[Pharo-project] Interesting post about Smalltalk and the effect of success (sorry for those who already saw this on Squeak Dev)

Simon Kirk simon at pinesoft.co.uk
Sun Sep 21 05:29:21 EDT 2008


Hi Stef

I'm interested why you think this blog would scare people from  
Smalltalk? As it happens though, it's obviously aimed purely at  
Smalltalkers: It's difficult to start such a discussion without  
letting it out into the world for people to see, I say.

I'm actually all for open debate. Whether I agree or disagree with the  
blog itself, I say don't hide such talk: if our community and the  
language and tools are strong enough they will survive in spite of  
such debate, or perhaps even because of it.

Finally: is it always more difficult to build than to clean? I think  
it's easier to build crap than to clean: building something good and  
*keeping it that way* is the really difficult part. Squeak is a  
perfect case in point: so many good ideas, but buried in mounds of  
cruft that this effort (Pharo) is trying to strip away. Once something  
has become crufty, it is really, really hard to clean up.

Cheers,
Simon

ps.
Bob Martin proposed adding a fifth line to the Agile Manifesto:  
"Craftsmanship over Crap" (ie, favouring the former over the latter).  
I couldn't agree more, it's a way of thinking I try to apply all the  
time.

On 20 Sep 2008, at 21:14, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:

> I think that this is not like that that he will really bring  
> smalltalk back.
> Concertation is equals to death. Have a look at Squeak.
>
> Stef
>
> PS: a good friend of mine once told me: "do not shit where you eat"  
> and I keep that in mind
> even when cleaning squeak. I know that this more difficult to build  
> things than to clean them.
> Still I would not let this blog out there because it will not  
> produce anything positive, just scared
> more people from Smalltalk.
>
>> Hi all - as I said in my subject, I've already posted this on  
>> Squeak-Dev, but I thought those on here who don't subscribe to that  
>> list might be interested, too:
>>
>> http://www.robvens.nl/en/blog/The-Smalltalk-Trap.html
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Simon
>>
>>
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