[Pharo-project] [squeak-dev] Re: usability of Pharo and Squeak

Germán Arduino garduino at gmail.com
Sat Jun 4 10:00:07 EDT 2011

Hi Dale and folks:

First of all let me say Dale, your capacity to deliver new projects is awesome!

2011/6/3 Dale Henrichs <dhenrich at vmware.com>:
> ----- Original Message -----
> | From: "Andreas Wacknitz" <a.wacknitz at gmx.de>
> |
> | I hope you will be successful. I don't like programming web
> | interfaces because I am still not convinced that they are superior
> | to traditional GUI's.
> | Especially I don't like the mix of HMTL, JavaScript and CSS, even if
> | you can replace HTML by Smalltalk with Seaside.
> | And I also need to be convinced that Seaside is really such a big
> | thing. I haven't seen advanced GUI's in Seaside yet.
> | The examples I have seen in the Seaside book and the Seaside site are
> | all simplistic.
> | Maybe tODE will change my mind :D
> Thanks Andreas,
> For advanced Seaside apps, check out NeXTPLAN[1]...
> As for tODE, the framework/approach isn't directly tied to Seaside ... I think tODE could be done in Morphic, but a Morphic-based tODE wouldn't serve my needs. Not only does GemStone lack a native GUI, but the GLASS applications are running on machines in a server farm somewhere and native GUIs aren't very responsive over the WAN, whereas serving pages from a remote server can provide acceptable performance.

This is a great explanation. Lot of times I must explain myself (as a
freelancer working for customers around the world) why I select web
interfaces, this is the reason. Working with different datacenters,
mix of networks and servers need to have a fast way to interact with
them, and is the reason because the web is here.

> I do agree that I seem to be working with an unholy mixture of HTML, Javascript, and CSS, but Seaside does help hide the ugliness of HTML and Javascript...

I'm not a javascript guy neither, but like or not, javascript is the
engine that energize the web in our days, this was the main reason
becuase Diego GD developed the ST2JS [1] some years ago, to program
Javscript using Smalltalk. Unfortunately I had not more time, nor a
way to insert in a payed project to continue this development, but I'm
convinced that is a very very goof helper tool for Smalltalkers doing
web development.


[1] ST2JS stand for "Smalltalk to Javascript", is part of SWT
(Smalltalk Web Toolkint), a tiny reference here:

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