who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?
really? git says guilty was Torsten :P anyway⦠thatâs an awful color for background on dark. Why nobody realised it before? Iâm using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now⦠what changed? Esteban
first time I use the âblameâ to actually blame someone ;) Esteban
On 8 May 2018, at 15:30, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
really?
<Screen Shot 2018-05-08 at 15.26.21.png>
git says guilty was Torsten :P anyway⦠thatâs an awful color for background on dark. Why nobody realised it before? Iâm using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now⦠what changed?
Esteban
Yes, it was changed. But for me (latest 7) it is black text on yellow background which is OK. However, Print It in Playground is unreadable now ...
On 8 May 2018, at 15:32, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
first time I use the âblameâ to actually blame someone ;)
Esteban
On 8 May 2018, at 15:30, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
really?
<Screen Shot 2018-05-08 at 15.26.21.png>
git says guilty was Torsten :P anyway⦠thatâs an awful color for background on dark. Why nobody realised it before? Iâm using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now⦠what changed?
Esteban
On mar. 8 mai 2018 at 15:37, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven@stfx.eu> wrote:
Yes, it was changed.
But for me (latest 7) it is black text on yellow background which is OK.
Black and Yellow for a dark theme is readable but I do not think it is ok because it is really aggressive for the eyes. :( Usually in dark themes I see light gray for backgrounds and white or black font depending on the luminescence of the font. (Depending if it's > or < to 0.5)
However, Print It in Playground is unreadable now ...
--
Cyril Ferlicot https://ferlicot.fr
On 8 May 2018, at 15:53, Cyril Ferlicot <cyril.ferlicot@gmail.com> wrote:
On mar. 8 mai 2018 at 15:37, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven@stfx.eu> wrote: Yes, it was changed.
But for me (latest 7) it is black text on yellow background which is OK.
Black and Yellow for a dark theme is readable but I do not think it is ok because it is really aggressive for the eyes. :(
It is a pale yellow, only used for tooltip balloons, so for me it is acceptable.
Usually in dark themes I see light gray for backgrounds and white or black font depending on the luminescence of the font. (Depending if it's > or < to 0.5)
However, Print It in Playground is unreadable now ...
-- Cyril Ferlicot https://ferlicot.fr
This came from https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/21809 - the original changeset came from Hilaire - Stef wanted to do prepare the PR - I actually did the PR using the CS from Hilaire - it was reviewed and merged by Marcus - now Sven likes it too ;) So you have to blame half of the community :P For me it is showing yellow with black (not white) text which seems OK. But I usually work with the light theme and might be biased. No problem from my side to have a look at other tools with a dark theme (like VisualStudio, IntelliJ, Eclipse or other) to find a better color combination. Bye T.
Gesendet: Dienstag, 08. Mai 2018 um 15:30 Uhr Von: "Esteban Lorenzano" <estebanlm@gmail.com> An: "Pharo Development List" <pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org> Betreff: [Pharo-dev] who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?
really?
git says guilty was Torsten :P anyway⦠thatâs an awful color for background on dark. Why nobody realised it before? Iâm using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now⦠what changed?
Esteban
For me it is showing yellow with black (not white) text which seems OK.
Dark theme is always light text on dark background, not the other way around. Also, the color itself feels out of place... how does it relate to the other colors? What other UI element uses yellow? It has to make sense in the entire color scheme. Finally, consider the following test: In a dark room, only monitor with pharo and dark theme is producing light. Now a large popup with yellow background appears... did your eyes squint? can you suddenly see the other side of the room? :) Peter On Tue, May 8, 2018 at 9:16 PM, Torsten Bergmann <astares@gmx.de> wrote:
This came from https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/21809
- the original changeset came from Hilaire - Stef wanted to do prepare the PR - I actually did the PR using the CS from Hilaire - it was reviewed and merged by Marcus - now Sven likes it too ;)
So you have to blame half of the community :P
For me it is showing yellow with black (not white) text which seems OK. But I usually work with the light theme and might be biased.
No problem from my side to have a look at other tools with a dark theme (like VisualStudio, IntelliJ, Eclipse or other) to find a better color combination.
Bye T.
Gesendet: Dienstag, 08. Mai 2018 um 15:30 Uhr Von: "Esteban Lorenzano" <estebanlm@gmail.com> An: "Pharo Development List" <pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org> Betreff: [Pharo-dev] who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?
really?
git says guilty was Torsten :P anyway⦠thatâs an awful color for background on dark. Why nobody realised it before? Iâm using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now⦠what changed?
Esteban
Peter wrote:
Finally, consider the following test: In a dark room, only monitor with pharo and dark theme is producing light. Now a large popup with yellow background appears... did your eyes squint? can you suddenly see >the other side of the room? :)
Instead of hypothetical tests I tend to code in a light room and rather use the practical approach of fixing an issue when it appears or when I get blamed for it :P All details and a proposed solution are summarized in new issue: https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/21856/ which - will not hardcode the balloon background color (as it was before the introduction of #21809) by using a lighter version of the darkBaseColor for balloonBackgroundColor in DarkTheme - nonetheless exactly restores the actual color values of the dark theme as before the introduction of issue #21809 - still allows to define a tooltips text color on the graphics theme as it was the goal in #21809 Also a new PR is awaiting a review: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/1320 Thx T.
Tested manually. OK from this Dark Theme user, Thx !
On 9 May 2018, at 08:59, Torsten Bergmann <astares@gmx.de> wrote:
Peter wrote:
Finally, consider the following test: In a dark room, only monitor with pharo and dark theme is producing light. Now a large popup with yellow background appears... did your eyes squint? can you suddenly see >the other side of the room? :)
Instead of hypothetical tests I tend to code in a light room and rather use the practical approach of fixing an issue when it appears or when I get blamed for it :P
All details and a proposed solution are summarized in new issue: https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/21856/ which - will not hardcode the balloon background color (as it was before the introduction of #21809) by using a lighter version of the darkBaseColor for balloonBackgroundColor in DarkTheme - nonetheless exactly restores the actual color values of the dark theme as before the introduction of issue #21809 - still allows to define a tooltips text color on the graphics theme as it was the goal in #21809
Also a new PR is awaiting a review: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/1320
Thx T.
What changed is the UITheme receive a balloonTextColor method (the fix I proposed), BUT some morphs in Pharo use the theme balloonBackgroundColor BUT NOT the assorted balloonTextColor (obviously as this method was just introduced). The right fix will be to makes these morphs using balloonBackgroundColor to use balloonTextColor too. I took a look but get lost again in morph classes. Someone with the appropriate knowledge could fix it in a breeze. Hilaire Le 08/05/2018 à 15:30, Esteban Lorenzano a écrit :
git says guilty was Torsten :P anyway⦠thatâs an awful color for background on dark. Why nobody realised it before? Iâm using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now⦠what changed?
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
thanks Hilaire, in any case yellow background for dark theme was bad :) cheers, Esteban
On 9 May 2018, at 13:17, Hilaire <hilaire@drgeo.eu> wrote:
What changed is the UITheme receive a balloonTextColor method (the fix I proposed), BUT some morphs in Pharo use the theme balloonBackgroundColor BUT NOT the assorted balloonTextColor (obviously as this method was just introduced).
The right fix will be to makes these morphs using balloonBackgroundColor to use balloonTextColor too. I took a look but get lost again in morph classes. Someone with the appropriate knowledge could fix it in a breeze.
Hilaire
Le 08/05/2018 à 15:30, Esteban Lorenzano a écrit :
git says guilty was Torsten :P anyway⦠thatâs an awful color for background on dark. Why nobody realised it before? Iâm using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now⦠what changed?
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
well... For me the hight contrast makes it very visible, as should be a tooltip, and helpfull to discover feature in drgeo. Le 09/05/2018 à 13:41, Esteban Lorenzano a écrit :
thanks Hilaire,
in any case yellow background for dark theme was bad:)
cheers, Esteban
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
On 09/05/2018 14:32, Hilaire wrote:
well... For me the hight contrast makes it very visible, as should be a tooltip, and helpfull to discover feature in drgeo.
Maybe themes could use a dictionary storing all the colors for the theme. Like that each theme should only define the default set of colors and applications can easily customize the themes by updating this dictonary. -- Cyril Ferlicot https://ferlicot.fr
It looks like the scenario is worst than imagined. Some morph pick up the tooltips background color, then some other morph paint some text on the former one, without knowing their are painting on a kind of background tooltips. Not even sure there is easy fix... bad. Le 09/05/2018 à 13:17, Hilaire a écrit :
What changed is the UITheme receive a balloonTextColor method (the fix I proposed), BUT some morphs in Pharo use the theme balloonBackgroundColor BUT NOT the assorted balloonTextColor (obviously as this method was just introduced).
The right fix will be to makes these morphs using balloonBackgroundColor to use balloonTextColor too. I took a look but get lost again in morph classes. Someone with the appropriate knowledge could fix it in a breeze.
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
Hi Hilaire, why not make a custom "DrGeoDarkTheme" as - a subclass of "PharoDarkTheme" (in Pharo 7) - or "Pharo3DarkTheme" (when still in Pharo 6, note this class is deprecated in Pharo 7) there you can overwrite the appropriate methods for your personal styled colors. I guess this was the idea for the theming class hierarchy and to my knowledge custom theming is used by Moose and others. Attached is an example and you can easily switch to it using DrGeoDarkTheme beCurrent in your playground, startup.st, the settings or other to get the yellow tooltip back. You can add new custom colors for Dr.Geo to this class, ... - so no dictionary needed. Or if you like the dictionary approach you can provide it in your subclass for Dr. Geo. Bye T.
Hi Torsten, This will not work. Because some morphs in the system will mix use of theme's balloonColor and textColor, so these morphs will render as unreadable as soon as I change (Esteban screenshot). Anyway, I give up on that. Your lighter balloon background is good enough. Thanks Hilaire Le 09/05/2018 à 16:17, Torsten Bergmann a écrit :
why not make a custom "DrGeoDarkTheme" as
- a subclass of "PharoDarkTheme" (in Pharo 7) - or "Pharo3DarkTheme" (when still in Pharo 6, note this class is deprecated in Pharo 7)
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu
participants (7)
-
Cyril Ferlicot -
Cyril Ferlicot D.
-
Esteban Lorenzano -
Hilaire -
Peter Uhnák -
Sven Van Caekenberghe -
Torsten Bergmann