[Pharo-users] An Idea for a minimal self documented begineer friendly pharo image

Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas offray.luna at mutabit.com
Tue May 24 17:15:32 EDT 2016


Hi,

Nice to see this efforts.

I will try to help with my interactive notebook documentation project 
for reproducible/open research and by making visualization for more 
diverse fields, mainly data activism: Panama Papers[1], Political 
discourses[2](should be updated), but also medicines [3]. Also I'm 
making some builders to make more easy specific domain visualizations 
and re-reading, this time deeply, the Agile Visualization book and 
making some comments (i.e [4][5])

[1] http://mutabit.com/offray/blog/en/entry/panama-papers-1
[2] 
http://mutabit.com/offray/static/blog/output/posts/visualizing-politicianspolitical-discourses-on-twitter.html
[3] http://mutabit.com/offray/blog/en/entry/sdv-infomed
[4] 
https://hyp.is/8hHnlCHzEeaIfiOOWSL11w/dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/31543901/AgileVisualization/QuickStart/0101-QuickStart.html
[5] 
https://hyp.is/44eZbiHxEeaykduI7FzoXQ/dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/31543901/AgileVisualization/QuickStart/0101-QuickStart.html

I just tell this because at some point could be an 
intersection/complementarity from the documentation point and helps to 
have this overview of where people is focused and trying to contribute. 
I don't know if there is a place where interested can find where other 
people is doing that is not properly software (or is not integrated yet 
into software)... kind of related project/interest in Pharo.

Cheers,

Offray

On 24/05/16 15:55, Dimitris Chloupis wrote:
> WOW I did not expect so many replies
>
> Its amazing you guys work on a minimal image, since that is the case I 
> will wait for you experts to deliver and instead as you advise me 
> Esteban I will focus my effort on documentation, it looks like I have 
> come to a decision to contribute to pharo in 3 ways
>
> 1) Make a theme for pharo which is very modern flexible and super easy 
> to customise to whatever one wants, a theme to rule them all -> Nireas 
> (its there but needs a lot of improvement)
> 2) Make an API for Blender that will allow pharo developers to take 
> advantage of Blender awesome graphics capabilities -> Ephestos (same 
> as above)
> 3) Contribute to documentation both via pillar and class and method 
> comments. -> Prometheas (same as above)
>
> I am sure the minimal image that you will provide will be perfect for 
> my needs. I dont mind size per se, just system complexity.
>
> I agree again with you Esteban that it would be better to let the 
> maintaince of a minimal image to pharo devs since I think we are all 
> in the same page and instead tackle areas of my expertise like 
> graphics, theme and documentation.
>
> I was just thinking how I could help Pharo the best way and I think 
> these 3 projects are more than enough to keep me occupied.
>
> The linked image you posted does not open after I download it and 
> unzip it. Does it require a special VM or is it something else ?
>
> On Tue, May 24, 2016 at 5:28 PM Thierry Goubier 
> <thierry.goubier at gmail.com <mailto:thierry.goubier at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>     2016-05-24 16:18 GMT+02:00 Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm at gmail.com
>     <mailto:estebanlm at gmail.com>>:
>
>
>>         On 24 May 2016, at 16:11, Thierry Goubier
>>         <thierry.goubier at gmail.com
>>         <mailto:thierry.goubier at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>         2016-05-24 15:18 GMT+02:00 Dimitris Chloupis
>>         <kilon.alios at gmail.com <mailto:kilon.alios at gmail.com>>:
>>
>>             Well technically the python part works fine, BUT I also
>>             always wanted it to be friendly to begineers . So nope ,
>>             its same project. And you are correct its still focused
>>             in coding 3d graphics but I came to realisation that if I
>>             want some people to use it, obviously i dont expect the
>>             massive majority to give up the comforts of python but
>>             for those that are curious I have to provide an
>>             enviroment thats is even easier to code in than python is
>>             currently for Blender.
>>
>>             My goal is to provide a development enviroment for
>>             Blender addons that is simple, and easy to use and learn.
>>
>>             So providing a minimal pharo image that is self
>>             documented has always being a dream for Ephestos.
>>
>>             By the way whats the news on the matter of modular pharo
>>             image ? Is there any work done to provide a minimal pharo
>>             image ?
>>
>>
>>         There is a minimal image, which is I think usable as-is,
>>         except that what you want is something in between the minimal
>>         image (no gui, no tools) and a full image, and that is a bit
>>         complex to set-up.
>>
>>         I started some work on doing that with Pharo4 (put a place
>>         with baselines I could use to load the HEAD of the Pharo main
>>         repository and load the right packages), but Pharo5 changed
>>         the way external projects are included, and my approach
>>         wasn't good anymore.
>>
>>         I think the overall Pharo organisation could benefit from
>>         such an effort; it would exercise all the planned mechanisms
>>         for the modular image, in maybe an easier way than a modular
>>         full image, and with someone motivated to debug and maintain
>>         the process: you!
>
>         honestly, I wouldn’t.
>         working in a parallel image is too much work (believe me, I
>         know something about keeping an image going).
>
>
>     Well, I am technically working in a parallel image for the past
>     ... 3 years ? So, no, as long as you handle a changing minimal
>     image and a well mastered set of slow changing packages over it,
>     it is doable.
>
>     The base Pharo isn't changing much. As long as you don't use what
>     is changing a lot, then this is doable. Maintaining changes all
>     over all the fast moving packages that are in the full Pharo, then
>     I agree with you, Esteban.
>
>         Pavel and Christophe are working on the bootstrap process who
>         should be working in one-two months, with that, building
>         custom images will be finally a reality…from there you might
>         want to give it a try.
>
>
>     This, given the timeframe, is both an excellent suggestion and
>     good to know :)
>
>         But I would better invest on document (something that you have
>         been doing very well and I’m very thankful for that) than in
>         keeping alive what is, in fact, a fork.
>
>
>     Racing to document all the fast moving packages in Pharo can
>     really be a challenge, still.
>
>     Thierry
>
>         cheers,
>         Esteban
>
>>
>>         Thierry
>>
>>
>>
>>             I would hate to replicate what is already done.
>>
>>             On Tue, May 24, 2016 at 3:59 PM Ben Coman
>>             <btc at openinworld.com <mailto:btc at openinworld.com>> wrote:
>>
>>                 On Tue, May 24, 2016 at 7:01 PM, Dimitris Chloupis
>>                 <kilon.alios at gmail.com
>>                 <mailto:kilon.alios at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>                 > So I was reading the complains from Sven and got
>>                 Inspiration from Torsten
>>                 > Pharo image and CUIs and made me wonder what if we
>>                 had an image which has
>>                 > the least amount of libraries and every library
>>                 inside it is full commented
>>                 > in class, package and method and even has tutorial
>>                 using inside help tool.
>>                 >
>>                 > So I think I will give this project a try. I know
>>                 there is a plan to make
>>                 > pharo image more modular, but modularity does not
>>                 equal minimalism ,
>>                 > simplicity and ease of use.
>>                 >
>>                 > I think I will follow the CUIs example and do the
>>                 development via Github.
>>                 >
>>                 > But I am open to ideas and suggestions.
>>                 >
>>                 > My intention is to remove the excess fat, to make
>>                 Pharo prettier (improve
>>                 > theme support and make available several themes )
>>                 and to have everything
>>                 > commented and self documented.
>>                 >
>>                 > Obviously this will be a long term project and in
>>                 no way a walk in the park
>>                 > but I was looking for a nice project to name
>>                 "Ephestos" :D seem as good as
>>                 > any
>>
>>                 Did this project not pane out?...
>>                 https://pharoweekly.wordpress.com/2014/07/16/ephestos-using-and-coding-blender-from-inside-pharo/
>>
>>                 Seems you're quite attached to that name :)
>>                 but is there a minor chance of confusion?
>>
>>                 cheers -ben
>>
>>
>

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