How do can we set up a crowdsourcing for pharo
Hi we got this discussion about the VM on 64 bits so do we try to take the opportunity to get a crowdsource donate button for it? Esteban/igor what is your estimate for such task? Stef
Do you want a donate button or a crowdsource campaign where no one is charged unless $x0,000 is raised? http://www.indiegogo.com/ is a platform for the latter. On 06/27/2013 05:16 AM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
Hi
we got this discussion about the VM on 64 bits so do we try to take the opportunity to get a crowdsource donate button for it?
Esteban/igor what is your estimate for such task?
Stef
honestly, depends a lot on who will do it. basically, I see 3 parts: 1) The Stack VM 64bits 2) The Pharo image 64bits. 3) NB-FFI 64 (No point on having a VM who cannot talk with the outside world) a future task could be create a JIT, but I complete ignorant on how difficult/possible is that :) To compile the stack vm in 64 bits is not difficult, but there is a lot of small tweaks to make... so I think 1 man-month should be enough . To produce a 64bits pharo image we need an objecttracer.... and Guille says with ObjectSpaces is a lot easier... but again, it has to be done... I think another month should be enough. ... and with NB-FFI 64, no idea, but AFAIK is almost there (Camillo knows more there) also, 1 and 2 are vital, and we can tune 3 with the VM+Image working. That's my (very general) opinion. Esteban On Jun 27, 2013, at 2:16 PM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
Hi
we got this discussion about the VM on 64 bits so do we try to take the opportunity to get a crowdsource donate button for it?
Esteban/igor what is your estimate for such task?
Stef
On 27 June 2013 14:48, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
honestly, depends a lot on who will do it.
basically, I see 3 parts:
1) The Stack VM 64bits 2) The Pharo image 64bits. 3) NB-FFI 64 (No point on having a VM who cannot talk with the outside world)
a future task could be create a JIT, but I complete ignorant on how difficult/possible is that :)
To compile the stack vm in 64 bits is not difficult, but there is a lot of small tweaks to make... so I think 1 man-month should be enough . To produce a 64bits pharo image we need an objecttracer.... and Guille says with ObjectSpaces is a lot easier... but again, it has to be done... I think another month should be enough.
... and with NB-FFI 64, no idea, but AFAIK is almost there (Camillo knows more there) also, 1 and 2 are vital, and we can tune 3 with the VM+Image working.
That's my (very general) opinion.
ah.. yes.. FFI too. That shouldn't be very difficult but cannot start work on it unless other two is ready. (it needs to know about object format and other stuff to generate proper code)
Esteban
On Jun 27, 2013, at 2:16 PM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
Hi
we got this discussion about the VM on 64 bits so do we try to take the opportunity to get a crowdsource donate button for it?
Esteban/igor what is your estimate for such task?
Stef
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
On 27 June 2013 14:16, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
Hi
we got this discussion about the VM on 64 bits so do we try to take the opportunity to get a crowdsource donate button for it?
Esteban/igor what is your estimate for such task?
depends what you put into it: - interpreter + plugins - new object/image format (64bit) - 64-bit jit
Stef
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
so much? how many men/months? Stef On Jun 27, 2013, at 3:02 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote:
On 27 June 2013 14:16, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
Hi
we got this discussion about the VM on 64 bits so do we try to take the opportunity to get a crowdsource donate button for it?
Esteban/igor what is your estimate for such task?
depends what you put into it: - interpreter + plugins - new object/image format (64bit) - 64-bit jit
Stef
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
I told you: 2 man/month (not taking NB-FFI into account) On Jun 27, 2013, at 6:26 PM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
so much? how many men/months?
Stef
On Jun 27, 2013, at 3:02 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote:
On 27 June 2013 14:16, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
Hi
we got this discussion about the VM on 64 bits so do we try to take the opportunity to get a crowdsource donate button for it?
Esteban/igor what is your estimate for such task?
depends what you put into it: - interpreter + plugins - new object/image format (64bit) - 64-bit jit
Stef
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
On 27 June 2013 18:32, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
I told you: 2 man/month (not taking NB-FFI into account)
That is a bit optimistic :) But reasonable.
On Jun 27, 2013, at 6:26 PM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
so much? how many men/months?
Stef
On Jun 27, 2013, at 3:02 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote:
On 27 June 2013 14:16, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
Hi
we got this discussion about the VM on 64 bits so do we try to take the opportunity to get a crowdsource donate button for it?
Esteban/igor what is your estimate for such task?
depends what you put into it: - interpreter + plugins - new object/image format (64bit) - 64-bit jit
Stef
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
On 27 Jun 2013, at 20:41, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote:
On 27 June 2013 18:32, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
I told you: 2 man/month (not taking NB-FFI into account)
That is a bit optimistic :) But reasonable.
Just to be clear: the goal is to make the current Cog & Stack VMs decent 64-bit apps that can operate on a 64-bit OS without needing special/extra 32-bit libs, while keeping intact the current 32-bit internal memory/pointer model, right ? And that on all 3 platforms ? Make that at least 3 months ;-)
On Jun 27, 2013, at 6:26 PM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
so much? how many men/months?
Stef
On Jun 27, 2013, at 3:02 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote:
On 27 June 2013 14:16, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
Hi
we got this discussion about the VM on 64 bits so do we try to take the opportunity to get a crowdsource donate button for it?
Esteban/igor what is your estimate for such task?
depends what you put into it: - interpreter + plugins - new object/image format (64bit) - 64-bit jit
Stef
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
On 27 June 2013 20:51, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven@stfx.eu> wrote:
On 27 Jun 2013, at 20:41, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote:
On 27 June 2013 18:32, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
I told you: 2 man/month (not taking NB-FFI into account)
That is a bit optimistic :) But reasonable.
Just to be clear: the goal is to make the current Cog & Stack VMs decent 64-bit apps that can operate on a 64-bit OS without needing special/extra 32-bit libs, while keeping intact the current 32-bit internal memory/pointer model, right ?
And that on all 3 platforms ?
Make that at least 3 months ;-)
Be careful with using 'decent'. Because to my opinion, i cannot call even our today's 32-bit VMs decent. They are OK as to me. But i want more/better etc before i can call them decent. :) -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
Am 27.06.2013 um 20:51 schrieb Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven@stfx.eu>:
On 27 Jun 2013, at 20:41, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote:
On 27 June 2013 18:32, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
I told you: 2 man/month (not taking NB-FFI into account) That is a bit optimistic :) But reasonable.
Just to be clear: the goal is to make the current Cog & Stack VMs decent 64-bit apps that can operate on a 64-bit OS without needing special/extra 32-bit libs, while keeping intact the current 32-bit internal memory/pointer model, right ?
And that on all 3 platforms ?
Make that at least 3 months ;-)
I think that even this time frame is too optimistic! Norbert
On Jun 27, 2013, at 6:26 PM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
so much? how many men/months?
Stef
On Jun 27, 2013, at 3:02 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote:
On 27 June 2013 14:16, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
Hi
we got this discussion about the VM on 64 bits so do we try to take the opportunity to get a crowdsource donate button for it?
Esteban/igor what is your estimate for such task?
depends what you put into it: - interpreter + plugins - new object/image format (64bit) - 64-bit jit
Stef
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
participants (6)
-
Esteban Lorenzano -
Igor Stasenko -
Norbert Hartl -
Paul DeBruicker -
Stéphane Ducasse -
Sven Van Caekenberghe