Hi, [Pharo 10 on Mac Monterey] Due to the multi-process nature of Bonjour that I'm attempting to interface to, I am crashing the system ALOT as it disappears down a black hole and I try to figure out the cause. However, I've noticed that most of the time when I restart Pharo it is unresponsive to clicks and I have to relaunch Pharo AGAIN! Argh....! The mouse moves but no one is at home. Right click brings up menus, but they don't respond. As I move the mouse, list items are highlighted. As this is a completely new OS process, I'm wondering what is causing this behaviour? Has anyone else experienced this, or have an explanation? Cheers, Stewart

Pharo 10 on Mac Monterey works fine for me. > On Apr 27, 2022, at 5:43 PM, Stewart MacLean <stewart@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > > Hi, > > [Pharo 10 on Mac Monterey] > > Due to the multi-process nature of Bonjour that I'm attempting to interface to, I am crashing the system ALOT as it disappears down a black hole and I try to figure out the cause. > > However, I've noticed that most of the time when I restart Pharo it is unresponsive to clicks and I have to relaunch Pharo AGAIN! Argh....! > > The mouse moves but no one is at home. Right click brings up menus, but they don't respond. > > As I move the mouse, list items are highlighted. > > As this is a completely new OS process, I'm wondering what is causing this behaviour? > > Has anyone else experienced this, or have an explanation? > > Cheers, > > Stewart

Try switching focus to another app on your Mac (e.g. Finder or web browser), then back to Pharo On Wed, Apr 27, 2022 at 8:44 PM Stewart MacLean <stewart@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > Hi, > > [Pharo 10 on Mac Monterey] > > Due to the multi-process nature of Bonjour that I'm attempting to > interface to, I am crashing the system ALOT as it disappears down a black > hole and I try to figure out the cause. > > However, I've noticed that most of the time when I restart Pharo it is > unresponsive to clicks and I have to relaunch Pharo AGAIN! Argh....! > > The mouse moves but no one is at home. Right click brings up menus, but > they don't respond. > > As I move the mouse, list items are highlighted. > > As this is a completely new OS process, I'm wondering what is causing this > behaviour? > > Has anyone else experienced this, or have an explanation? > > Cheers, > > Stewart >

I've got it too with P9 when I leave an image open for a while. I becomes unresponsive and I have to kill it from the Mac OS "force quit" popup. Hppened to me with the Pharo launcher too. Noury On Apr 28 2022, at 3:47 am, Yanni Chiu <yannix7db@gmail.com> wrote: > Try switching focus to another app on your Mac (e.g. Finder or web browser), then back to Pharo > > On Wed, Apr 27, 2022 at 8:44 PM Stewart MacLean <stewart@xtra.co.nz (mailto:stewart@xtra.co.nz)> wrote: > > Hi, > > > > [Pharo 10 on Mac Monterey] > > > > Due to the multi-process nature of Bonjour that I'm attempting to interface to, I am crashing the system ALOT as it disappears down a black hole and I try to figure out the cause. > > > > However, I've noticed that most of the time when I restart Pharo it is unresponsive to clicks and I have to relaunch Pharo AGAIN! Argh....! > > > > The mouse moves but no one is at home. Right click brings up menus, but they don't respond. > > > > As I move the mouse, list items are highlighted. > > > > As this is a completely new OS process, I'm wondering what is causing this behaviour? > > > > Has anyone else experienced this, or have an explanation? > > > > Cheers, > > > > Stewart

Thanks all for your suggestions/replies. Nothing fixes it for now. I accept that due to the single threaded nature of the UI that there will be glitches occasionally, and when you are using low level interfaces. The weird thing is this happens after restarting, when everything should be pristine! Cheers, Stewart On Thu, Apr 28, 2022 at 9:41 PM Noury Bouraqadi <bouraqadi@gmail.com> wrote: > I've got it too with P9 when I leave an image open for a while. I becomes > unresponsive and I have to kill it from the Mac OS "force quit" popup. > Hppened to me with the Pharo launcher too. > > > Noury > On Apr 28 2022, at 3:47 am, Yanni Chiu <yannix7db@gmail.com> wrote: > > Try switching focus to another app on your Mac (e.g. Finder or web > browser), then back to Pharo > > On Wed, Apr 27, 2022 at 8:44 PM Stewart MacLean <stewart@xtra.co.nz> > wrote: > > Hi, > > [Pharo 10 on Mac Monterey] > > Due to the multi-process nature of Bonjour that I'm attempting to > interface to, I am crashing the system ALOT as it disappears down a black > hole and I try to figure out the cause. > > However, I've noticed that most of the time when I restart Pharo it is > unresponsive to clicks and I have to relaunch Pharo AGAIN! Argh....! > > The mouse moves but no one is at home. Right click brings up menus, but > they don't respond. > > As I move the mouse, list items are highlighted. > > As this is a completely new OS process, I'm wondering what is causing this > behaviour? > > Has anyone else experienced this, or have an explanation? > > Cheers, > > Stewart > >

FWIW I've seen similar issues with P9 and P10 in my simple project - which has nothing fancy happening with threads or processes . Typically the system would sometimes freeze for about 20 minutes and then resolve by itself. Days of trying workarounds finally revealed the Spec2 layout calculations were very very busy. Perhaps the geometry calculations aren't readily converging? Changing the initial window size seemed to magically sidestep the problem. Also slightly changing some values for #add:height: #add:widget: constraints in the layouts seemed to avoid the problem too. Finicky indeed... I also occassionally see the P9 and P10 environment freeze if left unattended too long. No idea why. Sometimes a presenter won't display properly unless and until I click in another window. No idea why. SpTablePresenters often paint with column alignment problems - you need to click the table - or reset with #items: to get a neatly aligned result... Coping with these behaviours can be incredibly time consuming... I wonder how many people are seeing similar quirky behaviours...? On Fri, 29 Apr 2022, 3:50 am Stewart MacLean, <stewart@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > Thanks all for your suggestions/replies. > > Nothing fixes it for now. I accept that due to the single threaded nature > of the UI that there will be glitches occasionally, and when you are using > low level interfaces. > > The weird thing is this happens after restarting, when everything should > be pristine! > > Cheers, > > Stewart > > On Thu, Apr 28, 2022 at 9:41 PM Noury Bouraqadi <bouraqadi@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> I've got it too with P9 when I leave an image open for a while. I becomes >> unresponsive and I have to kill it from the Mac OS "force quit" popup. >> Hppened to me with the Pharo launcher too. >> >> >> Noury >> On Apr 28 2022, at 3:47 am, Yanni Chiu <yannix7db@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> Try switching focus to another app on your Mac (e.g. Finder or web >> browser), then back to Pharo >> >> On Wed, Apr 27, 2022 at 8:44 PM Stewart MacLean <stewart@xtra.co.nz> >> wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> [Pharo 10 on Mac Monterey] >> >> Due to the multi-process nature of Bonjour that I'm attempting to >> interface to, I am crashing the system ALOT as it disappears down a black >> hole and I try to figure out the cause. >> >> However, I've noticed that most of the time when I restart Pharo it is >> unresponsive to clicks and I have to relaunch Pharo AGAIN! Argh....! >> >> The mouse moves but no one is at home. Right click brings up menus, but >> they don't respond. >> >> As I move the mouse, list items are highlighted. >> >> As this is a completely new OS process, I'm wondering what is causing >> this behaviour? >> >> Has anyone else experienced this, or have an explanation? >> >> Cheers, >> >> Stewart >> >>

Hi Yanni, Actually, your solution does work! I just tried clicking on the desktop, but as you said you need to click on another application. Very strange - it seems to happen more frequently after a crash, but I have noticed it happening on normal startup. Clicking on another app must "free up the log jam"... somehow... Cheers, Stewart On Fri, Apr 29, 2022 at 7:49 AM Stewart MacLean <stewart@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > Thanks all for your suggestions/replies. > > Nothing fixes it for now. I accept that due to the single threaded nature > of the UI that there will be glitches occasionally, and when you are using > low level interfaces. > > The weird thing is this happens after restarting, when everything should > be pristine! > > Cheers, > > Stewart > > On Thu, Apr 28, 2022 at 9:41 PM Noury Bouraqadi <bouraqadi@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> I've got it too with P9 when I leave an image open for a while. I becomes >> unresponsive and I have to kill it from the Mac OS "force quit" popup. >> Hppened to me with the Pharo launcher too. >> >> >> Noury >> On Apr 28 2022, at 3:47 am, Yanni Chiu <yannix7db@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> Try switching focus to another app on your Mac (e.g. Finder or web >> browser), then back to Pharo >> >> On Wed, Apr 27, 2022 at 8:44 PM Stewart MacLean <stewart@xtra.co.nz> >> wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> [Pharo 10 on Mac Monterey] >> >> Due to the multi-process nature of Bonjour that I'm attempting to >> interface to, I am crashing the system ALOT as it disappears down a black >> hole and I try to figure out the cause. >> >> However, I've noticed that most of the time when I restart Pharo it is >> unresponsive to clicks and I have to relaunch Pharo AGAIN! Argh....! >> >> The mouse moves but no one is at home. Right click brings up menus, but >> they don't respond. >> >> As I move the mouse, list items are highlighted. >> >> As this is a completely new OS process, I'm wondering what is causing >> this behaviour? >> >> Has anyone else experienced this, or have an explanation? >> >> Cheers, >> >> Stewart >> >>

There is a discussion on discord, probably three weeks ago, about this problem on latest MacOS. A 20ms delay was added (done in the image, not VM), that improved the chances (but is not a root cause fix). On Sun, May 1, 2022 at 7:34 PM Stewart MacLean <stewart@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > Hi Yanni, > > Actually, your solution does work! I just tried clicking on the desktop, > but as you said you need to click on another application. > > Very strange - it seems to happen more frequently after a crash, but I > have noticed it happening on normal startup. > > Clicking on another app must "free up the log jam"... somehow... > > Cheers, > > Stewart > > > On Fri, Apr 29, 2022 at 7:49 AM Stewart MacLean <stewart@xtra.co.nz> > wrote: > >> Thanks all for your suggestions/replies. >> >> Nothing fixes it for now. I accept that due to the single threaded nature >> of the UI that there will be glitches occasionally, and when you are using >> low level interfaces. >> >> The weird thing is this happens after restarting, when everything should >> be pristine! >> >> Cheers, >> >> Stewart >> >> On Thu, Apr 28, 2022 at 9:41 PM Noury Bouraqadi <bouraqadi@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> I've got it too with P9 when I leave an image open for a while. I >>> becomes unresponsive and I have to kill it from the Mac OS "force quit" >>> popup. >>> Hppened to me with the Pharo launcher too. >>> >>> >>> Noury >>> On Apr 28 2022, at 3:47 am, Yanni Chiu <yannix7db@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> Try switching focus to another app on your Mac (e.g. Finder or web >>> browser), then back to Pharo >>> >>> On Wed, Apr 27, 2022 at 8:44 PM Stewart MacLean <stewart@xtra.co.nz> >>> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> [Pharo 10 on Mac Monterey] >>> >>> Due to the multi-process nature of Bonjour that I'm attempting to >>> interface to, I am crashing the system ALOT as it disappears down a black >>> hole and I try to figure out the cause. >>> >>> However, I've noticed that most of the time when I restart Pharo it is >>> unresponsive to clicks and I have to relaunch Pharo AGAIN! Argh....! >>> >>> The mouse moves but no one is at home. Right click brings up menus, but >>> they don't respond. >>> >>> As I move the mouse, list items are highlighted. >>> >>> As this is a completely new OS process, I'm wondering what is causing >>> this behaviour? >>> >>> Has anyone else experienced this, or have an explanation? >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Stewart >>> >>>