Could we keep Pharo-dev for Pharo-dev?
Hi guys I will start to be picky about the mails to which I reply or even read. We should be more disciplined. Pharo-dev should be about Pharo-dev this is important for our concentration. I really like the other discussions but we should have them in Pharo-users. I think that it makes sense. Stef
+1 Doru On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 8:24 AM, stepharo <stepharo@free.fr> wrote:
Hi guys
I will start to be picky about the mails to which I reply or even read. We should be more disciplined. Pharo-dev should be about Pharo-dev this is important for our concentration. I really like the other discussions but we should have them in Pharo-users. I think that it makes sense.
Stef
-- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"
+1 On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 8:24 AM, stepharo <stepharo@free.fr> wrote:
Hi guys
I will start to be picky about the mails to which I reply or even read. We should be more disciplined. Pharo-dev should be about Pharo-dev this is important for our concentration. I really like the other discussions but we should have them in Pharo-users. I think that it makes sense.
Stef
-- Serge Stinckwich UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/
Absolutely! Norbert
Am 15.01.2015 um 08:24 schrieb stepharo <stepharo@free.fr>:
Hi guys
I will start to be picky about the mails to which I reply or even read. We should be more disciplined. Pharo-dev should be about Pharo-dev this is important for our concentration. I really like the other discussions but we should have them in Pharo-users. I think that it makes sense.
Stef
On 15 Jan 2015, at 08:24, stepharo <stepharo@free.fr> wrote:
Hi guys
I will start to be picky about the mails to which I reply or even read. We should be more disciplined. Pharo-dev should be about Pharo-dev this is important for our concentration. I really like the other discussions but we should have them in Pharo-users. I think that it makes sense.
Stef
YES ! We should also ourselves use the right mailing list when asking our own questions. And we should point people using the wrong list to the right one.
On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 9:38 AM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven@stfx.eu> wrote:
On 15 Jan 2015, at 08:24, stepharo <stepharo@free.fr> wrote:
Hi guys
I will start to be picky about the mails to which I reply or even read. We should be more disciplined. Pharo-dev should be about Pharo-dev this is important for our concentration. I really like the other discussions but we should have them in Pharo-users. I think that it makes sense.
Stef
YES !
We should also ourselves use the right mailing list when asking our own questions.
And we should point people using the wrong list to the right one.
+1 and point to Pharo StackOverflow questions/answers if necessary. -- Serge Stinckwich UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/
does that mean that announcing new pharo tools that are included in the standard pharo distribution should go to pharo-users ? On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 9:24 AM, stepharo <stepharo@free.fr> wrote:
Hi guys
I will start to be picky about the mails to which I reply or even read. We should be more disciplined. Pharo-dev should be about Pharo-dev this is important for our concentration. I really like the other discussions but we should have them in Pharo-users. I think that it makes sense.
Stef
To me it goes like that: - pharo-dev is used by people that discuss, develop, bug fix the pharo image itself - pharo-users is used by people that maybe just want to download pharo and work with it not interested in the detailed internal things - a pharo-dev person is very likely subscribed to pharo-users, too - a lot pharo-users persons are not subscribed to pharo-dev Now what information is interesting to people that want to use pharo? I'd say that new tools and new features of their environment are interesting things for them. So, I would put everything on pharo-users that a plain user of the environment might want to know off. Norbert
Am 15.01.2015 um 10:07 schrieb kilon alios <kilon.alios@gmail.com>:
does that mean that announcing new pharo tools that are included in the standard pharo distribution should go to pharo-users ?
On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 9:24 AM, stepharo <stepharo@free.fr <mailto:stepharo@free.fr>> wrote: Hi guys
I will start to be picky about the mails to which I reply or even read. We should be more disciplined. Pharo-dev should be about Pharo-dev this is important for our concentration. I really like the other discussions but we should have them in Pharo-users. I think that it makes sense.
Stef
Indeed, as far as it is about announcing, it makes sense to announce it on pharo-users only. Hilaire Le 15/01/2015 10:07, kilon alios a écrit :
does that mean that announcing new pharo tools that are included in the standard pharo distribution should go to pharo-users ?
-- Dr. Geo - http://drgeo.eu iStoa - http://istoa.drgeo.eu
+1 All Pharo discussions have taken place on this mailing for a long time. Even after starting pharo-users, for people who were already longtime readers of this list favored this list for any and all discussions concerning Pharo. It will be a culture shift for longtime Pharo users, lurkers. It will take some effort and some time but it would be worthwhile for the long term health of the community. I think it would be a good thing to start encouraging off pharo-dev topic posts toward pharo-users and begin the culture change. -1 on StackOverflow Every time I search for something I am trying to learn or discover and I find a question exactly matching what I want to know. It it shut down by the moderators. What I want to know is valid. But it doesn't match their limited view of the world so it gets moderated. I continue searching elsewhere because it is still information I need and an answer I want even if SO doesn't find it valid. Ugh! Looking at the Pharo section on SO I find it states that there are 436 messages tagged with Pharo. When I do this search on Google: "closed as" pharo site:stackoverflow.com I get 288 results. closed as off-topic, closed as not constructive, closed as primarily opinion based, closed as too broad, ... Example: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/27757766/how-to-wrap-a-morph-into-a-windo... This person asked a question and it was closed. But guess what. I imagine they still really wanted an answer. Even it it doesn't fit SO's format. And mostly (my guess from what I saw) closed by people who are not part of this community. SO they are imposing their community rules on our community. I am not real big on that. I also find SO not as good for building community. Community is very important. Especially for smaller groups like Pharo. I haven't spent a lot of time here in a while. But all of the long time readers will be familiar with who I am. The new readers not yet. I can jump in on this list and read new stuff and am familiar with the players. This is a great asset. I have explored learning F#. One of things I have struggled with is where is the community? Where do I engage in conversation? I love that Pharo has a central location for community. These mailing lists. If I have a question. If I want to have a conversation. I know where to do so. I do not want to see that fragmented into mailing list + whatever forum some other person happens to like for the moment. And you can't have this conversation on SO. Or many others which happen here. Just my opinion and my experience. It is worth what you paid. :) Jimmie On 1/15/2015 1:24 AM, stepharo wrote:
Hi guys
I will start to be picky about the mails to which I reply or even read. We should be more disciplined. Pharo-dev should be about Pharo-dev this is important for our concentration. I really like the other discussions but we should have them in Pharo-users. I think that it makes sense.
Stef
Looks like that SO question was re-opened. Maybe SO can be educated? On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 8:39 AM, Jimmie Houchin <jlhouchin@gmail.com> wrote:
+1
All Pharo discussions have taken place on this mailing for a long time. Even after starting pharo-users, for people who were already longtime readers of this list favored this list for any and all discussions concerning Pharo. It will be a culture shift for longtime Pharo users, lurkers. It will take some effort and some time but it would be worthwhile for the long term health of the community. I think it would be a good thing to start encouraging off pharo-dev topic posts toward pharo-users and begin the culture change.
-1 on StackOverflow
Every time I search for something I am trying to learn or discover and I find a question exactly matching what I want to know. It it shut down by the moderators. What I want to know is valid. But it doesn't match their limited view of the world so it gets moderated. I continue searching elsewhere because it is still information I need and an answer I want even if SO doesn't find it valid. Ugh!
Looking at the Pharo section on SO I find it states that there are 436 messages tagged with Pharo. When I do this search on Google: "closed as" pharo site:stackoverflow.com I get 288 results. closed as off-topic, closed as not constructive, closed as primarily opinion based, closed as too broad, ...
Example: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/27757766/how-to- wrap-a-morph-into-a-window-in-pharo-v3
This person asked a question and it was closed. But guess what. I imagine they still really wanted an answer. Even it it doesn't fit SO's format.
And mostly (my guess from what I saw) closed by people who are not part of this community. SO they are imposing their community rules on our community. I am not real big on that.
I also find SO not as good for building community. Community is very important. Especially for smaller groups like Pharo. I haven't spent a lot of time here in a while. But all of the long time readers will be familiar with who I am. The new readers not yet. I can jump in on this list and read new stuff and am familiar with the players. This is a great asset.
I have explored learning F#. One of things I have struggled with is where is the community? Where do I engage in conversation? I love that Pharo has a central location for community. These mailing lists. If I have a question. If I want to have a conversation. I know where to do so. I do not want to see that fragmented into mailing list + whatever forum some other person happens to like for the moment. And you can't have this conversation on SO. Or many others which happen here.
Just my opinion and my experience. It is worth what you paid. :)
Jimmie
On 1/15/2015 1:24 AM, stepharo wrote:
Hi guys
I will start to be picky about the mails to which I reply or even read. We should be more disciplined. Pharo-dev should be about Pharo-dev this is important for our concentration. I really like the other discussions but we should have them in Pharo-users. I think that it makes sense.
Stef
participants (9)
-
blake -
Hilaire -
Jimmie Houchin -
kilon alios -
Norbert Hartl -
Serge Stinckwich -
stepharo -
Sven Van Caekenberghe -
Tudor Girba