On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 11:05 PM, Lukas Renggli <renggli@gmail.com> wrote:

...

I suppose there's a technique to replace all _ by :=

Yes, there is a transformation rule in the refactoring browser. Just run Code Critics.

Cool. Thanks. Laurent Laffont

Lukas

-- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch

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The goal is to use it for the new HelpSystem, to display images, layout easily, some colors. For browsing the web it's crap. Laurent Laffont 2010/2/27 Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab@anest.ufl.edu>

I would much rather see a robust interface to an external browser, for two reasons: (1) scamper was never terribly impressive; (2) Seaside testing.

Bill

------------------------------ *From:* pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto: pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] *On Behalf Of *laurent laffont *Sent:* Friday, February 26, 2010 4:45 PM *To:* An open mailing list to discuss any topics related to an open-source Smalltalk *Subject:* [Pharo-project] Scamper revival

Hi,

It's not stable, but it loads google :)

Gofer new squeaksource: 'LaurentLSandbox'; package:'HTML'; package:'Scamper'; load. Then:

Scamper openOnUrl: 'http://www.google.com'.

I suppose there's a technique to replace all _ by :=

Laurent Laffont

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2010/2/27 Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab@anest.ufl.edu>

Just checking :)

In that case however, I would like to see a nice(r) way to construct Polymorph interfaces. Dolphin's MVP framework is very powerful. One thing that it does not seem to do well is allow domain objects to insert themselves into a GUI; Seaside and Magritte have an advantage there. I find Magritte a little too helpful, and #description *much* too helpful, meaning that it does so much for me that I forget how things work.

There is probably nothing to stop us from taking a little more control over Magritte descriptions and containers, and IIRC, there is a Polymorph version of Magritte (or is that just wishful thinking??). Rather than write HTML to feed into what we all agree is a sub-optimal browser, I suggest putting the energy into refining Smalltalk idioms to turn data into a GUI using Polymorph. The end result should be better user interfaces all around.

Bill

I agree with these comments (don't know if the way to go is Polymorph being that I don't know it deeper) but as I also think that Magritte is a BIG help to write almost any sort of applications. I we could have a better (more productive) way of write desktop UIs then we can take over the win-linux.mac market :) I would try myself with my PasswordsPro application (currently in Dolphin). It would be nice to me port PasswordsPro to Pharo and sell it as a real desktop app (native in any operating system) and reuse the same model to have it on web also. Having a only one model, with UI in desktop and web will be really awesome, even when a lot of people may claim that is possible today, I'm not really convinced with complex applications. Cheers.

I'm in favor of options like this, but remain convinced that the more layers that appear between the ultimate end user software and the hardware, the worse performance will be. A while back I was taking the "Seaside is *not* all we need for a GUI" side of a debate and described my cash cow as "an etch-a-sketch with a type A personality" - got a good laugh when I ran across that a couple of years later. Picture users frantically banging on a tablet, selecting, poking and scribbling. Pardon my lack of vision, but there is no way in hell that HTML+CSS+JavaScript is going to keep up with it. I also have my doubts about our current vms in that respect, though Windows and its bloat would be out of the picture. Bill -----Original Message----- From: pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Eagle Offshore Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 5:48 PM To: Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Scamper revival Quick thought: WebKit plugin with Javascript language binding. http://webkit.org/projects/javascript/index.html Consider the kind of system you could build with html 5 rendered UI. Interesting project: http://phonegap.com Sadly, I have zero time to work on things outside of paying work these days. On Feb 27, 2010, at 7:33 AM, Germán Arduino wrote:

I agree with these comments (don't know if the way to go is Polymorph being that I don't know it deeper) but as I also think that Magritte is a BIG help to write almost any sort of applications.

I we could have a better (more productive) way of write desktop UIs then we can take over the win-linux.mac market :) I would try myself with my PasswordsPro application (currently in Dolphin). It would be nice to me port PasswordsPro to Pharo and sell it as a real desktop app (native in any operating system) and reuse the same model to have it on web also.

Having a only one model, with UI in desktop and web will be really awesome, even when a lot of people may claim that is possible today, I'm not really convinced with complex applications.

Cheers. _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

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There is the further concern about the browser. It wastes screen space (which is at a premium) and adds weight and distracting functionality. There is something to be said for the a fat client app that does what it needs to do and nothing else. -----Original Message----- From: pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto:pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Eagle Offshore Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:23 PM To: Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Scamper revival I wouldn't be so sure. http://html5demos.com/ http://jqtouch.com/ On Feb 27, 2010, at 4:41 PM, Schwab,Wilhelm K wrote:

there is no way in hell that HTML+CSS+JavaScript is going to keep up

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