On 10 Nov 2017, at 04:05, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek@gmail.com> wrote:

2017-11-09 23:50 GMT+01:00 Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com>:

I think this is two different problems:

1. pharo itself supporting different languages/keyboards, etc.
2. pharo allowing the development of i18n applications

I think we still need to work on point 1, but for point 2 we already have gettext package, which is a standard we can/should use. Maybe that needs to be better documented (as everything), but well��� we have a solution there :)

Will we include it into the standard image?

-- Pavel

Esteban

> On 9 Nov 2017, at 18:58, Torsten Bergmann <astares@gmx.de> wrote:
>
> The Pharo 7/8 roadmap does not (yet) include I18N: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-workingRoadmaps/blob/master/Pharo7/ROADMAP.md
>
> and the Pharo core image still includes the "NaturalLanguageTranslator" solution still from Squeak. See this class for more details and
> all senders of #translated message. So far the whole Pharo UI is in English and while books, the mooc or others were translated the Pharo
> image so far is not.
> I guess some more work would be needed also on the font frontier to provide an internationalized image and the different languages.
>
>
>
> But for own applications (like web applications) there are some more (external) solutions:
>
>
> 1. I once wrote and announced an own I18N framwork:  http://lists.pharo.org/pipermail/pharo-dev_lists.pharo.org/2014-September/100247.html
>   which is fully documented on http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~TorstenBergmann/I18N but is a completely proprietary solution.
>
> 2. There is also some stuff from Jan van de Sandt:
>   https://lists.gforge.inria.fr/pipermail/pharo-project/2012-October/070652.html
>
> 3. And there is GetText (from Seaside web framework) which I guess is either here http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~PharoExtras/Gettext
>   or now maintained here: https://github.com/SeasideSt/Seaside/wiki/Gettext
>
>   Unfortunately back at the time this one was not independently loadable and had other trouble which I critisized on
>   http://forum.world.st/ANN-Easy-I18N-for-Pharo-td4778194.html
>
>   Maybe situation for this project has improved.
>
>
> But so far nobody pushed I18N really into Pharo ...
>
> 4. Therefore back in 2014 I started with a consolidation by starting a clean room implementation of Gettext - based on code from 3.
>   but now with tests and Pharo Spec based tools (see screenshot attached). I did it in an own repo to be able to experiment and
>   not break the Seaside solution right in the beginning.
>
>   My code is on STHub  http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~TorstenBergmann/Gettext  and it is not yet fully usable and so far still
>   unfinished
>
>   But one can load the project still in Pharo 7 using
>
>     Gofer it
>       smalltalkhubUser: 'TorstenBergmann' project: 'Gettext';
>       configuration;
>       load.
>
>     (Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfGettext) project bleedingEdge load
>
>   All 11 Tests are green so at least what is there should work. Check the world menu and the code. Load the "Foo" package from the same repository
>   to see something in the tools. The idea was to have support for MO and PO files completely written in Smalltalk as well as tools that allow you
>   to find and translate internationalized text.
>
>   But as always: this would require more work. I would still favour a fully in Pharo written solution (following the gettext formats) but maybe for
>   performance reasons then also bind to libgettext using UFFI.
>
>
> Hope this gives some insights on the current existing solutions/status.
>
> Thanks
> Torsten
>
>
>> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 09. November 2017 um 21:29 Uhr
>> Von: "���������������� ��������������" <vikenti.potapov@gmail.com>
>> An: pharo-users@lists.pharo.org
>> Betreff: [Pharo-users] I18n in pharo
>>
>>
>> Will Pharo 7 be ready for i18n of applications?
>> I mean some simple and useful way like in Cincom Visual Works, where translation dictionaries are separated from code and could be dinamycally changed without changing my application.
>>
>> It is very important for huge commercial applications, especially with lots of UI forms, dialogs and user-messages.
>>
>> I transfer my code from Cincom VW (VW is not available now for Russia due to politic situation) to Pharo and is very interested in simple internationalization mechanism. I don't want to reinvent the wheel but sometimes it seems to me that pharo developers are forced to do it.
>>
>> By the way, the error i had last week with clean Pharo 6\Pharo 6.1 installation ("UTF8InvalidText: Invalid utf8 input detected" on image load - error caused by cyrillic path to application folder) didn't solved and i had no feedback from community.
>>
>> best regards,
>> Vikenti Potapov.
>>
>>

> <GetTextNewTools.png>