On Thu, 17 Jan 2019 at 17:20, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,

Yes, when we had the CMake files, I used to generate an Xcode project to work on macOS.��
This was very good for work/debug.��

On 17 Jan 2019, at 03:21, Ben Coman via Pharo-dev <pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org> wrote:


From: Ben Coman <btc@openinworld.com>
Subject: CMake
Date: 17 January 2019 at 03:21:18 CET
To: Pharo Development List <pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org>, Squeak Virtual Machine Development Discussion <vm-dev@lists.squeakfoundation.org>


On Thu, 17 Jan 2019 at 06:17, Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda@gmail.com> wrote:
�� �� �� �� - About CMake, you may be right that makefile is better than CMake but a part of the world is using
�� �� �� �� CMake and the net result is that we lost our effort and infrastructure just to follow you. Ronie uses CMake.��
�� �� �� �� Igor which I consider as a talented developer used CMake because he thought it was the best tool
�� �� �� �� he should use.

Yes, and I disagree about the way that they use it, and for good reason.�� I have defended my use of Makefiles for a long time, for objective reasons.��

These reasons may be technically correct, but in terms of *community* consider it similar to premature optimization.
For yourself, the priority is a faster build.�� Others may prioritize a faster coding workflow using an IDE like Visual Studio.
Indeed, back when I trialed building minheadless on Windows a *primary* consideration was that it looked easy to��
use Visual Studio because minheadless had a CMake build.�� That led to me contributing a couple of small fixes for win64,
but without the enticement of CMake I might never have opened that box.�� ��

Consider then the possibility that a portion of our Windows using community remains untapped��
because their skill set is Visual Studio and they don't see an easy path to using it with plain makefiles**.
So it depends on what is better for the *community* to optimize for:
* faster build-time for incumbents (important because thats where the majority of contributions come from)�� ��
* broader community involvement with a workflow accelerating IDE (important because growing the vm community is important, from which additional core devs may arise)��

** I do understand that plain makefiles can be used with VS, but I'm not clear on the setup and��
unsure if all the fancy intellisense tools work.

I have also proposed good ways for using CMake (to derive a platform-specific header file defining available platform-specific features).��

I presume its the additional multi-build-system features that people want CMake for, not just the using it in name only.
I can't remember the trade-off between Automake-configure and CMake-configure.�� Make using CMake-configure
would make it easier to co-ordinate parallel CMake and GnuMake systems.�� I think I've noticed several large
code-bases providing both (but I'd have to check)
��

But my objection to Igor's process was that he generated sources on each build.��

��
And my objections to Ronie's use of CMake for the minheadless build are that a) it is slow and

I'd like to quantify that.����
@esteban, I remember you converted minheadless from CMake to Gnumake, but I'm not sure if I've got that right.
Can both be run off the current HEAD for minheadless?�� Or I could compare HEAD with a previous commit that had CMake.��

I do not understand you question :)
What is now in head should be the result of my(our, with Ronie) work.

When Ronnie first announced minheadless it was pure Cmake.
I thought subsequently added Gnumake files to align with the current build system,
but I wasn't clear if the CMake build was still working, so a timing comparison could be done between them.

cheers -ben