Hi, Need some orientation here. How to write the code to execute a piece of code in code presenter? Thanks Hilaire /* frustration on Ok, it is very frustrating learning from Pharo now. Since when Pharo is not anymore discoverable? I try to find from context menu how to code some sort of action. Here how to execute a piece of code from a workspace. I look in Playground contextual menu, then in Spec code presenter menu. Both implement some sort of different way of doing this. Yes, why doing think simple when you can just duplicate it. But the worst I can not make sense of what I read, totally lost in the level of abstraction. my productivity == 0 frustration off*/ -- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
Thanks to Squeak, it tooks me 5 min to discover this simple things from its workspace menu: Compiler evaluate: ... Oh, it does not work on Pharo. Ah, I remember I read something about a new compiler named Opal. I tried prefixing it with Opal. Yes, OpalCompiler evaluate:... But why prefixing with Opal, it makes it impossible to discover, again ! Hum, I should have know how to do this simple thing really (and I did know but forget), but for me it illustrates how complex Pharo is becoming, and so more and more unpleasant to code with sometime. But I am clear I have no hope it will ever change though. Hilaire Le 11/04/2020 à 11:37, Hilaire a écrit :
How to write the code to execute a piece of code in code presenter?
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
Thatâs circumstances but I found that just yesterday so as to store scripts: "info1 - webservice" covidScript := 'ZnClient new "contentReader: [ :entity | NeoJSONReader fromString: entity contents ];" forJsonREST; get: ''https://www.data.gouv.fr/fr/datasets/r/58aee810-ddd2-4359-85eb-5cfd899cd1ce''.'. covidFRUntilToday := OpalCompiler new source: covidScript; logged: false; evaluate. (I looked for #evaluate) Hth, Cédrick Ps: btw I wonder how log can go now :)
Le 11 avr. 2020 à 12:05, Hilaire <hilaire@drgeo.eu> a écrit :
Thanks to Squeak, it tooks me 5 min to discover this simple things from its workspace menu:
Compiler evaluate: ...
Oh, it does not work on Pharo. Ah, I remember I read something about a new compiler named Opal. I tried prefixing it with Opal. Yes, OpalCompiler evaluate:...
But why prefixing with Opal, it makes it impossible to discover, again !
Hum, I should have know how to do this simple thing really (and I did know but forget), but for me it illustrates how complex Pharo is becoming, and so more and more unpleasant to code with sometime. But I am clear I have no hope it will ever change though.
Hilaire
Le 11/04/2020 à 11:37, Hilaire a écrit :
How to write the code to execute a piece of code in code presenter?
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
Hmmm ... Shift-Return (Spotter) type 'Compiler', first hit is AbstractCompiler which has a nice public API, it has only one concrete subclass that is being used: OpalCompiler Same for evaluate:
On 11 Apr 2020, at 12:05, Hilaire <hilaire@drgeo.eu> wrote:
Thanks to Squeak, it tooks me 5 min to discover this simple things from its workspace menu:
Compiler evaluate: ...
Oh, it does not work on Pharo. Ah, I remember I read something about a new compiler named Opal. I tried prefixing it with Opal. Yes, OpalCompiler evaluate:...
But why prefixing with Opal, it makes it impossible to discover, again !
Hum, I should have know how to do this simple thing really (and I did know but forget), but for me it illustrates how complex Pharo is becoming, and so more and more unpleasant to code with sometime. But I am clear I have no hope it will ever change though.
Hilaire
Le 11/04/2020 à 11:37, Hilaire a écrit :
How to write the code to execute a piece of code in code presenter?
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
Once you know it is obvious :) Nevertheless, It took me about one hour to discover it, and only with Squeak I can discover it. My observations regarding the complexity of Pharo remain valid, though. Le 11/04/2020 à 13:05, Sven Van Caekenberghe a écrit :
Hmmm ...
Shift-Return (Spotter) type 'Compiler', first hit is AbstractCompiler which has a nice public API, it has only one concrete subclass that is being used: OpalCompiler
Same for evaluate:
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
I have to disagree a bit ;-) 5 min in squeak because you knew Compiler class usage. I wanted to evaluate code scripts so I searched for evaluate (BTW: I miss the shortcut to find selector containing text selections Alt SHIFT W seems broken for me). Ok It took me a bit more than 5 min but I learned quite much on the journey (and I like the API) ^^ Browsing implementors was straight (6 instances + one depreciated that gives quite much information). I think the complexity you refer is true but also inherent to a system that try to change without getting rid of everything else (and if only they had far more manpowerâ¦) ^^ My 2 cents, Cédrick
Le 11 avr. 2020 à 15:18, Hilaire <hilaire@drgeo.eu> a écrit :
Once you know it is obvious :)
Nevertheless, It took me about one hour to discover it, and only with Squeak I can discover it.
My observations regarding the complexity of Pharo remain valid, though.
Le 11/04/2020 à 13:05, Sven Van Caekenberghe a écrit :
Hmmm ...
Shift-Return (Spotter) type 'Compiler', first hit is AbstractCompiler which has a nice public API, it has only one concrete subclass that is being used: OpalCompiler
Same for evaluate:
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
Sometimes things are hard to find. Not everything can be easy. It also depends on what you already know, what your field of expertise is, what your experiences are. What I meant is: doing a couple of searches for class or selector names is always the first step. I guess you are more a UI person and started by disassembling something. *That* is harder.
On 11 Apr 2020, at 15:18, Hilaire <hilaire@drgeo.eu> wrote:
Once you know it is obvious :)
Nevertheless, It took me about one hour to discover it, and only with Squeak I can discover it.
My observations regarding the complexity of Pharo remain valid, though.
Le 11/04/2020 à 13:05, Sven Van Caekenberghe a écrit :
Hmmm ...
Shift-Return (Spotter) type 'Compiler', first hit is AbstractCompiler which has a nice public API, it has only one concrete subclass that is being used: OpalCompiler
Same for evaluate:
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
Ah ah, so true. Our brain is biased by the context. I was looking for an identical behavior to playground, so my context was "how does playground implement do-it?", so let's take a look. Then I hit a wall of abstractions and duplication, unseen in Squeak, in that specific context. I am pretty sure if I was looking at executing code, in another context, for example some code fetched from a file, I will have search for keyword as your described it. That's why, often, when your brain hit a wall and is stuck, you need to take a night break to escape the context you were stuck on. Nevertheless, my point regarding the walls of complexity in Pharo remains true. Le 11/04/2020 à 16:02, Sven Van Caekenberghe a écrit :
Sometimes things are hard to find. Not everything can be easy. It also depends on what you already know, what your field of expertise is, what your experiences are.
What I meant is: doing a couple of searches for class or selector names is always the first step.
I guess you are more a UI person and started by disassembling something.*That* is harder.
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
I ran into a similar situation a short while back. I was introducing someone to Pharo, and suggested they run through ProfStef. I was familiar with the reaction of others to the "Print it" behavior, which evaluates and inserts the resulting string into the window: It tends to confuse new learners, because inserting the results creates a syntax error with the following statements in the ProfStef window. (This is not a bad thing, per se, as there are instances where this behavior is useful -- just not in the context of ProfStef.) But I am also well aware that the behavior in the Playground window is different: a "Print it" does *not* insert the result into the window; it displays it in a morph, which disappears when you click elsewhere. So I was curious... Exactly where does this occur, and why is it different for the two windows? And could ProfStef be modified to act more like the Playground? Investigating this was very educational... I was able to track down the class, method, and code that each was using -- they're quite different! Totally different class hierarchies.. enough so that modifying ProfStef is probably a significant undertaking. (Which made me reflect on the job done to make the Playground from GT library objects. It seems like it must have been a full rewrite of Workspace.) I also tried to understand how Pharo Launcher works -- to get an understanding of how to make a standalone double-clickable application using Pharo. It's also very complex internally! (I'm awed by the skill & knowledge of those who wrote it & maintain it. How long until I could do something similar??) Pharo *is* a wall of complexity, internally. I suppose that calls for good documentation at the outer layers, to minimize the need to browse deeply in the foundational classes. I understand why it isn't there yet, and I've donated some of my free time to helping write/improve documentation for Pharo (and plan to continue doing so). Even though parts of Pharo are complex, it's still intriguing as a development environment. I tell myself that these more complex parts are like "being able to look into the guts of a C/C++ compiler while writing an application in those languages" -- it would likely be just as daunting. But you can't (easily, anyway); you can only use the "surface parts" and the rest "is black magic". Pharo is cool because you can open it up and peel back layer after layer to "see how it does it" -- and even modify how it does it. There's nothing like that! So, of course there will be many parts that "make my brain hurt". I like it anyway... -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Developers-f1294837.html
participants (4)
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Cédrick Béler -
Hilaire -
Sven Van Caekenberghe -
tbrunz