[Pharo-dev] a Pharo talk from a ruby conference

Esteban Lorenzano estebanlm at gmail.com
Tue Apr 29 03:17:00 EDT 2014


On 29 Apr 2014, at 02:24, Sean P. DeNigris <sean at clipperadams.com> wrote:

> Tudor Girba-2 wrote
>> There is a point of view from which one could say that
>> Pharo is Smalltalk by seeing Smalltalk as a movement, rather than specific
>> implementation. Unfortunately, everyone else thinks of Smalltalk as a
>> specific language, or set of languages with specific environments that
>> typically look old enough to not be relevant anymore.
> 
> Yes! This is a tower of babel argument.
> For almost every programmer alive, Smaltalk = Smalltalk 80 -> Pharo is
> Smalltalk-inspired
> For us, Smaltalk = "experimental Dynabook software that bootstraps itself
> (ideally every 4 years)" -> Pharo is Smalltalk 109.
> 
> So it's a question of who you're marketing to. Since we're marketing to
> non-Smalltalkers (quite wise since 16% market penetration is the tipping
> point [1], and we're not there yet), clearly "Pharo is Smalltalk-inspired"
> is the thing to say. It's not any more or less true than the latter, just
> more useful in its context.
> 
> [1] http://www.ted.com/talks/simon_sinek_how_great_leaders_inspire_action

+100

is not about “what is or what is not pharo”, is about how we spread it. 
all of us know that pharo is a smalltalk, but “us” is the 600 people of this list. 
there is a world outside. And I even would say: a brave world (yet not so new). 

So the question is how we reach them (or at least more of them). 
You are losing time arguing something that does not have any sense because is clear (for us) what pharo is. 
That’s not the discussion. 
Not at all. 

This is a true story:

(eve-online chat, the more nerd of the games around, aprox. 25% of their players are programmers or systems-related)

X>So, what do you do?
me>I’m a programmer
X>yes, me too… but what do you do?
me>Pharo, a kind of Smalltalk
X>What?
me>a Smalltalk
X>Is not that an old long time dead language? how is possible to work on it?
me> [LONG EXPLANATION]
X>I never knew anyone who programs in that. I do games, so I program in C++…
me>but you know that *this* game is made in Python, isn’t?
X>yes, but Python is modern, even if not as powerful as C++
me>plop 

And like that, it happened several times. 
So… until someone demonstrate that the majority of the programming community in the world does not have a pre-concept around Smalltalk, I sustain that we need to present our supergreat environment in better ways that just step there saying “look the magnificent smalltalk”!
Btw… Gilad did same thing with newspeak: He said “is in the tradition of” with is just another way of saying “is smalltalk/self-inspired”. And another btw: I do agree with Gilad: Newspeak is not Smalltalk (same as Self is not)… They share a tradition, but if we can say that Newspeak and Self are “Smalltalks” we need to say that Java and C# are “C plus pluses”.

cheers, 
Esteban 

> 
> 
> 
> -----
> Cheers,
> Sean
> --
> View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/a-Pharo-talk-from-a-ruby-conference-tp4756805p4756891.html
> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Developers mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> 





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