Re: [Pharo-users] Where do we go now ?
On 13 April 2018 at 13:53, Benoit St-Jean via Pharo-users < pharo-users@lists.pharo.org> wrote:
Just a quick word to get some things straight because, quite frankly, I really don't know where we're heading.
Do we really need 8 delay schedulers (DelayMicrosecondScheduler, DelayMillisecondScheduler, DelayNullScheduler, DelayExperimentalSpinScheduler, DelaySpinScheduler, DelayTicklessScheduler, DelayExperimentalCourageousScheduler, DelayExperimentalSemaphoreScheduler) ?
This should have been cleaned up a while ago. Thanks for the bump. I'll get to it. However note, that half of those have not more than two methods, so are not contributing much to the size of the Image.
Perhaps a little bit of clarity and details about what's coming and what's the plan would be beneficial to a lot of us.
I guess you are looking for... https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-workingRoadmaps/blob/master/Pharo7/RO... cheers -ben
On 13 Apr 2018, at 10:25, Ben Coman <btc@openinworld.com> wrote:
On 13 April 2018 at 13:53, Benoit St-Jean via Pharo-users <pharo-users@lists.pharo.org <mailto:pharo-users@lists.pharo.org>> wrote: Just a quick word to get some things straight because, quite frankly, I really don't know where we're heading.
Do we really need 8 delay schedulers (DelayMicrosecondScheduler, DelayMillisecondScheduler, DelayNullScheduler, DelayExperimentalSpinScheduler, DelaySpinScheduler, DelayTicklessScheduler, DelayExperimentalCourageousScheduler, DelayExperimentalSemaphoreScheduler) ?
This should have been cleaned up a while ago. Thanks for the bump. I'll get to it. However note, that half of those have not more than two methods, so are not contributing much to the size of the Image.
I didnât know. Thanks :)
Perhaps a little bit of clarity and details about what's coming and what's the plan would be beneficial to a lot of us.
I guess you are looking for... https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-workingRoadmaps/blob/master/Pharo7/RO... <https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-workingRoadmaps/blob/master/Pharo7/RO...>
cheers -ben
As a general note, I have to say that I find amusing how people are often annoyed about the growing size of the image and the amount of classes. We have an image that contains a full IDE which incorpores more and more modern capabilities. And you want that to stay small and fewer classes? Iâm sorry but you are missing the point. More tools (or same tools enhanced) means more size and classes. Then⦠why the fear about classes? This is OOP. Doing classes is what we do. I prefer a new class to, for example passing same information into a dictionary. I prefer a new class over a string. I prefer a new class over a tuple. We now have slots instead symbols to express variables. I dream with even more classes: Selector, Protocol (we already have it, but we need to use it), etc., etc., etc. I will always prefer a class that defines a concept than a non-reified usage of generic classes. We need better ways to organise that information? YES! (For example I was thinking browser by default should not show âtool packagesâ, to reduce the amount of information). But I welcome more classes and less esoteric usages of existing ones, always. cheers, Esteban
On 13 Apr 2018, at 10:30, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
On 13 Apr 2018, at 10:25, Ben Coman <btc@openinworld.com <mailto:btc@openinworld.com>> wrote:
On 13 April 2018 at 13:53, Benoit St-Jean via Pharo-users <pharo-users@lists.pharo.org <mailto:pharo-users@lists.pharo.org>> wrote: Just a quick word to get some things straight because, quite frankly, I really don't know where we're heading.
Do we really need 8 delay schedulers (DelayMicrosecondScheduler, DelayMillisecondScheduler, DelayNullScheduler, DelayExperimentalSpinScheduler, DelaySpinScheduler, DelayTicklessScheduler, DelayExperimentalCourageousScheduler, DelayExperimentalSemaphoreScheduler) ?
This should have been cleaned up a while ago. Thanks for the bump. I'll get to it. However note, that half of those have not more than two methods, so are not contributing much to the size of the Image.
I didnât know. Thanks :)
Perhaps a little bit of clarity and details about what's coming and what's the plan would be beneficial to a lot of us.
I guess you are looking for... https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-workingRoadmaps/blob/master/Pharo7/RO... <https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-workingRoadmaps/blob/master/Pharo7/RO...>
cheers -ben
Moreover, we are increasing the system modularity so more classes in the IDE does not mean that you need to have them all loaded. -- Pavel 2018-04-13 10:39 GMT+02:00 Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com>:
As a general note, I have to say that I find amusing how people are often annoyed about the growing size of the image and the amount of classes. We have an image that contains a full IDE which incorpores more and more modern capabilities. And you want that to stay small and fewer classes? Iâm sorry but you are missing the point. More tools (or same tools enhanced) means more size and classes.
Then⦠why the fear about classes? This is OOP. Doing classes is what we do. I prefer a new class to, for example passing same information into a dictionary. I prefer a new class over a string. I prefer a new class over a tuple.
We now have slots instead symbols to express variables. I dream with even more classes: Selector, Protocol (we already have it, but we need to use it), etc., etc., etc. I will always prefer a class that defines a concept than a non-reified usage of generic classes.
We need better ways to organise that information? YES! (For example I was thinking browser by default should not show âtool packagesâ, to reduce the amount of information).
But I welcome more classes and less esoteric usages of existing ones, always.
cheers, Esteban
On 13 Apr 2018, at 10:30, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
On 13 Apr 2018, at 10:25, Ben Coman <btc@openinworld.com> wrote:
On 13 April 2018 at 13:53, Benoit St-Jean via Pharo-users < pharo-users@lists.pharo.org> wrote:
Just a quick word to get some things straight because, quite frankly, I really don't know where we're heading.
Do we really need 8 delay schedulers (DelayMicrosecondScheduler, DelayMillisecondScheduler, DelayNullScheduler, DelayExperimentalSpinScheduler, DelaySpinScheduler, DelayTicklessScheduler, DelayExperimentalCourageousScheduler, DelayExperimentalSemaphoreScheduler) ?
This should have been cleaned up a while ago. Thanks for the bump. I'll get to it. However note, that half of those have not more than two methods, so are not contributing much to the size of the Image.
I didnât know. Thanks :)
Perhaps a little bit of clarity and details about what's coming and what's the plan would be beneficial to a lot of us.
I guess you are looking for... https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-workingRoadmaps/ blob/master/Pharo7/ROADMAP.md
cheers -ben
EstebanLM wrote
I dream with even more classes: Selector, Protocol (we already have it, but we need to use it), etc., etc., etc. I will always prefer a class that defines a concept than a non-reified usage of generic classes.
Yes!!! ----- Cheers, Sean -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html
On 13/04/2018 11:12, Sean P. DeNigris wrote:
EstebanLM wrote
I dream with even more classes: Selector, Protocol (we already have it, but we need to use it), etc., etc., etc. I will always prefer a class that defines a concept than a non-reified usage of generic classes.
"Objects all the way down". Most problems surge from the lack of proper abstractions. -- Esteban A. Maringolo
participants (5)
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Ben Coman -
Esteban A. Maringolo -
Esteban Lorenzano -
Pavel Krivanek -
Sean P. DeNigris