in error, please contact the sender, then delete it from > your system. Although this email and attachments are believed to be > free of virus, or any other defect which might affect any computer > or IT system into which they are received and opened, it is the > responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they are virus free > and no responsibility is accepted by Pinesoft for any loss or damage > arising in any way from receipt or use thereof. > ******************************************************************************************************************************************* > > > Pinesoft Limited are registered in England, Registered number: > 2914825. Registered office: 266-268 High Street, Waltham Cross, > Herts, EN8 7EA > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > -- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

Oct. 3, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] History and SUnit

by Simon Kirk

Stef, what do you mean by "the Testing package" ? S On 3 Oct 2008, at 09:46, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > Simon what would be good is a feedback on whether the Testing > package is good, useful, .... > > Stef > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project ****************************************************************************************************************************************** This email is from Pinesoft Limited. Its contents are confidential to the intended recipient(s) at the email address(es) to which it has been addressed. It may not be disclosed to or used by anyone other than the addressee(s), nor may it be copied in anyway. If received in error, please contact the sender, then delete it from your system. Although this email and attachments are believed to be free of virus, or any other defect which might affect any computer or IT system into which they are received and opened, it is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they are virus free and no responsibility is accepted by Pinesoft for any loss or damage arising in any way from receipt or use thereof. ******************************************************************************************************************************************* Pinesoft Limited are registered in England, Registered number: 2914825. Registered office: 266-268 High Street, Waltham Cross, Herts, EN8 7EA

Oct. 3, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] History and SUnit

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Simon what would be good is a feedback on whether the Testing package is good, useful, .... Stef

Oct. 3, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Formalised UI

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Hi antony > >> By professional we mean: clean and robust, Of course we would like >> to have a good layout and UI. But someone has to do it. :) >> What is also important is that people get the fredom to invent new >> things and that pharo keeps making progress even at the price to be >> incompatible. > > I have slightly different goals. I'm less concerned about cleaning > up Squeak to start with, more concerned with making something that > is commercially focussed, with support, that is packaged to allow it > to cross the chasm. To that end I don't care about breaking > everything that I don't intend to support, so my refactoring can be > quite aggressive. Yes I understand. (We are doing the same for a lot of experimental code. For the release 1.0 we want to remove etoy + friends + bookmorph ) Our goal is similar except that we know that we do not have the workpower to offer support. Now some guys approached us to know if FFI and other stuff would be maintained / improved in Pharo because they would like to port VSE software. So clearly this is not something that we can offer but we would love if a company would offer this service on top or aside of pharo. We have no problems with people making money with what we are doing: in fact this is a goal that people can make money. > I'm focused on Traits + OmniBrowser. Ok. What is your business model: offering a better IDE? Because we could buy it. I would love to see some real offer, because we are buying all kind of software and I would love to be able to buy some code software that supports our second main activity (coding - first one is writing papers). > > My reasons for attempting a commercial development is to generate a > revenue stream that ensures continuity of development, so that it > doesn't become abandonware. I'm planning for a situation like > MyEclipse. I can support this project for at least a few years > without revenue. Do I guess correctly that you would like to sell a IDE for "Squeak"? I do not know myEclipse. If you would base your effort on Pharo we could also integrate your refactoring >> Is your code free? > > Yes, that code is. I haven't explicitly licensed it yet. Let us know when you know and if you want to share what can be shared. > > >> Now may be you could join gary effort with polymorph? > > My ongoing efforts are commercial, so it's probably not possible. > And I've got a very definite architecture in progress already. > >> Did you check the way newspeak does it with hopstoch > > I was working on a dynamic document-based model before hopscotch was > demonstrated, so yes. I have a background in structured document > editors, which is what motivates me. Excellent! > > >> What do you mean by new packaging. We are thinking about a module >> system but for milestone 4 or 5 (one year or two from now). > > My packaging/modularity project is called MirrorImage - some details > are on my blog. It works with VW, although I haven't really released > it because there wasn't much interest, and in any case VW is the > wrong community for such proposals. :) > > > MirrorImage is a reworking of how classes are defined. In particular > it uses a DSL approach to system construction that allows classes to > be incrementally constructed, with contributions from different > 'Projects' that can be prioritized with dependencies etc based on a > configuration algebra. Such contributions can be more that simply > adding vars and methods (ala GST) - you can delete/add/transform/ > shadow any part of the code model (ivar/cvar/methods/traits etc). > Transformation is useful for changing the way traits are integrated > into a class you want to change. Sounds interesting. > Traits also have an interesting interaction with system construction > from a pragmatic perspective because they act as a conceptual > delimiter, although that may be less interesting once I don't have > to rely on the completely braindead method-category string prefix > model of packaging. My #1 dislike in Squeak. Welcome :) >> Can you bootstrap the kernel? > > Not yet, I was about to do that when I decided to switch from VW. I > will bootstrap the Kernel using the same technique that Lisp systems > use to bootstrap. I would really like to have a bootstrap kernel so that we could even manage the source with git :) > > > Once that works it will also be the tool I use to cut out the stuff > I don't intend to support. > >> One which version of Squeak are you based? > > I started with the Damien's 3.10 dev packaging, although I'm > thinking of switching to Pharo as a base. You are welcome. Our goal is really to get rid and improve a lot of things. So if you can share some parts we may be in a win-win situation. > Antony Blakey > ------------- > CTO, Linkuistics Pty Ltd > Ph: 0438 840 787 > > There is nothing more difficult to plan, more doubtful of success, > nor more dangerous to manage than the creation of a new order of > things... Whenever his enemies have the ability to attack the > innovator, they do so with the passion of partisans, while the > others defend him sluggishly, So that the innovator and his party > alike are vulnerable. > -- Niccolo Machiavelli, 1513, The Prince. Nice quote :) >

Oct. 3, 2008