Hi, The visualization you describe should be easily doable in the new world. Did you write the visualization in plain Roassal or with the RTMondrian API? Cheers, Doru

On Dec 28, 2018, at 11:32 AM, Luke Gorrie <luke@snabb.co> wrote:

Thanks for the explanations!

I like the separation between selecting (single-click) and spawning (double-click). The miller column panning is indeed working with a two-finger drag on the touchpad. I will need to test whether this gesture works when running GT on Linux and operating it on a Mac via VNC. That's the most common setup for our application.

Spotter is not urgent for us. I have written some extensions for it but we aren't really using them much yet. If the inspector is working well then that's the main thing.

I do have one very important Roassal visualization that I need to bring with me smoothly somehow. Question is whether to port if over to the new framework or somehow smoothly embed Roassal in the new GT?

The visualization is for compile SSA intermediate representation code and looks like this:

<Screen Shot 2018-12-28 at 11.25.06.png> There are some important properties about this diagram:

- These are two digraphs stacked on top of each other. - Nodes are always placed below their parents. - Y-position indicates the max number of edges to reach parent nodes. - Extra edges (red) can create cycles and should be ignored for layout purposes. - Nodes can be compound shapes i.e. colored opcode and optionally fused immediate operands in white. - Each node is an object that can be selected and inspected in the next miller column.

Can this be done in the new framework with similar effort to the old one?

On Fri, 28 Dec 2018 at 09:46, Tudor Girba <tudor@tudorgirba.com> wrote: Hi,

Thanks for the feedback!

I am happy you like the new possibilities and that you see the incentives to move to the new world :).

The inspector part is working quite well. The main reason we call it an alpha is because of the missing pieces to get to a full environment.

You noticed the issue of Spotter. The existing Spotter is the one that is included in the old GT and it lives in the Morphic world. When the focus is in the new inspector, that means that keybindings are handled by Bloc and this is a separate world from Morphic. At present time, we can embed Bloc in Morphic but not the other way around as we want no binding from Bloc to Morphic. For this reason, unhandled keys are not propagated from Bloc to Morphic and that is why pressing Shift+Enter does not open Spotter.

So, we will have a Spotter, but that will be another implementation. Other unfinished tools are the Debugger and Coder, but these are likely less relevant for your use case.

A few other missing pieces: - some widgets such as a tree are not yet implemented. So, we do not yet have a tree view in inspector. - the text editor requires a few enhancements for navigation support. - scrollbar

The Miller-columns interface can be scrolled with the touchpad left-right. Can you confirm?

About clicking vs double-clicking: Indeed, we now distinguish between selecting and spawning. As soon as there is a page to the right, selecting will populate that page. However, if there is no page to the right, simply selecting in a list will not spawn, like in the old inspector. Like this, you can work on a page without the page scrolling from underneath you. Please note that between pages we have triangles which are actually buttons. Selecting in a list shows a triangle. Clicking on the triangle spawns. So, you can either double-click to spawn, or you can select and then click on the triangle. Once spawned, simple selection is enough. Does this clarify the situation?

About Roassal: In the new GT we have GtMondrian which is similar to the one from Roassal. We do not yet have support for creating charts (like bar or line charts).

About the porting strategy: When you have the new GT loaded, the old Inspector will get a _GT pane that will essentially embed the new views in the old inspector. These also allow for interaction. Like this, you can port at your pace and switch only when you are ready.

Cheers, Doru

...

On Dec 27, 2018, at 11:36 AM, Luke Gorrie <luke@snabb.co> wrote:

... Some comments and questions if I may:

The "+" button to quickly maximize a panel is fantastic. I am often looking at complex visualizations that should really be full-screen and it was always too much trouble to "drag" them to full screen and back.

Is the Spotter still a part of GToolkit? If not then what replaces it? (I can see that it is present in the image but Shift-Return doesn't seem to invoke it when the GTInspector window has focus.)

Is it still possible to pan left-right between "miller columns"? I see the squares at the top representing panes but clicking and dragging them doesn't seem to do anything.

How come a double-click is now needed to inspect an object? Is single-click going to have a new function?

Once more - great work you guys are doing !

On Thu, 27 Dec 2018 at 11:06, Luke Gorrie <luke@snabb.co> wrote: Hi Doru,

Thank you very much for the detailed explanation.

I have spent some time with the alpha now. I think it is absolutely fantastic!

I love the new narrative style of the UI. This ties everything together beautifully and makes it easy to explore. That's really what I am lacking in my application. Currently it simply opens to a blank quasi-playground and it is not obvious what to type or how to get started. I started writing a separate HTML manual but I don't think that's the right medium -- much better with something interactive in the image like the Documenter.

Just clicking around everything seemed to work basically smoothly for me. Maybe it's already time for me to port over to the new GT? Or what do you think the most likely obstacles would be in transitioning to this alpha version?

Currently my custom inspector extensions are mostly based on Roassal and List/Tree/Table views. I also have one or two Glamour browsers. Is that all still there in one form or another?

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