Glamorous Toolkit as IDE for another language?
Howdy, I am interested in building a Lua IDE using the Glamorous Toolkit. The idea is that the Playground, the Inspector, the Spotter, and the Debugger would all be interacting with an external Lua process instead of running code in the Pharo image. The "under the hood" part of Pharo - Smalltalk code - would be hidden unless specially enabled. Good or bad idea? Any tips on how to approach this? Has something similar been done before? (Is there example code available?) Cheers, -Luke
Did you know that the creator of Smalltalk , Alan Kay , made Smalltalk not as the ultimate environment but as the basis of future environments? And it worked Eclipse for instance , the well known IDE, started as a Smalltalk implementation. I have done something similar with my Python bridge , it allow you to execute Python code from Pharo even using Pharo syntax and if there is an error it fires up the debugger displaying both the Python and Pharo error and even allows you to correct and re execute with ease from inside the debugger like regular Pharo code. I am not familiar with Glamourous Toolkit but I know moose people use it to build tools that analyze code in other languages like Java. SmaCC parser comes with a ton of support for existing languages, its what I used for my Python bridge to parse and convert Python data to Pharo ordered collections. The problem is that building IDEs is a rather painful process, so don't expect a magic button. So yes you can make he Lua IDE, but there is no library in Pharo that will make the IDE for you. Where Pharo suffers is in the text editing department , we cannot compete currently with emacs and vim but we are improving . It's possible to unify emacs or other external editors with Pharo. This way you won't have to remake something that already exists and you can use Pharo as an extension to this editors for example for live coding, code analysis, code visualizations, package installation etc areas that Pharo excels at. Emacs does support communication via sockets you can even take inspiration from Shampoo http://dmitrymatveev.co.uk/shampoo/ Sky is the limit here, you can do amazing things with Pharo if you have the time and desire. On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 at 12:48, Luke Gorrie <luke@snabb.co> wrote:
Howdy,
I am interested in building a Lua IDE using the Glamorous Toolkit. The idea is that the Playground, the Inspector, the Spotter, and the Debugger would all be interacting with an external Lua process instead of running code in the Pharo image. The "under the hood" part of Pharo - Smalltalk code - would be hidden unless specially enabled.
Good or bad idea? Any tips on how to approach this? Has something similar been done before? (Is there example code available?)
Cheers, -Luke
Hi Luke, definitively a good idea. We are trying to do the same with Kendrick scripts in order to be able to run it from CLI and also in the image. We don't use Glamour at the moment but more the moldable tools like Playground+inspector. Envoyé de mon iPhone
Le 22 oct. 2016 à 11:47, Luke Gorrie <luke@snabb.co> a écrit :
Howdy,
I am interested in building a Lua IDE using the Glamorous Toolkit. The idea is that the Playground, the Inspector, the Spotter, and the Debugger would all be interacting with an external Lua process instead of running code in the Pharo image. The "under the hood" part of Pharo - Smalltalk code - would be hidden unless specially enabled.
Good or bad idea? Any tips on how to approach this? Has something similar been done before? (Is there example code available?)
Cheers, -Luke
Hi Luke,
On 22 Oct 2016, at 11:47, Luke Gorrie <luke@snabb.co> wrote:
Howdy,
I am interested in building a Lua IDE using the Glamorous Toolkit. The idea is that the Playground, the Inspector, the Spotter, and the Debugger would all be interacting with an external Lua process instead of running code in the Pharo image. The "under the hood" part of Pharo - Smalltalk code - would be hidden unless specially enabled.
Good or bad idea? Any tips on how to approach this? Has something similar been done before? (Is there example code available?)
Cheers, -Luke
Welcome to Pharo ! Your name did ring a bell from past CL, SLIME, Erlang days - good to see you here. I know that Denis is working on a remote IDE (Pharo to Pharo), you might get some ideas out of that. Sven -- Sven Van Caekenberghe http://stfx.eu Smalltalk is the Red Pill
Hi Luke! Yes, this is a good idea and it should not be too hard to have a first usable result. It all depends on how far you want the IDE to be. Having a Playground / Workspace, Inspector, and a code browser should not be too hard. If you wish to have (i) Pharo and Lua directly talk to each other or (ii) support Lua refactoring then this is significantly more complicated. Cheers, Alexandre
On Oct 22, 2016, at 6:47 AM, Luke Gorrie <luke@snabb.co> wrote:
Howdy,
I am interested in building a Lua IDE using the Glamorous Toolkit. The idea is that the Playground, the Inspector, the Spotter, and the Debugger would all be interacting with an external Lua process instead of running code in the Pharo image. The "under the hood" part of Pharo - Smalltalk code - would be hidden unless specially enabled.
Good or bad idea? Any tips on how to approach this? Has something similar been done before? (Is there example code available?)
Cheers, -Luke
-- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
Hi Luke, It seems like a good idea to me. I'm implementing an outliner+notebook alike interface for integrating interactive documentation, data visualization and exploratory computing, called Grafoscopio [1] (available from the Pharo Catalog) and would be really nice to have something like the Jupyter[2] kernels talking with several languages, supported in the playgrounds. That would be a good start to increase the diversity of languages supported in interactive documents [1] http://mutabit.com/grafoscopio/index.en.html [2] http://jupyter.org/ Welcome and let me know if this idea of multilingual (code & prose) interactive documents rings a bell for you. Cheers, Offray PS: By the way, Ben, if you're reading this, my migration of Grafoscopio to the Spec+Glamour interface is going well and now you can test the notebooks. I'm open to feedback. Next week we will start our 7th edition of our Data Week hackathon + workshop, this time for intermediate level apprentices, that have the experience with previous Data Weeks. On 22/10/16 04:47, Luke Gorrie wrote:
Howdy,
I am interested in building a Lua IDE using the Glamorous Toolkit. The idea is that the Playground, the Inspector, the Spotter, and the Debugger would all be interacting with an external Lua process instead of running code in the Pharo image. The "under the hood" part of Pharo - Smalltalk code - would be hidden unless specially enabled.
Good or bad idea? Any tips on how to approach this? Has something similar been done before? (Is there example code available?)
Cheers, -Luke
On 22/10/16 11:47, Luke Gorrie wrote:
Howdy,
I am interested in building a Lua IDE using the Glamorous Toolkit. The idea is that the Playground, the Inspector, the Spotter, and the Debugger would all be interacting with an external Lua process instead of running code in the Pharo image. The "under the hood" part of Pharo - Smalltalk code - would be hidden unless specially enabled.
Good or bad idea? Any tips on how to approach this? Has something similar been done before? (Is there example code available?)
Definitely a good idea. The toolkit is up to it, and probably still contains a few places where it is bound too tightly to smalltalk. I have integrated documentation and workshop exercises in a glamour browser. In my UI experiments I've bound Spotter for different purposes (selecting a person from an addressbook). The idea goes back a long time. In Squeak, the PostgresV3 integration allows editing of pgsql stored procedures in the code browser. Stephan
participants (7)
-
Alexandre Bergel -
Dimitris Chloupis -
Luke Gorrie -
Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas -
serge.stinckwich＠gmail.com -
Stephan Eggermont -
Sven Van Caekenberghe