On 28 July 2015 at 22:27, Thierry Goubier <thierry.goubier@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Igor,

Le 28/07/2015 18:35, Igor Stasenko a ��crit :

On 27 July 2015 at 18:31, Thierry Goubier <thierry.goubier@gmail.com
<mailto:thierry.goubier@gmail.com>> wrote:

�� Le 27/07/2015 15:42, Igor Stasenko a ��crit :

�� Nothing here is about things to fix,
�� but rather about how impossible to debug event handling in
�� system that
�� runs and relies on very same events..

�� Esay Igor, just use a code event tracer as for example Jejak, and
�� all you describe below won't happen. Or an event logger, or
�� metalinks, or anything.

�� I don't understand. You have the tools, why don't you use them?

Perhaps because i unaware of them?
And while i agree that using robust tools would help, i don't see how
tools can help with "unkilling" an image which you just killed by own
hand because of mistake you made :)

That one is hard to recover from. We can only trace (and use an external logging tool), or remote exception/debugging capacity.

Yeah, anyways that's orthogonal to event tracing. One tools for this, another for that.. Sure tools are handy, and i am not opposed to use them if it could save my time and effort.
��

About Jejak, i only found this:
http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/pipermail/pharo-project/2012-July/067679.html

The current version is hosted on github, at http://github.com/ThierryGoubier/Jejak

Where i can read bout it? It sounds very useful indeed.

There is no real paper on it; I can send you the technical report I wrote on it in 2007 at UBO, but it focuses more on how it was implemented (especially optimised) for VisualWorks.

This time i remember Stef's words: if it has no docs it doesn't exists.

He said this about things i do, and not caring documenting it well.

But same applies to situation when i want to use something, isn't? See, i would happily use anything that could help me in my adventure, unless it will means delving into separate adventure of 'discover by yourself and do some (re)search in code about how this or that great tool works and how to use it'.

That's the answer to your original question, why me (or other people) don't using a great tools lying and waiting for them.

Nobody cares about writing docs (including myself), that's why i don't dare asking people why they not using them. Because i know the answer :)

Thierry

Best regards,
Igor Stasenko.