Hi,

let�s think positive.�

the GTDebugger is a step forward� it allow a lot of better interactions and of course, it needs some iterations to make it appealing to everybody.�

For instance, I took me 2� to tweak the debugger presentation and to get this:�

(I changed all available� is a trivial task)

and like IMO feels a lot better� and I think is a good compromise between the old and the new.�

Reasons to suggest this approach:�

- it keeps old approach who(I think) was good (I can see the stack, and the flow feels natural from top to down)

- it preserves �the important� (the code) as central.

- it gives space for adding columns (like the bytecode).�

Now� I can understand you want icons with text, and that can be hacked too��

So� can we have an agreement?

Esteban

ps: btw� using GT with Fast Table we can also avoid those annoying paginated lists too

On 09 Jan 2016, at 08:53, stepharo <stepharo@free.fr> wrote:

Thanks for your testimony.

I'm not against GTDebugger per se. I believe that we should have better tools
but we should take time for building better tools (even if this is two years that moosers use or not this new debugger).
I would appreciate a process where users can give real feedback and we can simplify/shape our tools nicely.

Now for the mooc I will not present GTDebugger. So students will not use Pharo 50

Stef

Le 08/01/2016 21:22, stepharo a �crit :

I'm sorry but this debugger should not be the default one.
MONDAY we are filming our mooc and we have to explain the debugger and
personally I do not see the gain:
����- It looks a lot more complex to me and I do not want to have to
redo all the screenshots
����of our lecture.
����- Just that I have to learn the meaning of small icons.
����- Why do we need a special pane for the evaluator
����- Why there is a type column.
����- Sorry but I'm not convinced about the moldable aspect behind the
story (no need to argue I know it)

I would like to avoid to be forced to use not the latest version of
Pharo for the mooc.

Such changes are arriving far too late in the release. We do not change
the debugger itself the day of code freeze.

We decided that the GTDebugger can be included but to me it never meant
that it should be the default one.
I think that experts can choose the debugger they want. The newbies don't.

Stef

IMO the old debugger is way more intuitive.
When I used the debugger of Eclipse for java I was lost. When I used
Spec debugger I thought "Oh, this is not so hard in fact". And I lose
the feeling with GTDebugger. And the debugger is one of the main source
of interest for newbies.

Maybe we could have a button on the spec Debugger "Switch to GTDebugger"?