[Pharo-project] squeaksource is down (again ...)
What can be done / how can we help / what's needed to improve squeaksource uptime ? Laurent Laffont http://pharocasts.blogspot.com/ http://magaloma.blogspot.com/
On 06/24/2010 10:04 AM, laurent laffont wrote:
What can be done / how can we help / what's needed to improve squeaksource uptime ?
I am not sure how SS is being deployed but one option might be to move to another web server as a frontend and use FastCGI or SimpleCGI (Blackfoot on SM). My load tests a few years back on Nginx + Blackfoot compared to straight KomHttpServer showed that the former combo handled load MUCH better, it didn't miss requests. Just an idea. Not sure exactly "why" though :) regards, Göran
I am not sure how SS is being deployed but one option might be to move to another web server as a frontend and use FastCGI or SimpleCGI (Blackfoot on SM).
could you give a try to build a new source with your solution?
My load tests a few years back on Nginx + Blackfoot compared to straight KomHttpServer showed that the former combo handled load MUCH better, it didn't miss requests.
Just an idea. Not sure exactly "why" though :)
For us we were thinking to move to a webdav server. But inria is concerned about security with free upload
On 06/24/2010 12:17 PM, Göran Krampe wrote:
On 06/24/2010 10:04 AM, laurent laffont wrote:
What can be done / how can we help / what's needed to improve squeaksource uptime ?
I am not sure how SS is being deployed but one option might be to move to another web server as a frontend and use FastCGI or SimpleCGI (Blackfoot on SM).
Believe me when I tell you, the web server is the least of the issues. What mostly happens are Socket/Semaphore related issues, eg. a thousand Processes hanging on the same Semaphore. What could be done is moving to an up to date image/vm but this is a bit of work. Cheers Philippe
I think it is the time to let squeaksource.com die. After all it served its purpose and made Monticello what it is today: the standard code and versioning system of Smalltalk fully supported by Pharo, Squeak, and GemStone; and partially by Cincom Smalltalk and VA Smalltalk. I doubt that something can rescue squeaksource.com as it is now. Any change means an incredible investment of work and the people that set it up about 7 years ago are moving elsewhere. I think somebody should jump in and provide a much better solution. Lukas On 24 June 2010 14:52, Philippe Marschall <philippe.marschall@netcetera.ch> wrote:
On 06/24/2010 12:17 PM, Göran Krampe wrote:
On 06/24/2010 10:04 AM, laurent laffont wrote:
What can be done / how can we help / what's needed to improve squeaksource uptime ?
I am not sure how SS is being deployed but one option might be to move to another web server as a frontend and use FastCGI or SimpleCGI (Blackfoot on SM).
Believe me when I tell you, the web server is the least of the issues. What mostly happens are Socket/Semaphore related issues, eg. a thousand Processes hanging on the same Semaphore.
What could be done is moving to an up to date image/vm but this is a bit of work.
Cheers Philippe
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-- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch
What could such a solution be? On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:52 PM, Lukas Renggli <renggli@gmail.com> wrote:
I think it is the time to let squeaksource.com die. After all it served its purpose and made Monticello what it is today: the standard code and versioning system of Smalltalk fully supported by Pharo, Squeak, and GemStone; and partially by Cincom Smalltalk and VA Smalltalk.
I doubt that something can rescue squeaksource.com as it is now. Any change means an incredible investment of work and the people that set it up about 7 years ago are moving elsewhere.
I think somebody should jump in and provide a much better solution.
Lukas
On 24 June 2010 14:52, Philippe Marschall <philippe.marschall@netcetera.ch> wrote:
On 06/24/2010 12:17 PM, Göran Krampe wrote:
On 06/24/2010 10:04 AM, laurent laffont wrote:
What can be done / how can we help / what's needed to improve squeaksource uptime ?
I am not sure how SS is being deployed but one option might be to move to another web server as a frontend and use FastCGI or SimpleCGI (Blackfoot on SM).
Believe me when I tell you, the web server is the least of the issues. What mostly happens are Socket/Semaphore related issues, eg. a thousand Processes hanging on the same Semaphore.
What could be done is moving to an up to date image/vm but this is a bit of work.
Cheers Philippe
_______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
-- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch
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restart a nice application with a nice model. Squeaksource was developed literally a couple of days. I remember when they said monday "wait until friday" :) Stef On Jun 25, 2010, at 12:33 AM, Richard Durr wrote:
What could such a solution be?
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:52 PM, Lukas Renggli <renggli@gmail.com> wrote:
I think it is the time to let squeaksource.com die. After all it served its purpose and made Monticello what it is today: the standard code and versioning system of Smalltalk fully supported by Pharo, Squeak, and GemStone; and partially by Cincom Smalltalk and VA Smalltalk.
I doubt that something can rescue squeaksource.com as it is now. Any change means an incredible investment of work and the people that set it up about 7 years ago are moving elsewhere.
I think somebody should jump in and provide a much better solution.
Lukas
On 24 June 2010 14:52, Philippe Marschall <philippe.marschall@netcetera.ch> wrote:
On 06/24/2010 12:17 PM, Göran Krampe wrote:
On 06/24/2010 10:04 AM, laurent laffont wrote:
What can be done / how can we help / what's needed to improve squeaksource uptime ?
I am not sure how SS is being deployed but one option might be to move to another web server as a frontend and use FastCGI or SimpleCGI (Blackfoot on SM).
Believe me when I tell you, the web server is the least of the issues. What mostly happens are Socket/Semaphore related issues, eg. a thousand Processes hanging on the same Semaphore.
What could be done is moving to an up to date image/vm but this is a bit of work.
Cheers Philippe
_______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
-- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch
_______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
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Maybe this is the time to re-visit/build upon SourceTalk ... but for Monticello 1? -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/squeaksource-is-down-again-tp2266603p2268039.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Maybe this is the time to re-visit/build upon SourceTalk ... but for Monticello 1?
The problem is that SourceTalk is quite heavily targeted at Monticello 2. For example, projects directly map to Monticello 2 projects. Also I suspect that it would also require some additional tweaks to really make it scale better than SqueakSource in the next 10 years. I am still waiting for Monticello 2 to finally come out. It would be so much a step forward. And we would get rid of the legacy SqueakSource code. Lukas
-- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/squeaksource-is-down-again-tp2266603p2268039.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
_______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
-- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch
Lukas Renggli wrote:
The problem is that SourceTalk is quite heavily targeted at Monticello 2. For example, projects directly map to Monticello 2 projects. Also I suspect that it would also require some additional tweaks to really make it scale better than SqueakSource in the next 10 years.
I am still waiting for Monticello 2 to finally come out. It would be so much a step forward. And we would get rid of the legacy SqueakSource code.
Sounds like a strategic decision maybe required? When is MC2 scheduled (or expected) to come out? Maybe a Pharo MC2 sprint could speed things up? ps. I have to say, I probably just really like the name SourceTalk ... it's a neutral name for GemStone, Pharo, Squeak ... and could even have a domain like "st.world.st" :) -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/squeaksource-is-down-again-tp2266603p2268445.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:21 AM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr
wrote:
restart a nice application with a nice model. Squeaksource was developed literally a couple of days. I remember when they said monday "wait until friday" :)
What should be in ? I'm thinking of: Important: - fork / merge tracking (like github, so we can contribute to a package even if we don't have write access on main repository) - scriptable API (automate patch integration from PharoInbox, image building) - easy mirroring Would be nice: - documentation integration (automatically display HelpSystem doc. on web page) - issues tracking + project management Laurent Laffont http://pharocasts.blogspot.com/ http://magaloma.blogspot.com/
Stef
On Jun 25, 2010, at 12:33 AM, Richard Durr wrote:
What could such a solution be?
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:52 PM, Lukas Renggli <renggli@gmail.com> wrote:
I think it is the time to let squeaksource.com die. After all it served its purpose and made Monticello what it is today: the standard code and versioning system of Smalltalk fully supported by Pharo, Squeak, and GemStone; and partially by Cincom Smalltalk and VA Smalltalk.
I doubt that something can rescue squeaksource.com as it is now. Any change means an incredible investment of work and the people that set it up about 7 years ago are moving elsewhere.
I think somebody should jump in and provide a much better solution.
Lukas
On 24 June 2010 14:52, Philippe Marschall <philippe.marschall@netcetera.ch> wrote:
On 06/24/2010 12:17 PM, Göran Krampe wrote:
On 06/24/2010 10:04 AM, laurent laffont wrote:
What can be done / how can we help / what's needed to improve squeaksource uptime ?
I am not sure how SS is being deployed but one option might be to move to another web server as a frontend and use FastCGI or SimpleCGI (Blackfoot on SM).
Believe me when I tell you, the web server is the least of the issues. What mostly happens are Socket/Semaphore related issues, eg. a thousand Processes hanging on the same Semaphore.
What could be done is moving to an up to date image/vm but this is a bit of work.
Cheers Philippe
_______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
-- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch
_______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
_______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
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Feature wise, I don't think SqueakSource's "Groups" is very useful, but I agree with the suggestion that it would be nice to have an integrated Issue Tracking (maybe Gjallar?) system (even an integrated Wiki/CMS). Looking at systems like Trac, it has proven to very successful. Looking at other online source code repositories is probably a good idea. BitBucket for example doens't use the term "project" but actually let's you add a "Repository" which terminology wise blends better with Pharo as well. I am happy to help out a bit from a usability design point of view. -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/squeaksource-is-down-again-tp2266603p2268069.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Down again now... http://forum.world.st/file/n2268082/Squeaksource_down_again.png -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/squeaksource-is-down-again-tp2266603p2268082.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 9:50 AM, Geert Claes <geert.wl.claes@gmail.com>wrote:
Down again now... http://forum.world.st/file/n2268082/Squeaksource_down_again.png
Maybe the good news is that Pharo / Squeak is more popular ;) Laurent
-- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/squeaksource-is-down-again-tp2266603p2268082.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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laurent laffont wrote:
Maybe the good news is that Pharo / Squeak is more popular ;)
A true optimist you are Laurent, good on ya mate :) -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/squeaksource-is-down-again-tp2266603p2268138.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
On 25 Jun 2010, at 09:50, Geert Claes wrote:
Down again now... http://forum.world.st/file/n2268082/Squeaksource_down_again.png
-- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/squeaksource-is-down-again-tp2266603p2268082.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Actually the core protocol between an MC client and an MC server is dead simple, here is an implementation working in Pharo 1.1 http://forum.world.st/WebClient-Monticello-tp2264855p2264855.html But the full SqueakSource functionality is a different beast I think. Sven
Actually the core protocol between an MC client and an MC server is dead simple, here is an implementation working in Pharo 1.1
http://forum.world.st/WebClient-Monticello-tp2264855p2264855.html
So cool :)
But the full SqueakSource functionality is a different beast I think.
Analyzing mcz to show branching / fork using ancestors may not be difficult. I've just remembered this: http://forum.world.st/ANN-Trax-downloads-td1588920.html#a1588920 http://squeak.pairhome.net/trax Laurent
Sven
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participants (8)
-
Geert Claes -
Göran Krampe -
laurent laffont -
Lukas Renggli -
Philippe Marschall -
Richard Durr -
Stéphane Ducasse -
Sven Van Caekenberghe