October 2008 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Some clearifications

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On Oct 4, 2008, at 11:29 PM, Marcus Denker wrote: > Hi, > > Maybe I need to make some thing clear > > 1) There will be mistakes. > > When integrating bugfixes and enhancements, it is impossible to not > make mistakes. > The problem is that one can not check every single fix, this is just > not possible. And even > if it would be checked line-by-line and very closely, there would be > new bugs. It is just impossible > that this does not happen. > > The problem is of course that the people doing the integration > everytime a bug is introduced look > (and feel) like idiots. not really :) > It would help if people would not strengthen this feeling... if I do > something where I feel like an > idiot most of the time, at some point I will stop. no we know that this is ugly but necessary job. > 2) There is only limited time. > > We can not look at every submission directly, we can not fix every > bug (even those introduced recently) > very fast. This does not mean that we don't like the person who > submited something (or that this person > did something wrong). It *especially* does not mean to discriminate > againt projects. e.g. if Seaside can't > be loaded because of somet stupid bug, this does not mean that > seaside is not wanted or something like that. > > 3) There is a lot of stuff that should be done > ... and the only reason it is not done is lack of time. It's not > because we are idiots. We re certainly not idiots. May be put that on a wiki somewhere. Now when you feel bad just think that shit happens and that we did our best. Because this is like that. Stef > > > Marcus > > -- > Marcus Denker -- denker(a)iam.unibe.ch > http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~denker > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Oct. 5, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Retracting changes for checking variable naming?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Sure remove it Noury will have to make another one. :) Stef > Hi, > > We harvested something: > > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=15 > > Instance variable names hould not be capitalized and should be > different from class variables names > > The problem is that this > > a) makes code unloadable that is already out there. not good. > > and > > b) it's buggy. > > At first, I fixed one bug: > > Issue 174: XMLSupport can't be loaded into latest Pharo image > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=174 > > Then there was another: > > Issue 202: Pier-Model can not be loaded into Pharo > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=202 > > which I thought I fixed, but that fix does not work either: > > Issue 219: Cryptography does not load into Pharo > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=219 > > Would somebody be againt retracting the orginal "enhancement" to > classbuilder? > This has already cost me *hours* and I really don't want anymore. > > Marcus > -- > Marcus Denker -- denker(a)iam.unibe.ch > http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~denker > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Oct. 5, 2008

[Pharo-project] Some clearifications

by Marcus Denker

Hi, Maybe I need to make some thing clear 1) There will be mistakes. When integrating bugfixes and enhancements, it is impossible to not make mistakes. The problem is that one can not check every single fix, this is just not possible. And even if it would be checked line-by-line and very closely, there would be new bugs. It is just impossible that this does not happen. The problem is of course that the people doing the integration everytime a bug is introduced look (and feel) like idiots. It would help if people would not strengthen this feeling... if I do something where I feel like an idiot most of the time, at some point I will stop. 2) There is only limited time. We can not look at every submission directly, we can not fix every bug (even those introduced recently) very fast. This does not mean that we don't like the person who submited something (or that this person did something wrong). It *especially* does not mean to discriminate againt projects. e.g. if Seaside can't be loaded because of somet stupid bug, this does not mean that seaside is not wanted or something like that. 3) There is a lot of stuff that should be done ... and the only reason it is not done is lack of time. It's not because we are idiots. Marcus -- Marcus Denker -- denker(a)iam.unibe.ch http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~denker

Oct. 4, 2008

[Pharo-project] Retracting changes for checking variable naming?

by Marcus Denker

Hi, We harvested something: http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=15 Instance variable names hould not be capitalized and should be different from class variables names The problem is that this a) makes code unloadable that is already out there. not good. and b) it's buggy. At first, I fixed one bug: Issue 174: XMLSupport can't be loaded into latest Pharo image http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=174 Then there was another: Issue 202: Pier-Model can not be loaded into Pharo http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=202 which I thought I fixed, but that fix does not work either: Issue 219: Cryptography does not load into Pharo http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=219 Would somebody be againt retracting the orginal "enhancement" to classbuilder? This has already cost me *hours* and I really don't want anymore. Marcus -- Marcus Denker -- denker(a)iam.unibe.ch http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~denker

Oct. 4, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] does anybody got the changes to the old browser to add traits?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Adrian this is available in the OB. Stef On Oct 4, 2008, at 12:31 PM, Adrian Lienhard wrote: > At some point in the past, methods from traits were also shown in > italic. I added this to the old browser because it is the most > fundamental info (else you always override methods from traits when > changing a method in a class). I think we should add this back too. > > Adrian > > On Oct 4, 2008, at 12:02 , StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > >> Then I would like to know where are the addtrait menuitem that were >> once >> in the old browser? >> >> Stef >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Oct. 4, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] [update] 10087

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Excellent I will continue the etoy curving and look at kernel extension. Marcus it would be good if you could have a look at the traits fixes Apparently adrian told me that I made a mistake :) Also the enhancements proposed by gary and simon. Issue: 218 Stef > Issue 80: 7130 PluggableListMorphFix > Issue 41: 7091 PluggableListMorphfix (M4719) > Issue 98: 7152 Form-isAllWhiteandFormTest-ar > Issue 57: 7107 IntervalReverseDoFix (M6438) > -> used Nicolas fix from http://bugs.squeak.org/view.php?id=6456 > Issue 202: Pier-Model can not be loaded into Pharo > > (please no question about "we need a prebuilt image, we need a TT/ > Plymorph image. If you want > to ask that question, just pretent that I did not do this update...) > > -- > Marcus Denker -- denker(a)iam.unibe.ch > http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~denker > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Oct. 4, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] How to define a trait with packagebrowser?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Apparently I do not have it. can you check the universe? On Oct 4, 2008, at 4:49 PM, David RÃ¶thlisberger wrote: > >> I would like to know how to define a trait. I thought that traits >> integration was in. > > In the context-menu of a class don't you get the button 'new trait > template'? Then you can define the trait as you define a class. > > TraitsIntegration is integrated, I took the code of Juraj and put it > into OB-Enhancements, so that we only have to load one package now > to get it. Same is true for SUnitIntegration btw. > > David > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >

Oct. 4, 2008

[Pharo-project] [update] 10087

by Marcus Denker

Issue 80: 7130 PluggableListMorphFix Issue 41: 7091 PluggableListMorphfix (M4719) Issue 98: 7152 Form-isAllWhiteandFormTest-ar Issue 57: 7107 IntervalReverseDoFix (M6438) -> used Nicolas fix from http://bugs.squeak.org/view.php?id=6456 Issue 202: Pier-Model can not be loaded into Pharo (please no question about "we need a prebuilt image, we need a TT/ Plymorph image. If you want to ask that question, just pretent that I did not do this update...) -- Marcus Denker -- denker(a)iam.unibe.ch http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~denker

Oct. 4, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Save and quit menu

by Simon Kirk

Quit and ask to save if things are changed is by far the most logical and simple combination. On the other hand, as Antony pointed out, the image seems to think there's been a change for almost any action, so even if you've just pressed save, if you then quit you get asked to save again! S On 4 Oct 2008, at 17:47, Gary Chambers wrote: > I liked save and quit, not had a problem with Squeak not actually > saving... > Still fewer menu options is good. Not seen many other applications > with a save+quit... perhaps if the "X" (aka close on host window) > fed back to the dialog, all would be good. > > 2c (or 10p in rip-off-Britain) :-) > > Gary. > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mathieu Suen" <mathieusuen(a)yahoo.fr > > > To: "An open mailing list to discuss any topics related to an open- > sourceSmalltalk" <pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> > Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2008 1:00 PM > Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Save and quit menu > > >> Yeap! that is why I found the quit button useless. >> Either you want to save and quit or save do not quit(menu: file -> >> quite do not save). >> >> On Oct 4, 2008, at 1:42 AM, Antony Blakey wrote: >> >>> >>> On 03/10/2008, at 11:58 PM, David Mitchell wrote: >>> >>>> If you quit without Saving, a dialog appears. >>> >>> Which is fine unless moving the mouse or triggering the quit >>> causes a change in the image, in which case you cannot quit >>> without being presented with a dialog, even though you haven't >>> 'changed' anything. >>> >>> Antony Blakey >>> ------------- >>> CTO, Linkuistics Pty Ltd >>> Ph: 0438 840 787 >>> >>> Some defeats are instalments to victory. >>> -- Jacob Riis >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pharo-project mailing list >>> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> >> Mth >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ___________________________________________________________________________ >> Yahoo! Mail rÃ©invente le mail ! DÃ©couvrez le nouveau Yahoo! Mail >> et son interface rÃ©volutionnaire. >> http://fr.mail.yahoo.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project ****************************************************************************************************************************************** This email is from Pinesoft Limited. Its contents are confidential to the intended recipient(s) at the email address(es) to which it has been addressed. It may not be disclosed to or used by anyone other than the addressee(s), nor may it be copied in anyway. If received in error, please contact the sender, then delete it from your system. Although this email and attachments are believed to be free of virus, or any other defect which might affect any computer or IT system into which they are received and opened, it is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they are virus free and no responsibility is accepted by Pinesoft for any loss or damage arising in any way from receipt or use thereof. ******************************************************************************************************************************************* Pinesoft Limited are registered in England, Registered number: 2914825. Registered office: 266-268 High Street, Waltham Cross, Herts, EN8 7EA

Oct. 4, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] Save and quit menu

by Gary Chambers

I liked save and quit, not had a problem with Squeak not actually saving... Still fewer menu options is good. Not seen many other applications with a save+quit... perhaps if the "X" (aka close on host window) fed back to the dialog, all would be good. 2c (or 10p in rip-off-Britain) :-) Gary. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mathieu Suen" <mathieusuen(a)yahoo.fr> To: "An open mailing list to discuss any topics related to an open-sourceSmalltalk" <pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr> Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2008 1:00 PM Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Save and quit menu > Yeap! that is why I found the quit button useless. > Either you want to save and quit or save do not quit(menu: file -> quite > do not save). > > On Oct 4, 2008, at 1:42 AM, Antony Blakey wrote: > >> >> On 03/10/2008, at 11:58 PM, David Mitchell wrote: >> >>> If you quit without Saving, a dialog appears. >> >> Which is fine unless moving the mouse or triggering the quit causes a >> change in the image, in which case you cannot quit without being >> presented with a dialog, even though you haven't 'changed' anything. >> >> Antony Blakey >> ------------- >> CTO, Linkuistics Pty Ltd >> Ph: 0438 840 787 >> >> Some defeats are instalments to victory. >> -- Jacob Riis >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > Mth > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail rÃ©invente le mail ! DÃ©couvrez le nouveau Yahoo! Mail et son > interface rÃ©volutionnaire. > http://fr.mail.yahoo.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

Oct. 4, 2008