Clément Bera wrote:
What is PharoJS ? Are you talking about Pharo on top of the Bert's SqueakJS VM ? If so, it starts, but some primitives fail making it freeze after a short while as you describe. It would be fun to have it running even though most of the Pharo folks went into the Amber direction for Pharo on Javascript.
Yes there is SqueakJS from Bert https://bertfreudenberg.github.io/SqueakJS/ and I would have expected "PharoJS" to be the same for Pharo. At least I would "reserve" the name for the case Pharo images work on it as well. Unfortunately Noury Bouraqadi now took this "PharoJS" name for his Pharo -> JavaScript compiler http://car.mines-douai.fr/2015/07/develop-in-pharo-run-on-javascript/ leading a little bit to this confusion. I would have called the project "Pharo JavaScriptBridge" like the config and the repo http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~noury/JavaScriptBridge I loaded the config from the SmalltalkHub repo and then: ConfigurationOfJavaScriptBridge loadBleedingEdge tried JbClientControllerBridge startOn:80 but were hit by several errors. In my opinion a minimal HOWTO would be required. Thanks Torsten
Hi Torsten, Thanks for the feedback. I have been pushed to make it public right before ESUG. I'm trying my best to make it clean and documented. If you are using a Mac, the examples I provide on http://car.mines-douai.fr/pharojs/ <http://car.mines-douai.fr/pharojs/> should work out of the box. For other platforms (Windows & Linux) I need the command line to open a web browser on a specific URL. Any hint? Regarding the naming PharoJS is more than a bridge. It allows: -Develop and test apps in Pharo -Generate a javascript file for a standalone app Noury
On 15 Jul 2015, at 11:28, Torsten Bergmann <astares@gmx.de> wrote:
Clément Bera wrote:
What is PharoJS ? Are you talking about Pharo on top of the Bert's SqueakJS VM ? If so, it starts, but some primitives fail making it freeze after a short while as you describe. It would be fun to have it running even though most of the Pharo folks went into the Amber direction for Pharo on Javascript.
Yes there is SqueakJS from Bert https://bertfreudenberg.github.io/SqueakJS/ and I would have expected "PharoJS" to be the same for Pharo.
At least I would "reserve" the name for the case Pharo images work on it as well.
Unfortunately Noury Bouraqadi now took this "PharoJS" name for his Pharo -> JavaScript compiler
http://car.mines-douai.fr/2015/07/develop-in-pharo-run-on-javascript/
leading a little bit to this confusion.
I would have called the project "Pharo JavaScriptBridge" like the config and the repo http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~noury/JavaScriptBridge
I loaded the config from the SmalltalkHub repo and then:
ConfigurationOfJavaScriptBridge loadBleedingEdge
tried JbClientControllerBridge startOn:80
but were hit by several errors.
In my opinion a minimal HOWTO would be required.
Thanks Torsten
Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
Regarding the naming PharoJS is more than a bridge. It allows: -Develop and test apps in Pharo -Generate a javascript file for a standalone app
How does it compare to Amber? Similar use case? ----- Cheers, Sean -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/PharoJS-tp4837593p4837621.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
2015-07-15 12:34 GMT+02:00 Sean P. DeNigris <sean@clipperadams.com>:
Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
Regarding the naming PharoJS is more than a bridge. It allows: -Develop and test apps in Pharo -Generate a javascript file for a standalone app
How does it compare to Amber? Similar use case?
The resulting application is the same in PharoJS and Amber, you have javascript files to deploy only and no dependence with Smalltalk, so I'd say similar use-cases for sure. I've just tried PharoJS and the main difference with Amber is that you develop from Pharo instead of from the browser, allowing to reuse the Pharo IDE for development instead of building a new one. In fact it is the same as Amber's sub-project Nemo where you develop in Amber from Pharo. Why doesn't PharoJS use the Amber compiler to compile from Smalltalk to javascript and the Amber kernel to map native Javascript objects ? Amber's compiler and JS kernel were polished and optimized during years, I don't understand why you need to do it again ... It's really nice to be able to develop and commit from Pharo.
----- Cheers, Sean -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/PharoJS-tp4837593p4837621.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
On 15 Jul 2015, at 12:34, Sean P. DeNigris <sean@clipperadams.com> wrote:
Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
Regarding the naming PharoJS is more than a bridge. It allows: -Develop and test apps in Pharo -Generate a javascript file for a standalone app
How does it compare to Amber? Similar use case?
The main difference is that with PharoJS we develop and test in Pharo, with the confort of all cool tools such as the GT inspector, spotter :-) Noury
Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
The main difference is that with PharoJS we develop and test in Pharo, with the confort of all cool tools such as the GT inspector, spotter :-)
Wow!!! That is my main pain point with Amber. Unless one is very disciplined with TDD, the linkage between the app loaded in the browser, and Helios loaded in a separate window, introduces a run-compile-like cycle where after every change, one has to reload the app which reloads the IDE, and you lose all current state e.g. workspaces, etc. How mature is PharoJS? Is anyone using it in production? Who are the core developers? What are the intentions e.g. toy? experiment? production-quality? next big thing? ----- Cheers, Sean -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/PharoJS-tp4837593p4837974.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
On 17 Jul 2015, at 17:21, Sean P. DeNigris <sean@clipperadams.com> wrote:
Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
The main difference is that with PharoJS we develop and test in Pharo, with the confort of all cool tools such as the GT inspector, spotter :-)
Wow!!! That is my main pain point with Amber. Unless one is very disciplined with TDD, the linkage between the app loaded in the browser, and Helios loaded in a separate window, introduces a run-compile-like cycle where after every change, one has to reload the app which reloads the IDE, and you lose all current state e.g. workspaces, etc.
How mature is PharoJS? Is anyone using it in production? Who are the core developers? What are the intentions e.g. toy? experiment? production-quality? next big thing?
PharoJS is a side project I started early May this year as an experiment. But, after few weeks I noticed that it can cover a significant subset of Pharo. As I showed at ESUG (we missed you BTW), it allows building a simple form app for smartphones using PhoneGap. So, I shifted my goal, and decided to make it clean and usable for production-quality app. Fortunately, I won't be alone. Torsten Bergmann and Dave Mason kindly offered their help and joined the project since few days. Regarding the status, PharoJS is usable, but I don't recommend to use it for production right now. It is not polished and parts are likely to dramatically change in the forthcoming weeks. We also need to expand the documentation. Lot of stuff to do, but I'm very excited about it :-) Still, you can give it a try. There is a first tutorial that gives a quick overview. More to come. Noury
Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
As I showed at ESUG..., it allows building a simple form app for smartphones using PhoneGap.
Ah, very cool use case. Is there a video? Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
(we missed you BTW)
I just got married, but hopefully will be back next year. Much of my work seems to be converging and I hope to be able to show something exciting next ESUG :) Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
So, I shifted my goal, and decided to make it clean and usable for production-quality app. Fortunately, I won't be alone.
Very good to hear on both counts. Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
Still, you can give it a try. There is a first tutorial that gives a quick overview.
I will do that ----- Cheers, Sean -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/PharoJS-tp4837593p4838140.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
On 19 Jul 2015, at 04:24, Sean P. DeNigris <sean@clipperadams.com> wrote:
Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
As I showed at ESUG..., it allows building a simple form app for smartphones using PhoneGap.
Ah, very cool use case. Is there a video?
I'm travelling these days. I'll do it ASAP.
Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
(we missed you BTW)
I just got married, but hopefully will be back next year.
CONGRATULATIONS!!!
Much of my work seems to be converging and I hope to be able to show something exciting next ESUG :)
Looking forward to see it. Best, Noury
Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
So, I shifted my goal, and decided to make it clean and usable for production-quality app. Fortunately, I won't be alone.
Very good to hear on both counts.
Noury Bouraqadi-2 wrote
Still, you can give it a try. There is a first tutorial that gives a quick overview.
I will do that
----- Cheers, Sean -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/PharoJS-tp4837593p4838140.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Thanx Torsten for the fix. I integrated it :-) Noury
On 15 Jul 2015, at 12:42, Torsten Bergmann <astares@gmx.de> wrote:
Hi Noury,
thanks for the feedback. For windows to open a URL one can use:
NBWin32Shell shellOpen: 'http://www.google.de'
I adopted the
startJavaScriptInterpreter |url| url := 'http://localhost:', self port asString. Smalltalk os isWindows ifTrue: [ ^NBWin32Shell shellOpen: url ]. OSProcess command: 'open ', url
and run
workspace := JbWorkspaceForWeb open.
It basically runs (still throwing some Zinc errors - but I can push some eval scripts to the browser (Chrome). No time today to look deeper today.
Please add me as a contributor so I can provide the fix/fixes or make the repo public (if possible).
Thanks T.
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 15. Juli 2015 um 12:19 Uhr Von: "Noury Bouraqadi" <bouraqadi@gmail.com> An: "Torsten Bergmann" <astares@gmx.de> Cc: "Pharo users users" <pharo-users@lists.pharo.org> Betreff: Re: PharoJS Hi Torsten,
Thanks for the feedback. I have been pushed to make it public right before ESUG. I'm trying my best to make it clean and documented.
If you are using a Mac, the examples I provide on http://car.mines-douai.fr/pharojs/ <http://car.mines-douai.fr/pharojs/> should work out of the box.
For other platforms (Windows & Linux) I need the command line to open a web browser on a specific URL. Any hint?
Regarding the naming PharoJS is more than a bridge. It allows: -Develop and test apps in Pharo -Generate a javascript file for a standalone app
Noury
On 15 Jul 2015, at 11:28, Torsten Bergmann <astares@gmx.de <x-msg://8/astares@gmx.de>> wrote:
Clément Bera wrote:
What is PharoJS ? Are you talking about Pharo on top of the Bert's SqueakJS VM ? If so, it starts, but some primitives fail making it freeze after a short while as you describe. It would be fun to have it running even though most of the Pharo folks went into the Amber direction for Pharo on Javascript.
Yes there is SqueakJS from Bert https://bertfreudenberg.github.io/SqueakJS/ <https://bertfreudenberg.github.io/SqueakJS/> and I would have expected "PharoJS" to be the same for Pharo.
At least I would "reserve" the name for the case Pharo images work on it as well.
Unfortunately Noury Bouraqadi now took this "PharoJS" name for his Pharo -> JavaScript compiler
http://car.mines-douai.fr/2015/07/develop-in-pharo-run-on-javascript/ <http://car.mines-douai.fr/2015/07/develop-in-pharo-run-on-javascript/>
leading a little bit to this confusion.
I would have called the project "Pharo JavaScriptBridge" like the config and the repo http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~noury/JavaScriptBridge <http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~noury/JavaScriptBridge>
I loaded the config from the SmalltalkHub repo and then:
ConfigurationOfJavaScriptBridge loadBleedingEdge
tried JbClientControllerBridge startOn:80
but were hit by several errors.
In my opinion a minimal HOWTO would be required.
Thanks Torsten
On Wed, Jul 15, 2015 at 5:28 PM, Torsten Bergmann <astares@gmx.de> wrote:
Clément Bera wrote:
What is PharoJS ? Are you talking about Pharo on top of the Bert's SqueakJS VM ? If so, it starts, but some primitives fail making it freeze after a short while as you describe. It would be fun to have it running even though most of the Pharo folks went into the Amber direction for Pharo on Javascript.
Yes there is SqueakJS from Bert https://bertfreudenberg.github.io/SqueakJS/ and I would have expected "PharoJS" to be the same for Pharo.
At least I would "reserve" the name for the case Pharo images work on it as well.
That would be ideal. Otherwise the door is opened for people searching for something like SqueakJS on Pharo to be confused. They get excited they found it, then disappointed it wasn't what they were looking for. An alternative could be PharotoJS :). But maybe that horse has bolted... and open source implies those that do the work get to make the choices. cheers -ben
Unfortunately Noury Bouraqadi now took this "PharoJS" name for his Pharo -> JavaScript compiler
participants (5)
-
Ben Coman -
Clément Bera -
Noury Bouraqadi -
Sean P. DeNigris -
Torsten Bergmann