October 2008 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] OB annotation icons

by David Roethlisberger

Hi Antony, > The screenshot I posted was OB, and I have arbitrary space. I very much like what I see in this screenshot. ;) Any possibility to see how you do this browser? > You just > need to address a particular OB flaw - the use of Text as the > abstraction (?!) for an annotated presentation item that is subsequently > rendered into a list. Could you elaborate on that? I don't quite get this. How is the fact that we use text (or string) to represent labels of items to be rendered in lists related to the space usage in these lists due to icons? This annotated text is just one representation of the item, the icon is another one (kind of). So how could help us another abstraction here? although to fix OB cleanly results in significant > breaking change, because while OB is a great prototype, like many things > in Squeak, the prototype wasn't respected as such as has been used quite > extensively. IMHO. Very true. David

Oct. 22, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] OB annotation icons

by Antony Blakey

On 22/10/2008, at 11:37 PM, David Roethlisberger wrote: > But in the columns of OB we don't have enough space to also add > meaningful decorations to icons. The screenshot I posted was OB, and I have arbitrary space. You just need to address a particular OB flaw - the use of Text as the abstraction (?!) for an annotated presentation item that is subsequently rendered into a list. A better abstraction should be preserved from node -> filters -> list, and manifested (relative to the UI domain) only in the list renderer. I've found that to be a worthwhile OB improvement (one of many), although to fix OB cleanly results in significant breaking change, because while OB is a great prototype, like many things in Squeak, the prototype wasn't respected as such as has been used quite extensively. IMHO. Antony Blakey ------------- CTO, Linkuistics Pty Ltd Ph: 0438 840 787 The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy. -- Martin Luther King

Oct. 22, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] OB annotation icons

by David Roethlisberger

> For icons: why not reuse some of the Eclipse icons. As far as I know they are free to use > and some developers might be familiar with them [1]. The problem discussed in this thread is kind of independent of the set of icons we use. Even with perfect icons the problem Lukas mentioned exists. The idea of the preference settings for icons is more to enable/disable the denotation of certain kind of facts (super send, sub-impl., whatever) by icons, not what concrete icon to use for what fact. This should really be fixed I think, otherwise it gets too complex. Or if people really want to use their own icons, they can always go and change those we provide. anyway, I don't particularly like the Eclipse icon set. It's nice for Eclipse, but it doesn't fit well to Squeak/Pharo IMO. I think that we should just have a very small amount of meaningful icons that are well done so that developers get used to them quickly. Most icons of Eclipse I really can't interpret, we don't want that to happen in Pharo. I will meet a designer tomorrow who might draw some cool icons for those facts we already have icons integrated, and that should do it. I think. > Would also be good to work with small overlays/decorators as Eclipse does [2]. In general yes. But in the columns of OB we don't have enough space to also add meaningful decorations to icons. Cheers, David

Oct. 22, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] OB annotation icons

by David Roethlisberger

> Wouldn't be enough for deprecated methods to just use a strikethrough > font style? Perfect. David

Oct. 22, 2008

[Pharo-project] OB annotation icons

by Torsten Bergmann

>use a strikethrough font style? +1 For icons: why not reuse some of the Eclipse icons. As far as I know they are free to use and some developers might be familiar with them [1]. Would also be good to work with small overlays/decorators as Eclipse does [2]. Bye Torsten [1] http://www.nur-scheuer.de/archives/243-Eclipse-Icons.html [2] http://www.eclipse.org/articles/Article-Decorators/decorators.html -- Ist Ihr Browser Vista-kompatibel? Jetzt die neuesten Browser-Versionen downloaden: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/browser

Oct. 22, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] OB annotation icons

by Lukas Renggli

On Wed, Oct 22, 2008 at 1:34 PM, Dan Corneanu <dan.corneanu(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Wouldn't be enough for deprecated methods to just use a strikethrough > font style? +1 Lukas -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch

Oct. 22, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] OB annotation icons

by Dan Corneanu

Wouldn't be enough for deprecated methods to just use a strikethrough font style?

Oct. 22, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] OB annotation icons

by David Roethlisberger

>> I'm not a big defender of the super send icon, but what would certainly have >> helped in your use case is an icon that denotes whether you send super to a >> method with a different selector. Then you would have spotted this problem >> maybe even quicker than if it wouldn't have had any icon. > > Is it possible to put a configuration in the preferences so one can > select what icons wants to be visible in the browser ? It is possible to do of course, but I'm not a friend of adding too many preferences for this and that... On the other hand, it seems to be impossible to find a set/configuration of icons that fits everyone's need and style. So maybe it's indeed best to just let people configure the icons they want... I will look into that. David

Oct. 22, 2008

Re: [Pharo-project] OB annotation icons

by Dan Corneanu

On Wed, Oct 22, 2008 at 12:06 PM, David Roethlisberger <squeak(a)webcitas.ch> wrote: > I'm not a big defender of the super send icon, but what would certainly have > helped in your use case is an icon that denotes whether you send super to a > method with a different selector. Then you would have spotted this problem > maybe even quicker than if it wouldn't have had any icon. Is it possible to put a configuration in the preferences so one can select what icons wants to be visible in the browser ?

Oct. 22, 2008

[Pharo-project] [update] 10102

by Marcus Denker

- Issue 277: SelfEvaluating Arrays - {$a. Array. 1} instead of {$a . Array . 1} - Issue 265: TODO: (simple): remove Browser "printOut" menu - Issue 251: remove ref Parser from getSourceFor:in: - Issue 249: add regexps to core image -- Marcus Denker -- denker(a)iam.unibe.ch http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~denker

Oct. 22, 2008