Re: [Pharo-project] [Esug-list] [ANN] SmallHarbour project
On 05/17/2011 12:37 PM, Davorin Rusevljan wrote:
On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 9:19 PM, laurent laffont <laurent.laffont@gmail.com> wrote:
Actually we have several visions (nothing is final here, ideas welcome) ..
Having Amazon ec2 image is also a very good idea, and some Smalltalkers have already made first important steps like:
http://www.nickager.com/blog/Create-a-free-Gemstone-server-in-the-cloud-in-1...
You probably already have enough on your plate, but I mentioned CloudFoundry for following reasons: - it has a promise that one would be able to deploy SmallHarbour to different cloud providers - CloudFoundry currently provides support for Java, Ruby and Javascript, adding Smalltalk would be nice for visibility, and could be used for other Smalltalk services not only SmallHarbour.
As I said you probably have enough to do in the first place, but if you just happen to have some student lurking that has some ruby knowledge to hack the interface for Smalltalk to Cloudfoundry it would be very nice to have :)
As for your other goals - great!
Davorin Rusevljan http://www.cloud208.com/
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Laurent/Davorin, We are in the process of adding support for deploying GLASS applications into the Cloud Foundry, but I wouldn't mind helping folks who are interested in adding support for other Smalltalks into the Cloud Foundry ... The Cloud Foundry is written largely in ruby, so you'll need to be wearing your ruby dancing shoes:) Dale
On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 10:48 PM, Dale Henrichs <dhenrich@vmware.com> wrote:
On 05/17/2011 12:37 PM, Davorin Rusevljan wrote:
On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 9:19 PM, laurent laffont <laurent.laffont@gmail.com> wrote:
Actually we have several visions (nothing is final here, ideas welcome)
..
Having Amazon ec2 image is also a very good idea, and some Smalltalkers have already made first important steps like:
http://www.nickager.com/blog/Create-a-free-Gemstone-server-in-the-cloud-in-1...
You probably already have enough on your plate, but I mentioned CloudFoundry for following reasons: - it has a promise that one would be able to deploy SmallHarbour to different cloud providers - CloudFoundry currently provides support for Java, Ruby and Javascript, adding Smalltalk would be nice for visibility, and could be used for other Smalltalk services not only SmallHarbour.
As I said you probably have enough to do in the first place, but if you just happen to have some student lurking that has some ruby knowledge to hack the interface for Smalltalk to Cloudfoundry it would be very nice to have :)
As for your other goals - great!
Davorin Rusevljan http://www.cloud208.com/
_______________________________________________ Esug-list mailing list Esug-list@lists.esug.org http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org
Laurent/Davorin,
We are in the process of adding support for deploying GLASS applications into the Cloud Foundry, but I wouldn't mind helping folks who are interested in adding support for other Smalltalks into the Cloud Foundry ... The Cloud Foundry is written largely in ruby, so you'll need to be wearing your ruby dancing shoes:)
Thanks Dale, just need to wax my shoes first, haven't worn them for a long time :) Laurent.
Dale
Hi Romain, Laurent,
Having Amazon ec2 image is also a very good idea, and some
Smalltalkers have already made first important steps like:
http://www.nickager.com/blog/Create-a-free-Gemstone-server-in-the-cloud-in-1...
After having shared the above Amazon AMI (Amazon machine image), and experimented with EC2 hosting, I realised there are some undesirable properties of AMIs:
1) It's an image; with all the benefits and problems that entails; namely either you like the whole thing or not. It's not composable; it's difficult to know precisely what has been configured and how, and difficult to choose the bits you like and replace the bits you don't like. 2) You can't (currently for Linux), create an AMI locally and upload it, meaning everything has to be performed remotely and operating remotely in the IDE over X11 forwarding can be slow. 3) It's difficult to share across regions. Amazon's data centres operate autonomously. I created the image in EU-WEST and copying it to US-WEST or US-EAST is non-trivial. 4) It's another configuration that I need to keep up to date and I don't. 5) Not everyone wants to use EC2; other cloud services are available eg slicehost, linode, cloud-foudry etc 6) I configured the AMI using Amazon Linux, people might prefer Ubuntu, RHEL, Suse, Windows!#*? etc 7) I configured the AMI using Nginx as a front-end server with added modules (http://nickager.com/blog/compiling-nginx-to-add-extra-modules/), others might require other modules or other different server eg Apache, Cherokee etc. Even with the same server the configuration required can vary (url redirection, static file serving etc). 8) Everyone has a different way of performing backups, monitoring the health of the server. 9) I configured the AMI using Gemstone, others might prefer image based persistence or MySQL, Postgres etc. 10) Ideally the configuration would allow you to specify the number of images (or Gems for Gemstone) you'd like to respond to request, behind a load balancer. 11) We currently require infrastructure support for https eg stunnel or reverse proxy through a webserver eg http://www.monkeysnatchbanana.com/posts/2010/06/23/reverse-proxying-to-seasi... Quite a list... The main issue is that I'd like to be able to build server infrastructure from composable pieces and share configuration knowledge with others. This led me to Chef (http://opscode.com/chef/) where people create configuration "recipes" and a specific configuration is composed from these recipes. The benefit of using something like Chef is that there are already recipes for the standard parts of the server configuration eg installing and configuring Apache, Nginx, MySql, Postgres etc have already been taken care of. Chef abstracts the OS, and the cloud (eg EC2, slicehost etc). The task is then to create recipes for Seaside specific parts. There are a couple of Gemstone recipes already ( https://github.com/timfel/gemstone-cookbooks, https://github.com/johnnyt/gemstone-cookbooks). A few of us (myself Norbert Hartl, Stephen Eggermont) plan to investigate coding our configurations is Chef - though it's still early days and it may prove that it's more complex than we need. Our basic requirements are to be able to rapidly deploy production, staging, backup, Jenkins continuous integration and development VMs. Do others have experience with Chef or something similar? Ideally ESUG or someone else would provide http://www.heroku.com/ for Seaside - but it would require formalising more of our stack and providing a flexible solution to https. Hope this helps, Nick
Thanks a lot Nick for your feedback, it is helpful. Laurent. On Wed, May 18, 2011 at 9:46 AM, Nick Ager <nick.ager@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Romain, Laurent,
Having Amazon ec2 image is also a very good idea, and some
Smalltalkers have already made first important steps like:
http://www.nickager.com/blog/Create-a-free-Gemstone-server-in-the-cloud-in-1...
After having shared the above Amazon AMI (Amazon machine image), and experimented with EC2 hosting, I realised there are some undesirable properties of AMIs:
1) It's an image; with all the benefits and problems that entails; namely either you like the whole thing or not. It's not composable; it's difficult to know precisely what has been configured and how, and difficult to choose the bits you like and replace the bits you don't like. 2) You can't (currently for Linux), create an AMI locally and upload it, meaning everything has to be performed remotely and operating remotely in the IDE over X11 forwarding can be slow. 3) It's difficult to share across regions. Amazon's data centres operate autonomously. I created the image in EU-WEST and copying it to US-WEST or US-EAST is non-trivial. 4) It's another configuration that I need to keep up to date and I don't. 5) Not everyone wants to use EC2; other cloud services are available eg slicehost, linode, cloud-foudry etc 6) I configured the AMI using Amazon Linux, people might prefer Ubuntu, RHEL, Suse, Windows!#*? etc 7) I configured the AMI using Nginx as a front-end server with added modules (http://nickager.com/blog/compiling-nginx-to-add-extra-modules/), others might require other modules or other different server eg Apache, Cherokee etc. Even with the same server the configuration required can vary (url redirection, static file serving etc). 8) Everyone has a different way of performing backups, monitoring the health of the server. 9) I configured the AMI using Gemstone, others might prefer image based persistence or MySQL, Postgres etc. 10) Ideally the configuration would allow you to specify the number of images (or Gems for Gemstone) you'd like to respond to request, behind a load balancer. 11) We currently require infrastructure support for https eg stunnel or reverse proxy through a webserver eg http://www.monkeysnatchbanana.com/posts/2010/06/23/reverse-proxying-to-seasi...
Quite a list... The main issue is that I'd like to be able to build server infrastructure from composable pieces and share configuration knowledge with others. This led me to Chef (http://opscode.com/chef/) where people create configuration "recipes" and a specific configuration is composed from these recipes. The benefit of using something like Chef is that there are already recipes for the standard parts of the server configuration eg installing and configuring Apache, Nginx, MySql, Postgres etc have already been taken care of. Chef abstracts the OS, and the cloud (eg EC2, slicehost etc).
The task is then to create recipes for Seaside specific parts. There are a couple of Gemstone recipes already ( https://github.com/timfel/gemstone-cookbooks, https://github.com/johnnyt/gemstone-cookbooks). A few of us (myself Norbert Hartl, Stephen Eggermont) plan to investigate coding our configurations is Chef - though it's still early days and it may prove that it's more complex than we need.
Our basic requirements are to be able to rapidly deploy production, staging, backup, Jenkins continuous integration and development VMs.
Do others have experience with Chef or something similar?
Ideally ESUG or someone else would provide http://www.heroku.com/ for Seaside - but it would require formalising more of our stack and providing a flexible solution to https.
Hope this helps,
Nick
11) We currently require infrastructure support for https eg stunnel or reverse proxy through a webserver eg http://www.monkeysnatchbanana.com/posts/2010/06/23/reverse-proxying-to-seasi...
actually that link is... http://www.monkeysnatchbanana.com/posts/2010/06/22/faking-a-https-client-for... just for posterity.
Am 18.05.2011 um 13:15 schrieb Sean Allen:
11) We currently require infrastructure support for https eg stunnel or reverse proxy through a webserver eg http://www.monkeysnatchbanana.com/posts/2010/06/23/reverse-proxying-to-seasi...
actually that link is... http://www.monkeysnatchbanana.com/posts/2010/06/22/faking-a-https-client-for... just for posterity.
Just for the record. I used stunnel for a short while. But then the need for the use of client certificates arose (I'm implementing an apple push notification server). A very easy way to add SSL handling is to write a little server in node.js [1]. It supports SSL and client certificates out of the box. It could act as an intelligent proxy for SSL handling. If the use cases are known I could even provide a small node proxy. It is written in javascript and might be interesting for some to learn javascript on the server side. Node.js btw. is a cool server to know :) Norbert [1] http://nodejs.org/
Hi, We are in the process of adding support for deploying GLASS applications
into the Cloud Foundry, but I wouldn't mind helping folks who are interested in adding support for other Smalltalks into the Cloud Foundry ... The Cloud Foundry is written largely in ruby, so you'll need to be wearing your ruby dancing shoes:)
There certainly a lot of (justified) buzz around CloudFoundry at the moment. Building CloudFoundry infrastructure for Smalltalk deployment would appear to be a great approach - married with a hosting service that provides that infrastructure as a service. Nick
On May 18, 2011, at 4:02 AM, Nick Ager wrote: Hi, We are in the process of adding support for deploying GLASS applications into the Cloud Foundry, but I wouldn't mind helping folks who are interested in adding support for other Smalltalks into the Cloud Foundry ... The Cloud Foundry is written largely in ruby, so you'll need to be wearing your ruby dancing shoes:) There certainly a lot of (justified) buzz around CloudFoundry at the moment. Building CloudFoundry infrastructure for Smalltalk deployment would appear to be a great approach - married with a hosting service that provides that infrastructure as a service. Nick <ATT00001..txt> Nick, VMware will/is providing a hosting service based on cloud foundry, but there is an open source variant of cloud foundry that can be used by others to provide hosting services ... Dale
participants (5)
-
Dale Henrichs -
laurent laffont -
Nick Ager -
Norbert Hartl -
Sean Allen