About PBE status was Re: How not to serve an AngularJs application from Pharo
I converted the first 5 chapters to Pharo 3 , 1 chapter has been ported by Stef and another from Damien, so we are more or less at 50% but I gave up as I was burned out and fed up documenting stuff :D. But (Arnold accent) I will be back ! My conversion was not flawless since this was my first project using Pillar. I think however that is ok quality. By the way I am aware of the work on the documentation for all books generally because I follow my github feed. On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 3:11 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven@stfx.eu> wrote:
Kilon,
You did start with converting PBE, right ? What is the current status ? I kind of liked the git book. And it is badly needed, indeed.
Sven
On 07 Nov 2014, at 13:56, kilon alios <kilon.alios@gmail.com> wrote:
Stef I did not meant it as offence, of course you do great amount of work for documentation. But I cannot ignore the fact that PBE is still stuck to 1.4, that there is no documentation for Pharo Morphic and most libraries if not all are partly documented."lacks documentation" does not mean that there is no documentation. I meant exactly what I typed.
Stef you guys do an amazing job and I am proud to be a member of the Pharo community and make my own small contributions to make Pharo more popular and better.
On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 2:27 PM, stepharo <stepharo@free.fr> wrote:
On 4/11/14 13:53, kilon alios wrote:
I have welcomed Amber with open arms, but I have failed miserably to wrap my head around it.
Is ironic if you think about, Pharo really lacks documentation even in basic areas, Are you joking? I spend my time writing books and chapters and their quality is quite good. libraries are nowhere near as powerful as those offered by javascript yet I have found Pharo way easier to use. Web development looks to me like a big pile of unnecessary mess. Actually Amber is the best part of it :D
So the problem for me is not so much the System Browser , but the steep learning curve . Or maybe its just the fact that I dont like many of the web frameworkds, including html / js / css etc.
I wish I could make something in pharo and click a button to deploy it as a website but alas thats just a dream.
I would like to have a solution for that without having a smalltalk compiler in JS as amber is doing.
I think however that for the amount of developers Amber has been making some amazing progress.
On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 4:55 AM, Pierce Ng <pierce@samadhiweb.com> wrote: On Mon, Oct 27, 2014 at 10:21:18PM +0200, kilon alios wrote:
Even though I always have been a supporter of Amber the IDE has still a very long way to go.
I've been meaning to build a code browser for Amber (and GST) in Pharo with Omnibrowser using the Shampoo protocol[1], once I get some copious spare time.
[1] http://dmitrymatveev.co.uk/shampoo
Pierce
I (we) really appreciate your work, Kilon. It is really needed and there is not so much time with the talent/time/will to do it. Please, keep going! Esteban
On 07 Nov 2014, at 14:22, kilon alios <kilon.alios@gmail.com> wrote:
I converted the first 5 chapters to Pharo 3 , 1 chapter has been ported by Stef and another from Damien, so we are more or less at 50% but I gave up as I was burned out and fed up documenting stuff :D. But (Arnold accent) I will be back !
My conversion was not flawless since this was my first project using Pillar. I think however that is ok quality.
By the way I am aware of the work on the documentation for all books generally because I follow my github feed.
On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 3:11 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven@stfx.eu <mailto:sven@stfx.eu>> wrote: Kilon,
You did start with converting PBE, right ? What is the current status ? I kind of liked the git book. And it is badly needed, indeed.
Sven
On 07 Nov 2014, at 13:56, kilon alios <kilon.alios@gmail.com <mailto:kilon.alios@gmail.com>> wrote:
Stef I did not meant it as offence, of course you do great amount of work for documentation. But I cannot ignore the fact that PBE is still stuck to 1.4, that there is no documentation for Pharo Morphic and most libraries if not all are partly documented."lacks documentation" does not mean that there is no documentation. I meant exactly what I typed.
Stef you guys do an amazing job and I am proud to be a member of the Pharo community and make my own small contributions to make Pharo more popular and better.
On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 2:27 PM, stepharo <stepharo@free.fr <mailto:stepharo@free.fr>> wrote:
On 4/11/14 13:53, kilon alios wrote:
I have welcomed Amber with open arms, but I have failed miserably to wrap my head around it.
Is ironic if you think about, Pharo really lacks documentation even in basic areas, Are you joking? I spend my time writing books and chapters and their quality is quite good. libraries are nowhere near as powerful as those offered by javascript yet I have found Pharo way easier to use. Web development looks to me like a big pile of unnecessary mess. Actually Amber is the best part of it :D
So the problem for me is not so much the System Browser , but the steep learning curve . Or maybe its just the fact that I dont like many of the web frameworkds, including html / js / css etc.
I wish I could make something in pharo and click a button to deploy it as a website but alas thats just a dream.
I would like to have a solution for that without having a smalltalk compiler in JS as amber is doing.
I think however that for the amount of developers Amber has been making some amazing progress.
On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 4:55 AM, Pierce Ng <pierce@samadhiweb.com <mailto:pierce@samadhiweb.com>> wrote: On Mon, Oct 27, 2014 at 10:21:18PM +0200, kilon alios wrote:
Even though I always have been a supporter of Amber the IDE has still a very long way to go.
I've been meaning to build a code browser for Amber (and GST) in Pharo with Omnibrowser using the Shampoo protocol[1], once I get some copious spare time.
[1] http://dmitrymatveev.co.uk/shampoo <http://dmitrymatveev.co.uk/shampoo>
Pierce
On 07 Nov 2014, at 14:26, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
I (we) really appreciate your work, Kilon. It is really needed and there is not so much time with the talent/time/will to do it.
Please, keep going!
+111
Esteban
On 07 Nov 2014, at 14:22, kilon alios <kilon.alios@gmail.com> wrote:
I converted the first 5 chapters to Pharo 3 , 1 chapter has been ported by Stef and another from Damien, so we are more or less at 50% but I gave up as I was burned out and fed up documenting stuff :D. But (Arnold accent) I will be back !
My conversion was not flawless since this was my first project using Pillar. I think however that is ok quality.
By the way I am aware of the work on the documentation for all books generally because I follow my github feed.
On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 3:11 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven@stfx.eu> wrote: Kilon,
You did start with converting PBE, right ? What is the current status ? I kind of liked the git book. And it is badly needed, indeed.
Sven
On 07 Nov 2014, at 13:56, kilon alios <kilon.alios@gmail.com> wrote:
Stef I did not meant it as offence, of course you do great amount of work for documentation. But I cannot ignore the fact that PBE is still stuck to 1.4, that there is no documentation for Pharo Morphic and most libraries if not all are partly documented."lacks documentation" does not mean that there is no documentation. I meant exactly what I typed.
Stef you guys do an amazing job and I am proud to be a member of the Pharo community and make my own small contributions to make Pharo more popular and better.
On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 2:27 PM, stepharo <stepharo@free.fr> wrote:
On 4/11/14 13:53, kilon alios wrote:
I have welcomed Amber with open arms, but I have failed miserably to wrap my head around it.
Is ironic if you think about, Pharo really lacks documentation even in basic areas, Are you joking? I spend my time writing books and chapters and their quality is quite good. libraries are nowhere near as powerful as those offered by javascript yet I have found Pharo way easier to use. Web development looks to me like a big pile of unnecessary mess. Actually Amber is the best part of it :D
So the problem for me is not so much the System Browser , but the steep learning curve . Or maybe its just the fact that I dont like many of the web frameworkds, including html / js / css etc.
I wish I could make something in pharo and click a button to deploy it as a website but alas thats just a dream.
I would like to have a solution for that without having a smalltalk compiler in JS as amber is doing.
I think however that for the amount of developers Amber has been making some amazing progress.
On Tue, Nov 4, 2014 at 4:55 AM, Pierce Ng <pierce@samadhiweb.com> wrote: On Mon, Oct 27, 2014 at 10:21:18PM +0200, kilon alios wrote:
Even though I always have been a supporter of Amber the IDE has still a very long way to go.
I've been meaning to build a code browser for Amber (and GST) in Pharo with Omnibrowser using the Shampoo protocol[1], once I get some copious spare time.
[1] http://dmitrymatveev.co.uk/shampoo
Pierce
Hi kilon Thanks for continuing to push it. I really want to see PharoByExample in Pharo30/40. I will read and compare with the orginal the UpdatePharoByExample and do a pass on the chapters you did. I saw that some references are not found. I will have a look. I should change the latex template to print in a better way >> because right now this is a bit ugly but a detail. We should probably use the latest version of pillar. I will check if damien can help us on this one. Stef
yeah i have left some things behind like linking through chapters some meta-tags to figures , small info here and there to speed up my documentation effort. I felt that it was better to focus on the content itself and porting as many chapters as possible than the technical details with the assumption that people eventually would come in to fill my gaps. Personally I felt at some point that it would be better if PBE was inside Pharo , it would make it much easier for example instead of displaying images to have a link that would open the pharo tool and see directly the tool itself instead of a screenshot. Also examples could open in workspace so the user could directly play on them. Still searching a way to do this :) On Sat, Nov 8, 2014 at 10:09 AM, stepharo <stepharo@free.fr> wrote:
Hi kilon
Thanks for continuing to push it. I really want to see PharoByExample in Pharo30/40. I will read and compare with the orginal the UpdatePharoByExample and do a pass on the chapters you did. I saw that some references are not found. I will have a look. I should change the latex template to print in a better way >> because right now this is a bit ugly but a detail. We should probably use the latest version of pillar. I will check if damien can help us on this one.
Stef
participants (4)
-
Esteban Lorenzano -
kilon alios -
stepharo -
Sven Van Caekenberghe