[Pharo-project] Some Nautilus feedback
some feedback on Nautilus: 1. Having "Class/Instance" in one button is bad since the label can mean two things: "Im on the class/instance side" (state like) "Click here to go to class/instance side" (action like) After a while one knows it is the latter but this is really confusing anytime I come back to it. Especially since all Smalltalks I've used in the past have a clear and better distinction. Displaying the state on the title of the window is not enough. Possible solution: - reintroduce the two buttons (if layout space is a problem use "Instance" "?" "Class" where ? points to comment - use Tabs as in Dolphins browser http://www.stevewaring.net/blog/images/ssosxCHB.jpg - use a real toggle button which is not only changed but have a pressed "Instance" or non-pressed "Class" state - use two Radio Buttons as in VisualWorks http://linuxgazette.net/issue51/gx/steffler/classBrowser03.jpg 2. I like the hierarchy view ... and the double click "navigate to" functionality that is similar to VisuaWork. But still the inheritance tree view is not collapsible which is the most missing feature. You may ask why do we need that. Here is an example: navigate to class "StandardWindow" in Pharo 2.0 and click on "Hierarchy" to have a class hierarchy browser. Now you want to learn more about the direct subclasses of "StandardWindow" - hard to do in Nautilus: You will see class DialogWindow as the first subclass if SystemWindow - since the hierarchy of DialogWindow itself is very deep you can not see and easily navigate to the second subclass of SystemWindow which is "FontChooseMorph". It is hard to scroll down and since the tree has not lines it is also hard to follow indentation. With a collapsible tree you could collapse the "DialogWindow" subtree and would see - SystemWindow -- DialogWindow (collapsed) -- FontChooserMorph -- NautilusWindow Attached is a screenshot to show how easy it would be displayed with a collapsible browser (I used the SmalltalkMT class hierarchy browser to mock it) 3. The casing in the menue items is totally inconsistent. Here an example: "Find Method..." "Add class..." Nonetheless I like Nautilus a lot - thanks for it! Great tool Bye T. -- Empfehlen Sie GMX DSL Ihren Freunden und Bekannten und wir belohnen Sie mit bis zu 50,- Euro! https://freundschaftswerbung.gmx.de
Torsten Bergmann wrote
Nonetheless I like Nautilus a lot - thanks for it! Great tool
Yes, this is my number one feedback. Thank you Ben! Torsten Bergmann wrote
1. Having "Class/Instance" in one button is bad since the label can mean two things:
Even after using Nautilus since the first alpha, I still can't get used to this. I'm confused by the button. The only way I know which side I'm on is the text style feedback in the method list pane. Torsten Bergmann wrote
- use Tabs as in Dolphins browser - use a real toggle button... - use two Radio Buttons...
Either of these sound like better options, but the tabs in general would be *really* exciting. I want tabs on the method pane for "all | public | private" and a toggle/tab/radio for "just local methods" for methods up the superclass chain, maybe even with a methodsBelow: parentClass option. That would be powerful! Torsten Bergmann wrote
2. I like the hierarchy view ...
Yes! But why is the package pane disabled? I'd like to still be able to click a different package (which I guess would automatically revert to flat mode since no classes are selected), but I have to click the flat button to re-enable. Torsten Bergmann wrote
and the double click "navigate to" functionality...
Cool! I didn't know about that. One thing though... since the original browser changes to the clicked-on item also, I don't understand the purpose of this feature. It seems like it'd be much more valuable to leave the first browser on the current selection and open a new browser on the double-clicked item. This would be great for opening a new browser when currently editing a method... Torsten Bergmann wrote
But still the inheritance tree view is not collapsible
That would be really great! Also (and more so for me) is a tree view for packages. I guess this will be easier once RPackage = MCPackage b.t.w. for classes with extension methods in the current package, thanks for promoting the extension protocol to the top of the list. This is much more usable and a really cool feature! Cheers, Sean -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Some-Nautilus-feedback-tp4636076p4636148.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
On Fri, Jun 22, 2012 at 3:29 PM, Sean P. DeNigris <sean@clipperadams.com>wrote:
Torsten Bergmann wrote
Nonetheless I like Nautilus a lot - thanks for it! Great tool
Yes, this is my number one feedback. Thank you Ben!
Torsten Bergmann wrote
1. Having "Class/Instance" in one button is bad since the label can mean two things:
Even after using Nautilus since the first alpha, I still can't get used to this. I'm confused by the button. The only way I know which side I'm on is the text style feedback in the method list pane.
Thanks guys, I feel less stupid.
Torsten Bergmann wrote
- use Tabs as in Dolphins browser - use a real toggle button... - use two Radio Buttons...
Either of these sound like better options, but the tabs in general would be *really* exciting. I want tabs on the method pane for "all | public | private" and a toggle/tab/radio for "just local methods" for methods up the superclass chain, maybe even with a methodsBelow: parentClass option. That would be powerful!
Torsten Bergmann wrote
2. I like the hierarchy view ...
Yes! But why is the package pane disabled? I'd like to still be able to click a different package (which I guess would automatically revert to flat mode since no classes are selected), but I have to click the flat button to re-enable.
Torsten Bergmann wrote
and the double click "navigate to" functionality...
Cool! I didn't know about that. One thing though... since the original browser changes to the clicked-on item also, I don't understand the purpose of this feature. It seems like it'd be much more valuable to leave the first browser on the current selection and open a new browser on the double-clicked item. This would be great for opening a new browser when currently editing a method...
Torsten Bergmann wrote
But still the inheritance tree view is not collapsible
That would be really great! Also (and more so for me) is a tree view for packages. I guess this will be easier once RPackage = MCPackage
b.t.w. for classes with extension methods in the current package, thanks for promoting the extension protocol to the top of the list. This is much more usable and a really cool feature!
Cheers, Sean
-- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Some-Nautilus-feedback-tp4636076p4636148.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
-- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com
On Jun 22, 2012, at 3:29 PM, Sean P. DeNigris wrote:
Torsten Bergmann wrote
- use Tabs as in Dolphins browser - use a real toggle button... - use two Radio Buttons...
Either of these sound like better options, but the tabs in general would be *really* exciting. I want tabs on the method pane for "all | public | private" and a toggle/tab/radio for "just local methods" for methods up the superclass chain, maybe even with a methodsBelow: parentClass option. That would be powerful!
+1 Tabs! but occupying the whole class+protocols+methods area (otherwise it will be awkward) Esteban
Doru what is the new tab implementation you did for Glamour? Because I would like to integrate it into Pharo so that Ben can really build tabs (but with a good tab implementation). Stef On Jun 22, 2012, at 5:04 PM, Esteban Lorenzano wrote:
On Jun 22, 2012, at 3:29 PM, Sean P. DeNigris wrote:
Torsten Bergmann wrote
- use Tabs as in Dolphins browser - use a real toggle button... - use two Radio Buttons...
Either of these sound like better options, but the tabs in general would be *really* exciting. I want tabs on the method pane for "all | public | private" and a toggle/tab/radio for "just local methods" for methods up the superclass chain, maybe even with a methodsBelow: parentClass option. That would be powerful!
+1 Tabs! but occupying the whole class+protocols+methods area (otherwise it will be awkward)
Esteban
Pharo 2.0 already has tabs. Look at latest Configurations Browser, for instance. Esteban On Jun 23, 2012, at 12:05 PM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
Doru
what is the new tab implementation you did for Glamour? Because I would like to integrate it into Pharo so that Ben can really build tabs (but with a good tab implementation).
Stef
On Jun 22, 2012, at 5:04 PM, Esteban Lorenzano wrote:
On Jun 22, 2012, at 3:29 PM, Sean P. DeNigris wrote:
Torsten Bergmann wrote
- use Tabs as in Dolphins browser - use a real toggle button... - use two Radio Buttons...
Either of these sound like better options, but the tabs in general would be *really* exciting. I want tabs on the method pane for "all | public | private" and a toggle/tab/radio for "just local methods" for methods up the superclass chain, maybe even with a methodsBelow: parentClass option. That would be powerful!
+1 Tabs! but occupying the whole class+protocols+methods area (otherwise it will be awkward)
Esteban
Pharo 2.0 already has tabs. Look at latest Configurations Browser, for instance.
But this is not a good implementation. Ben already tried them long time ago but all the tabs are displayed even hidden ones. So it was really slow. Stef
Esteban
On Jun 23, 2012, at 12:05 PM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
Doru
what is the new tab implementation you did for Glamour? Because I would like to integrate it into Pharo so that Ben can really build tabs (but with a good tab implementation).
Stef
On Jun 22, 2012, at 5:04 PM, Esteban Lorenzano wrote:
On Jun 22, 2012, at 3:29 PM, Sean P. DeNigris wrote:
Torsten Bergmann wrote
- use Tabs as in Dolphins browser - use a real toggle button... - use two Radio Buttons...
Either of these sound like better options, but the tabs in general would be *really* exciting. I want tabs on the method pane for "all | public | private" and a toggle/tab/radio for "just local methods" for methods up the superclass chain, maybe even with a methodsBelow: parentClass option. That would be powerful!
+1 Tabs! but occupying the whole class+protocols+methods area (otherwise it will be awkward)
Esteban
ah, I didn't know that :) Should we remove it then, and replace with the good one? Esteban On Jun 23, 2012, at 12:36 PM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
Pharo 2.0 already has tabs. Look at latest Configurations Browser, for instance.
But this is not a good implementation. Ben already tried them long time ago but all the tabs are displayed even hidden ones. So it was really slow.
Stef
Esteban
On Jun 23, 2012, at 12:05 PM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
Doru
what is the new tab implementation you did for Glamour? Because I would like to integrate it into Pharo so that Ben can really build tabs (but with a good tab implementation).
Stef
On Jun 22, 2012, at 5:04 PM, Esteban Lorenzano wrote:
On Jun 22, 2012, at 3:29 PM, Sean P. DeNigris wrote:
Torsten Bergmann wrote
- use Tabs as in Dolphins browser - use a real toggle button... - use two Radio Buttons...
Either of these sound like better options, but the tabs in general would be *really* exciting. I want tabs on the method pane for "all | public | private" and a toggle/tab/radio for "just local methods" for methods up the superclass chain, maybe even with a methodsBelow: parentClass option. That would be powerful!
+1 Tabs! but occupying the whole class+protocols+methods area (otherwise it will be awkward)
Esteban
As I told Ben, the implementation is in Glamour-Morphic-Widgets. The classes are called Lazy*. The idea is that every tab can now hold a block that will be evaluated lazily when the tab is activated the first time. Another feature is that every tab can have its own toolbar that will appear to the top-right, like in Eclipse. Cheers, Doru On Sat, Jun 23, 2012 at 12:42 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
ah, I didn't know that :) Should we remove it then, and replace with the good one?
Esteban
On Jun 23, 2012, at 12:36 PM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
Pharo 2.0 already has tabs. Look at latest Configurations Browser, for instance.
But this is not a good implementation. Ben already tried them long time ago but all the tabs are displayed even hidden ones. So it was really slow.
Stef
Esteban
On Jun 23, 2012, at 12:05 PM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
Doru
what is the new tab implementation you did for Glamour? Because I would like to integrate it into Pharo so that Ben can really build tabs (but with a good tab implementation).
Stef
On Jun 22, 2012, at 5:04 PM, Esteban Lorenzano wrote:
On Jun 22, 2012, at 3:29 PM, Sean P. DeNigris wrote:
Torsten Bergmann wrote
- use Tabs as in Dolphins browser - use a real toggle button... - use two Radio Buttons...
Either of these sound like better options, but the tabs in general would be *really* exciting. I want tabs on the method pane for "all | public | private" and a toggle/tab/radio for "just local methods" for methods up the superclass chain, maybe even with a methodsBelow: parentClass option. That would be powerful!
+1 Tabs! but occupying the whole class+protocols+methods area (otherwise it will be awkward)
Esteban
-- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"
participants (6)
-
Esteban Lorenzano -
Mariano Martinez Peck -
Sean P. DeNigris -
Stéphane Ducasse -
Torsten Bergmann -
Tudor Girba